Hive 2 is coming!

[carrieres]

Thanks you Tek, i knew that you will be surprised by my question, but i try to imagine what can be done with wavetable synthesis, wavesequencing a waveform composed of waveform or granular synthesis.
i am still in love with Ultran even if i am not working with it anymore

The best Wavesequencing synth I've ever used was Wusikstation 7. It allowed larger wave files instead of just single cycle waves.

Some of the sounds I got out of it were amazing but I don't even have it installed anymore.

you are right, i loved it too, i even bought a wavetable generator called enigma

[Teksonik]

Dune 3 has a WT Editor that I am able to use. Hive has .uhm scripts which I am not able to use since I'm not a math geek and I don't want to go there.

Of course you can use the Uhm scripts... just select one and use it

Ok Ok I meant I can't create my own Wavetables with scripting......

Anyway Formulas and Scripting just seem like the domain of math geeks to me. I have no math talent and can barely count to 21 unless I'm naked......

[carrieres]

So is anyone willing to share some of those Hive Wavetables created by scripting ? I'd love to hear them in action. If you'll post some free wavtables I'll post some free patches made with them while we wait not so patiently for Hive 2.

look for cytospur post in this thread :
viewtopic.php?p=7372421#p7372421

[Teksonik]

you are right, i loved it too, i even bought a wavetable generator called enigma

Such a shame as WS was one of the most underrated synths ever to hit the market in my opinion. I don't have anything currently installed that can make the sounds it could.

I'd love to see a developer with the financial and emotional stability of U-HE for example to create something like it. I'd much rather see that that yet another virtual analog.

[Ploki]

frankly i only made wavetables from samples so far.

[Teksonik]

So is anyone willing to share some of those Hive Wavetables created by scripting ? I'd love to hear them in action. If you'll post some free wavtables I'll post some free patches made with them while we wait not so patiently for Hive 2.

look for cytospur post in this thread :
viewtopic.php?p=7372421#p7372421

I see code but no WTs. I was more addressing the request to those who have posted the virtues of scripting here in recent posts. I just want to hear what they come up with and see what kind of patches I could do with them.

But when I see a script like the one Cytospur created....

Info "Z-plane filters\nBy Mark Holt\n"
NumFrames=256
Seed=1111111
Wave target=aux1 "2*phase*pi"
Wave target=aux2 "sin(1*aux1+3*sin(3*aux1)/(1-0.9*cos(1*aux1)))+0.5*bandpass(rands,0.15,0.5)"
Wave start=0 end=63 "aux2"
Envelope curve=logarithmic L0=0 T1=0.02 L1=2 T2=0.1 L2=2 T3=0.13 L3=0.25 T4=0.5 L4=0
Spectrum "x*env((phase)^(table+1))^0.5"
Wave start=64 end=127 "aux2"
Envelope curve=exponential L0=0 T1=0.01 L1=12 T2=0.01 L2=-1 T3=0.096 L3=2 T4=0.2 L4=-1 T5=0.7 L5=0
Spectrum "x*env((phase)^(1-table))"
Wave start=128 end=191 "aux2"
Envelope curve=linear L0=0 T1=0 L1=-0.5 T2=0.27 L2=2 T3=0.08 L3=1 T4=0.4 L4=2 T5=0.25 L5=0
Spectrum "x*env((phase)^(table+1))^3"
Wave start=192 end=255 "aux2"
Envelope curve=logarithmic L0=0 T1=0 L1=0.1 T2=0.54 L2=-2 T3=0.1 L3=1 T4=0.2 L4=-2 T5=0.01 L5=0.25
Spectrum "x*env((phase)^(1-table))"
Spectrum lowest=0 highest=0 "0"

Normalize Metric=peak Base=Each

My tiny brain certainly wants to argue that this is making Hive "too complicated"......

[Urs]

Anyway I was originally commenting on the dichotomy of "I don't want to make Hive complicated" while adding scripting which is ultimately more complicated than a GUI editor at least to me. It just seems like a contradiction in my mind.

There's a bit more to it than that.

I believe that good sounding, sweepable wavetables are excessively hard and tedious to create with any of those built-in editors. What works well is editing a small number of waveforms and then have them somehow magically interpolate. The other way to create such sweeps is some kind of sample import. But even of that I have not ever heard any single instance where this would satisfy my strive for the best sound possible. In my opinion, wavetable editors promise something they can't keep. It looks easy enough, but the results disappoint all too often.

Hence we said, if we add Wavetables to Hive, we need to put the burden of creating wavetables to experts. Those who enjoy making wavetables, the probably already have Serum or Dune or Icarus or any number of tools out there. Those who don't have the tools can use a special version of Zebra2 to do it, any IMHO its curve based approach beats anything "wavetable editor" built into any other synth. So we emphasized compatibility and browsing.

