KVR Audio

thockin · Post by **thockin** » Mon Sep 20, 2004 3:02 am

Disclosure: I'm a long time FL user. I know it pretty much inside out.

Every now and again, I feel the need to see how the other products are doing. The one that I have been watching with some interest is Tracktion. I tried it last year and it was "Not There Yet".

Here's my review as of today:

* Tracktion is good. Stable, good plugin support. It's MIDI functions seem to be superior to FL's. I didn't push the MIDI or audio features.

* Piano-roll doesn't hold a candle to FL's. FL's piano roll is FAR easier to work with.

* Rack filters rock pretty hard. If only FL could split and clone audio and handle true mono signals... FL feels crippled by comparison.

* Editing of everything is just weird - why can't I right-click on stuff and get USEFUL menus?

* Tracktion has a multi-sample sampler.

* Automation is spline based, and is track linear. Nice. FL *really* *really* needs this. Not only can I see the piano-roll and the automation on the same screen, but I can see multiple automation curves, and I can see them across "clips" (like patterns). This would be like FL showing you automation in the playlist, with multiple splines. Again, FL feels crippled without this.

Those are my first impressions on the major diffs. If FL had better automation and the ability to split stereo into 2 monos and to re-route signals, there wouldn't be any major advantage that I can see to Tracktion.

Flipside, if Tracktion had a better piano-roll and a UI that wasn't as dumbed down (right click, dammit!), then it might be a compelling counterpart or even switch.

Tim

Robert Randolph · Post by **Robert Randolph** » Mon Sep 20, 2004 3:11 am

What do you need to right click for?

You realize all your options are readily available at the bottom...

thockin · Post by **thockin** » Mon Sep 20, 2004 3:23 am

When I want to modify a Thing, I really want to right-click it to get what has long been called a "context menu". That is, it has the options that apply in teh context of the thing I clicked. It's just an easier way of working. For me.

For example, I right-click on an automation spline segment, I want a menu about that segment.

when I right-click a MIDI note and select 'delete', I do not want to delet the whole clip. That's just bad UI. Context.

That aside, I'd rather have more real-estate and less stuff on the botton of my screen.

Jaeson Merrill · Post by **Jaeson Merrill** » Mon Sep 20, 2004 3:28 am

i found tracktion to be rather clumsy actually, and unorganized.. just not my workflow is all..

i like more focused interfaces, but others like it all right there.. nothing wrong with that... i got rid of it after opening FL again

just not my thing, thats all.

Lunch Money · Post by **Lunch Money** » Mon Sep 20, 2004 3:30 am

I think you'll find that at the bottom of the screen you'll see everything that you'd see in a context menu. It'd be neat to see you have the option of choosing between that bottom panel and a right-click style menu, though.

Nice review. Honest and objective!

Jason-- it's bizarre what people find to be 'clumsy'. Personally, I can't imagine ANYONE finding it disorganized or clumsy, as to me it's the epitome of -organized- and -intuitive-. I'd think you were talking about another program, except I also know that you're a knowledgable guy.

It's true that some people are more accustomed to using menus for everything, but all arguments about visual organization aside (hey, you're right-- it IS a personal thing), I should mention that Tracktion users tend to use keystrokes a lot. Once you know your keystrokes, you'll find that the visual aspects of the interface (ie. the context window at the bottom of the edit screen) actually become secondary. You can pretty much get by with just your clip and a computer keyboard. And most of them make sense ('i' for setting input marker, 'o' for setting output marker, and '\' {a slash} for cutting {ie. slashing} clips).

Greg

Jaeson Merrill · Post by **Jaeson Merrill** » Mon Sep 20, 2004 3:46 am

Lunch Money wrote: Jason-- it's bizarre what people find to be 'clumsy'. Personally, I can't imagine ANYONE finding it disorganized or clumsy, as to me it's the epitome of -organized- and -intuitive-. I'd think you were talking about another program, except I also know that you're a knowledgable guy.

Greg

yeah, its not personal or anything. I realize tracktion obviously is great, cause so many like it, but as far as I go, its not my flow, maybe i didnt spend enough time with it, or perhaps im already set in my ways hehe..

i do like the idea of having everyting right there, in a sense, but for some reason, to ME it looks like an abstract painting, cool, but not making sense so far...that sounds really bad... lol i hope no one takes offense to that.

dont mean to hi-jack this thread with my own thoughts, perhaps when version 2 gets out (if it ever does lol) i will give it another go, seeing how everyone (well most) praise it here, and i value the opinions of those here very much, although some may not believe it

Jaeson Merrill · Post by **Jaeson Merrill** » Mon Sep 20, 2004 3:49 am

Lunch Money wrote: It's true that some people are more accustomed to using menus for everything, but all arguments about visual organization aside (hey, you're right-- it IS a personal thing), I should mention that Tracktion users tend to use keystrokes a lot. Once you know your keystrokes, you'll find that the visual aspects of the interface (ie. the context window at the bottom of the edit screen) actually become secondary. You can pretty much get by with just your clip and a computer keyboard. And most of them make sense ('i' for setting input marker, 'o' for setting output marker, and '\' {a slash} for cutting {ie. slashing} clips).

Greg

that makes sense actually, cause keystrokes and shortcuts are usually the last thing i start learning...

until just recently i have never even looked at the shortcuts of my host(s) or audio editor.. i can see how valuable that can be. perhaps if i was more in that frame of mind it would be a different tracktion experience.

Caleb · Post by **Caleb** » Mon Sep 20, 2004 9:06 am

It's funny what a unique interface for a music app can do I find.

I think I recall that Traktion was developed with more a Graphics program kind of approach in mind. I "think" I recall that anyway.

I was completely repelled by Traktion's GUI and usability when I first tried it out in probably the same way that graphics programs repel me.

The fact that it sounds like it promotes its keystrokes as an interface reminds me a little of 3D modelling programs which are usually keystroke heavy. They're a cow to learn, but once you get the hang of them your whole workflow speeds up considerably. I know in Blender for example, I avoid drop-down menus like the plague as I find they break the workflow.

So maybe Traktion is one of those programs that you have to familiarise yourself with before you start reaping the rewards.

Don't think it's for me at this stage - but something I'll keep in mind down the track if I become unsatisfied with what I'm using.

Caleb

aMUSEd · Post by **aMUSEd** » Mon Sep 20, 2004 9:22 am

Caleb wrote:It's funny what a unique interface for a music app can do I find.

I think I recall that Traktion was developed with more a Graphics program kind of approach in mind. I "think" I recall that anyway.

Yeah - it reminds me a lot of Lightwave 3D.

Trying Tracktion