Gainmatch - plugin alliance theory

[Dumbquestions]

Not sure if I’m in the “correct” forum subgroup here (please reroute me if that’s the case), but here is a bit of a rant from a beginner mixer, below. Note that I’m aware I’m probably making many mixing decisions (as opposed to mastering) somewhat instinctively at this point—I would like to be at a place where I’m a bit more educated as to forming better mixing habits but I’m not quite there yet. One day after that I’ll hopefully learn some mastering techniques.

Rant Preface: I’m coming from a place of not knowing much about most foundational mixing concepts, as it relates to best practices when handling loudness, gain staging, etc. Though, I’ve watched enough videos and read enough articles (understanding as much as I could) to mix a song or two according to recommended db numbers & limits. With so many opinions out there, it’s admittedly very confusing sometimes choosing what new practices to adopt. Lately every time I mix, I can’t get out of the habit of mixing by ear according to what “sounds good.” Maybe it’s laziness, maybe it just takes practice to gain stage “as I go?” In this realization I started trying to use limiters correctly, and my final bounced waveform shapes kept coming out looking like sausages where everything peaks at 0db. So, without having much of a dynamic range, I obviously still have much to learn there about gain staging, then I found out about autogain.

I know that adding certain plugins can sometimes have a tendency to boost the overall gain when certain effects are applied or when certain eq points are boosted. Because of this I bought the “Gainmatch” plugin, which sits before the first plugin on a track and then also acts as the last plugin on the chain. The second instance automatically adjusts your gain to what it was before the first plugin, and has a quick before&after A/B comparison button, which helps determine if the loudness is what makes the track sound better, vs. the apparent “color” applied by the added plugins.

Most of you are probably like, yeah sure everyone knows that, get to the point.

Well I gainmatched a full mix, switching between each and every PA eq to evaluate the differences, and when the overall gain levels are equal I can’t even hear a difference, flipping between presets and gainmatching each time, then doing the A/B comparison to match the loudness before & after the plugin chain, they end up sounding the exact same with each EQ and preset.

The Oven, for example, albeit a beta plugin (and a saturator, I think?), provided just about nothing to my mix after gainmatching any of the presets. Was looking forward to that one per all the hype but I can’t even hear what it’s doing ehen gainmatched.

I realize I’m among many professionals here, and you are probably cringing as you’re reading this (as you hold the answers in your head), there are undoubtedly a lot of things I probably “should” be doing here (and I’m always open to constructive criticism) but really just trying to figure out if my ear just needs better training, or if I wasted a ton of money on PA products for overcomplicated gain booster plugins with a fancy GUI. Again, I might just be crazy or extremely inexperienced, maybe both, but I keep comparing and hearing no differences with these eq’s activated with gainmatch.
Rant over.

Feedback? Can anyone point out if I’m missing something obvious, dealing with a bit of buyer’s remorse, I want to be more open to learning here as I’m trying to delve deeper into the world of mixing and my skepticism has been messing with me as I acquire more plugins and learn more. It’s tough to trust anyone out there any more when someone pressures you into buying a plugin “on sale” at $49 one week using panic tactics, then it goes on sale the very next week for $30.99.

[imrae]

You should be able to hear some kind of tonal change, especially with EQ. It doesn'y make a lot of sense to me to use presets on an EQ anyway, the settings really depend on what you put in and what you want to achieve.

But I agree that for some of PA's well-regarded "makes everything sound better" plugins like Blackbox and EQ-4 it's likely many users are being fooled by loudness. Good on you for taking out that variable and making more informed choices.

[enroe]

...
I am really just trying to figure out if my ear just needs better training, or if I wasted a ton of money on PA products for overcomplicated gain booster plugins with a fancy GUI. Again, I might just be crazy or extremely inexperienced, maybe both, but I keep comparing and hearing no differences with these eq’s activated with gainmatch.
...

Feedback?
...

I have to smile when I read this.