But also, because pretty much all visual tools fail at making good wavetables, and because we had promising results with Serum's formula parser, we built the uhm scripting engine. It surely enables people to create their own wavetables, if they wish, and if they are into learning it. It is no necessity though. It first and foremost allowed us to create factory wavetables with absolutely stunning quality.

So yeah, making wavetables an "import only" feature is absolutely in line with Hive being a synth for quick results. Adding a wavetable editor would break Hive. Adding a scripting engine underlines how much we value quality over quantity.

[chk071]

Yeah, i also have to say that, even though i was a supporter of wavetable editors, i find myself to not use them at all. That said, though, i find that many wavetable synths maybe have 2 or 3 % usable wavetables, the rest is... well, schmu. Even with Largo, which i find has the best wavetables on board, i maybe use 3 or 4 of those regularly. The wavetables from the Q are excellent, for example. In Icarus, i didn't find many usable wavetables either. At least not for the sounds i'm making.

[Teksonik]

frankly i only made wavetables from samples so far.

Are you willing to share a couple ? I'd love to hear what the possibilities of scripting can be when pushed.

[PieBerger]

Anyway I was originally commenting on the dichotomy of "I don't want to make Hive complicated" while adding scripting which is ultimately more complicated than a GUI editor at least to me. It just seems like a contradiction in my mind.

This is in relation to the complexity of the UI/day-to-day use of the synth AFAIK. Scripting takes place outside of the synth (where it belongs imo) and as such offers those with an interest in making their own tables the means to do so, without affecting those who don't. I personally have not found any graphical WT editors particularly intuitive/fun to use, certainly not more so than typing lines of code and in the case of Serum, the inclusion of such a comprehensive editor, necessitates a very tabby/clicky UI/UX, that imo is to its detriment. That Hive firmly leaves the creation of wavetables to an outside environment is a huge positive and u-he should be praised for being bold enough to buck current trends/gimmicks, in order to stay true to the synth's core principles and offer something unique in a crowded marketplace. I'm no programmer, nor am I against the idea of a standalone editor even, but personally I would rather see dev time dedicated to Z3 (naturally), Uhbik and additional UHM tutorials/resources instead.

[Teksonik]

It first and foremost allowed us to create factory wavetables with absolutely stunning quality.

Ok if that's the way you want to spin it......

Anyway let's hear some new "stunning quality" wavetables. Really curious to see them in action.

The built in tables are nice but I guess "stunning" is just as subjective as any other term.

[Teksonik]

but personally I would rather see dev time dedicated to Z3 (naturally), Uhbik and additional UHM tutorials/resources instead.

At no point did I ask for or even suggest a WT editor for Hive. I'm simply pointing out that "complicated" is relative.

Anyway script kiddies let's hear some stunning quality Wavetables.......

Right now I'm going to go enjoy both Hive and Dune and I might not even use a Wavetable. They are both capable of creating awesome sounds without ever going near a WT.

Enjoy your day boys.

[Urs]

It first and foremost allowed us to create factory wavetables with absolutely stunning quality.

Ok if that's the way you want to spin it......

Anyway let's hear some new "stunning quality" wavetables. Really curious to see them in action.

The built in tables are nice but I guess "stunning" is just as subjective as any other term.

We're adding a few more for Hive 2.0.

I never said the tables were stunning, most of them a re bread'n'butter - or "nice", as you say. What's stunning is their quality. They are free of any artifacts I'd typically associate with wavetable synthesis.

[MorpherX]

Anyway I was originally commenting on the dichotomy of "I don't want to make Hive complicated" while adding scripting which is ultimately more complicated than a GUI editor at least to me. It just seems like a contradiction in my mind.

But also, because pretty much all visual tools fail at making good wavetables, and because we had promising results with Serum's formula parser, we built the uhm scripting engine. It surely enables people to create their own wavetables, if they wish, and if they are into learning it. It is no necessity though. It first and foremost allowed us to create factory wavetables with absolutely stunning quality.

So yeah, making wavetables an "import only" feature is absolutely in line with Hive being a synth for quick results. Adding a wavetable editor would break Hive. Adding a scripting engine underlines how much we value quality over quantity.

Most people here are musicans and / or composers and not programmers, therefore they don't like to use a virtual music instrument with a programmer language where you have to learn by heart 100 or more expressions and how and where to use it whithin the script.
I also don't like a programmer script in a VSTi because it's not musical and not intuitive.
Thats also the reason why no other company offers this.
The only scripts I use a lot are scripts in Reaper, but I don't program it.

But what would be very usefull in Hive would be a resynthesis function, which could be hidden in the Preference page. Only resynthesis a sample and of course save the result. Thats all.
Could you please add this in an Update ?

[PieBerger]

but personally I would rather see dev time dedicated to Z3 (naturally), Uhbik and additional UHM tutorials/resources instead.

At no point did I ask for or even suggest a WT editor for Hive. I'm simply pointing out that "complicated" is relative.

Sorry, that wasn't my intention, I was just throwing in my opinion on the matter in a general sense, not against anything you may have said (and didn't in this case).