how to create "undefined" pitch sound

[stefanocps]

Hello, looking for a soft synth that allow me to create a not defined pitch sound
Any suggestion?

[BertKoor]

Most synths have "noise" as an oscillator waveform. Or go crazy with FM...

[stefanocps]

Most synths have "noise" as an oscillator waveform. Or go crazy with FM...

i think the noise oscilaltor is something quite different form what i am searching

[BertKoor]

Can you describe it better? Or post an example?

[Unaspected]

Shepard tone, maybe? Sounds that seem to rise or fall infinitely.

Difficult to guess without an example. Could equally refer to a sound that doesn't conform to common tuning structures.

[vurt]

s and h on a filter?

wibble the pitch wheel?

noise as modulation?

[stefanocps]

this is an example

[lobanov]

...a not defined pitch sound

Contradiction. If a sound has pitch its pitch is defined. Pitch of a sound isn't defined in noise or filtered noise.

Really, you should give us an example. What do you mean? Does it exist?

[stefanocps]

i don't think of noise infact
i talk about sound whose partials are not muliple of fundamental, not harmonic then

[lobanov]

this is an example

This is sort of a "chord". More exactly, this is a sum of many, many pitched sounds. Some of them has a pitch which is slowly changing. In the video you could see pitches as horizontal lines.

You could do it with any synths or samplers. Load a lot of instances and feed to all of them different notes (of different pitches) which don't start simultaneously (you are free to choose them). Lower volume of each synth. You may feed several notes to each synth. Automate volume of each instance, the slowest attack of each sound is important. The secret is in a number of synths and samplers. More is better.

[lobanov]

Imagine a big orchestra. Every player plays his/her own very long note starting at different moments of time. Some of them (when it's possible) play very slow glissandos. This is one of ways we could get such sound.

And really interesting read about implementing it in Max/MSP:
https://www.cnmat.berkeley.edu/sites/de ... gining.pdf

[lobanov]

sorry, double post ))

[stefanocps]

not totally right
These are 4 different track layered
Each track is a sound made out of 128 oscillators
But, those are not harmonaclly in sequence like it normally a sound does
The partials are randomly calcolated by multiplicatinbg thefubdamental by a numer between 0 and 1
So each of these souunds has not a real tonal centre..but it might have an average tonal centre

perhaps undefined pitch is not the correct word in english..it is in my language
The thing is that that sound is not an d, is not an e, is not, an f or a or b...It is somehting not identifyable

This is what makes this music ELECTRONIC music..the one started from stockhausen, not th eone commonly meant for

[lobanov]

In any pitched sound usually there is one fundamental harmonic. Where is it in "Antony"? There is no such harmonic in the spectrogram in the video. Instead of it we see many harmonics that appear and disappear. That's way is more appropriate to tell about summing of several (many) voices. It's similar to additive synthesis but it's not additive synthesis. Voices are significantly separated as they aren't coordinated each to other. "Antony" is more like a weird choir rather than one integral sound or one note. But because of amount of voices and vague attacks and releases this piece may be considered as one integral sound.

And no, it has not been started with electronic music. Look at this (and listen):

[stefanocps]

Good, you are.now saying what i was telling before
Bit don t mix the composing stylèe with the way how sounds are created, as you doing with ligeti