Maybe - this is a thought I have - you should be clear about what you
really want:

--- a. Mix songs to make them sound good
--- b. Collect plugins with great GUIs

Because a. and b. don't really correlate. When it comes to mixing,
95% of the decisions are based on volume and EQ. It doesn't really
matter which EQ this is done with. And the remaining 5% is
compression issues and a few other effects.

In all areas of our lives, all sorts of market participants are trying to
sell everything. With simple utensils, the buyer can immediately see
whether he needs it and what quality something is: If you buy a cup,
then you probably really need it. And if you see a cup, you can see
at a glance what quality it has and whether it is exactly what you
need.

Unfortunately, that's not the case with VST plugins: Because many
musicians don't know how mixing works, they believe everything the
advertising and marketing experts say. Not being able to judge a
VST plugin at first glance, they get seduced by the GUI and buy all
sorts of things even if they don't need them. It's like in a gray area,
like esotericism and astrology.

My little recommendation would be: First of all, don't buy any more
plugins. And really learn to mix instead. That would bring you a lot.

[Unaspected]

I would suggest to learn more about the practical side of mixing with the stock plugins that come with your DAW and if you personally feel something is lacking, then look elsewhere to solve that issue. If there is no issue to solve, all is good.

[Aiynzahev]

While there is an element to the marketing hype raising expectations in my experience the PA plugins do what they are supposed to do for the most part. I’d like to ask what you’re using for monitoring. Also can we start with a specific plug-in, and try boosting it into more extreme settings until you definitely can hear what it’s doing, just as a test.

[andymcbain]

I'd agree with the comments above. Some processes can be pretty subtle but I would expect to hear *some* obvious differences even when matching gains (and good on you for using this technique early into your mixing journey)

Personally I'd focus on getting your monitoring as good as it possibly can be - be that good monitor speakers and room treatment, or good headphones - or both. Then learn to mix using your DAWs basic EQ, compressor, reverb etc. Once you can properly hear what you're doing, your listening skills will develop more quickly and you could start going down the rabbit hole of third party plugins. Interesting that Black Box was mentioned as I probably use this on every mix at very subtle settings - and the effect only really become apparent once my monitoring was up to scratch. Likewise with Inflator and a few others.

[licasto2]

I would suggest to learn more about the practical side of mixing with the stock plugins that come with your DAW and if you personally feel something is lacking, then look elsewhere to solve that issue. If there is no issue to solve, all is good.

Use stock plugins. This is the #1 thing I advise to my friends when they ask for advice and are starting out. Once you know WHERE and HOW to add EQ and compression you'll know what 3rd party plugin you need and know exactly why you need to spend the money, if any at all.

[Dumbquestions]

Thank you everyone for the thoughtful replies.
I'd say all of your responses have truly helped me by pushing me more towards mastering the tools that are already at my fingertips, rather than rushing out to buy the big guns before I'm ready. Also learning that a little bit really goes a long way in many of these mixing situations.
I'm thinking my next step would be to upgrade my monitoring setup (which is not ideal right now, no speakers, only AKG K44 Perception headphones). Then I can better hear what's going on in these mixes, then once I've grown into learning how to use the stock plugins effectively, I'll start to really know what I'm doing when I make more educated, intentional mixing decisions. Then I can re-evaluate my next steps and go from there.

[Unaspected]

I'm thinking my next step would be to upgrade my monitoring setup (which is not ideal right now, no speakers, only AKG K44 Perception headphones). Then I can better hear what's going on in these mixes, then once I've grown into learning how to use the stock plugins effectively, I'll start to really know what I'm doing when I make more educated, intentional mixing decisions. Then I can re-evaluate my next steps and go from there.

I very much agree with andymcbain's suggestion and this decision: If you can't hear what's going on properly you can't process sound to the best of your abilities. I've always favoured working predominantly with monitor speakers over headphones - but always check the sub end using headphones.

Also read up on what these effects are actually doing by learning how they are doing it. You'll find that EQ and compression as subjects can get quite involved - especially when you include looking at differences between digital and analogue processing. This will all help in making informed decisions.