KVR Audio

Tannaliini · Post by **Tannaliini** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:11 am

I heard a conversation where couple of men were discussing about Vst synths & combated to Virus’s sounds. Their main issue seemed to be how VST Wave Table synths can’t create very versatile sounds.

Do you think that is the case? What type of VST synth would be most versatile in sound creation?

I do know that some synths seem to have their own character sound, like if you’re listening this particular synth’s bass, plucks, leads = they all have the similar “sound”.

But then again I think some synths have huge variety of sounds you wouldn’t know are from a same synth - but this just me observation. I’m not a professional or anything.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:22 am

Tannaliini wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:11 am I heard a conversation where couple of men were discussing about Vst synths & combated to Virus’s sounds. Their main issue seemed to be how VST Wave Table synths can’t create very versatile sounds.

Do you think that is the case?

No, not at all. Of course, to be able to say whether or not a instrument can create the sounds you want, you have to know which sounds you want.

Wavetable synths can't do granular stuff, that's for sure. But, whenever I hear sounds made with granular instruments or effects, it sounds more like from the test tube, than something someone really wanted to create.

So, yeah, whenever we're talking about versatility, the first thing I would ask, what is it that you want to do? Even a monophonic analog synth can be very versatile, when you exhaust all the possibilities.

Anyway, with further processing and mangling the sound which comes from whatever instrument, you can do anything you want really. I don't really see any limits there.

cron · Post by **cron** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:30 am

I suspect these observations are based on wavetable synths being popular/overrepresented in EDMish genres, because the the obvious question here is "versatile relative to what?" I actually struggle to think of a synthesis method that's more versatile. The only obvious limitation of wavetable oscillators that springs to mind is the inability to produce inharmonic partials, but that can be compensated for elsewhere in the architecture (eg, ring modulation as found in some VA synths.)

To get more versatile than wavetable, you're probably looking at an complex additive like Harmor. Even though it can do more and has a subtractive-like workflow in places, it has nowhere near the immediacy and ease of use that wavetable brings to the party.

So yeah, I'm a bit confused that people would say "wavetable isn't versatile" when its patently obvious versatility is a huge part of the attraction for me and many folks who use it. I mean the whole point of wavetable synthesis is that it can sound like almost anything with minimal patching/programming required.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:33 am

cron wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:30 am I actually struggle to think of a synthesis method that's more versatile.

Same here.

vurt · Post by **vurt** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:35 am

tools blaming tools...

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:55 am

vurt wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:35 am fools blaming tools...

FTFY

vurt · Post by **vurt** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:56 am

that works too

GRUMP · Post by **GRUMP** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 6:24 am

Some Synths called WT-Synth aren´t really versatile and every Synth labeled WT-Synth is different. Sometimes too different if you ask me. And some Companys allow the User to load, generate, manipulate and export WT and I´d ask what else Versatility shoud be?

Add 8 Layers, numerous Unison Voices, 2 VCF, HQ FX and you have a well known Beast for which I´d gladly delete any other Synth I own

Tannaliini · Post by **Tannaliini** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:08 am

chk071 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:22 am
Tannaliini wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:11 am I heard a conversation where couple of men were discussing about Vst synths & combated to Virus’s sounds. Their main issue seemed to be how VST Wave Table synths can’t create very versatile sounds.

Do you think that is the case?
No, not at all. Of course, to be able to say whether or not a instrument can create the sounds you want, you have to know which sounds you want.

Wavetable synths can't do granular stuff, that's for sure. But, whenever I hear sounds made with granular instruments or effects, it sounds more like from the test tube, than something someone really wanted to create.

So, yeah, whenever we're talking about versatility, the first thing I would ask, what is it that you want to do? Even a monophonic analog synth can be very versatile, when you exhaust all the possibilities.

Anyway, with further processing and mangling the sound which comes from whatever instrument, you can do anything you want really. I don't really see any limits there.

Granular is a bit like using samples - but in granular the sample is in very small parts and those small parts create the sound? And this granular thing is starting to be quite popular today if I'm correct?

foosnark · Post by **foosnark** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:27 pm

There's absolutely no reason you can't use wavetables as the source for granular synthesis. Or subtractive, or FM or all sorts of other things.

Teksonik · Post by **Teksonik** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:37 pm

Tannaliini wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:11 am What type of VST synth would be most versatile in sound creation?

One that allows full sample import as opposed to Wavetables made up of short duration waveforms.

Samples open up the entire world of sound......

Teksonik · Post by **Teksonik** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:51 pm

foosnark wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:27 pm There's absolutely no reason you can't use wavetables as the source for granular synthesis. Or subtractive, or FM or all sorts of other things.

I just happened to run across this file the other day I created in 2015 using Samples and the granular functions of Alchemy.

Not a terribly useful sound unless you're doing the incidentals for a Horror Film but it still gives me the creeps......

https://sites.google.com/site/teksonik/ ... ects=0&d=1

File isn't playing here you might have to open the link in a new tab.

aMUSEd · Post by **aMUSEd** » Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:45 pm

Tannaliini wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:11 am I heard a conversation where couple of men were discussing about Vst synths & combated to Virus’s sounds. Their main issue seemed to be how VST Wave Table synths can’t create very versatile sounds.

The Virus Ti has wavetable oscs.

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:33 am

Teksonik wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:37 pm
Tannaliini wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:11 am What type of VST synth would be most versatile in sound creation?
One that allows full sample import as opposed to Wavetables made up of short duration waveforms.

Samples open up the entire world of sound......

I disagree. I'd say one like Falcon, who allows to use samples (I agree with you on that), but also has other very important synthesis techniques available, like FM, additive, Physical Modeling, etc.

But if I had to choose just ONE synthesis technique, I would choose a sampling synth, for sure.

MMaarrkk · Post by **MMaarrkk** » Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:37 am

Tannaliini wrote: ↑Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:11 am Their main issue seemed to be how VST Wave Table synths can’t create very versatile sounds.

I think this has already been mentioned, but I believe it's less a fault of the wavetables and the artists themselves. I have definitely seen some creative and versatile stuff made with wavetables over the years.

Wave tables aren’t versatile?