KVR Audio

TheNinthCircle · Post by **TheNinthCircle** » Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:11 am

Looking to buy a music prod pc but i do dabble in virtual machines a fair bit and would like expandability options in the near future. (I usually upgrade to the best of the best every 10 years and has worked out for me so far).
But i'm trying to have a pc that is ideally very power efficient and doesn't heat up the room like crazy.

The plugins i use all the time are Toontrack SD3 and EZ-Bass, Neural DSP, Spectrasonics Keyscape / Omnisphere and hopefully soon some Fabfilter plugins.

Any recommendations and what brings you to the conclusion?

Thanks in advance guys!

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Tue Nov 22, 2022 6:09 am

I love the complete silence and performance of my M1 Mini Mac! Ableton Live performs better than on my Ryzen 5800x! It consumes like how much 40 watts?!
Anyway, it's my ultimate computer and music workstation. I would buy it again and again. No idea about Intel current CPU! It is certainly more powerful than what I have but at what noise, energy and size?!

TheNinthCircle · Post by **TheNinthCircle** » Tue Nov 22, 2022 10:47 am

Hey EnGee, thanks for your input! 40 watts is some sick efficiency! I can't imagine any modern pc being able to manage that hey! Especially size, noise and energy output... almost makes me think i should reconsider now. If you don't mind me asking, what storage are you running in it? Because these vst libraries are pretty hefty in size hey!

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Tue Nov 22, 2022 11:20 am

The storage is mean by Apple

But I purchased the 512GB option with 16GB RAM. I then bought 1 TB external SSD and connected to it! So, I have all downloads, samples ...etc there while just putting the DAW(s) and VST plugins in the main SSD.

It works so far, I have 175 GB free on the main one and about 845GB from the external one! I don't think I would fill it more. In fact I might free some GBs by uninstalling unneeded DAWs. I have Logic Pro with all libraries, Cubase Pro 12 with all + Groove Agent 5 libraries, Studio One v6 with all and Ableton Live 11 Standard with all. So, I might just keep Logic Pro and Ableton Live. That would free about 70GB to 80GB.

I don't have big Instruments though! I use mainly Artutia VC, Tone2 synths, Korg collection + OPsix + Wavestate, some other synths like PhasePlants, Dune3, Massive X ...etc. For Drums I have Addictive Drums (1 Pack) and XO.

seismicfm · Post by **seismicfm** » Tue Nov 22, 2022 5:41 pm

Go with 13th Gen Intel. I haven't seen any specific DAW music production benchmarks except for LAME encoding , but multithreading benchmarks show its a productivity monster even blowing away Ryzen 7000.

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Tue Nov 22, 2022 8:22 pm

If you go the Intel route, then 13th Gen is the obvious choice. You need however the best silent cooler. You also need a reasonably quiet graphic card or one with high quality fan. The other thing is a really good PSU! I would go for 800 watts Gold (not cheapest!) Plus of course a silent PC case (heavy with good material).

Even then, you would hear something and no near to "enjoying the silence" with M1 Mac. Oh, and I think M2 is very near. It might be a little bit more expensive, but sure I would go for that Mac if I don't have already my lovely cute one.

I still use my desktop PC (which I assembled) daily, mostly for work (database and related tasks) and gaming (I have nVidia RTX 3070). But mainly for work as I prefer gaming with my consoles. My music making hobby and internet browsing is on my Mini Mac.

So, in the end it depends on your needs and for what you are using it. Also, how big are your libraries and how big are your projects. Although, M1 based Mac is still very capable and I never could maxed it out with my projects (8 to 16 tracks usually).

anttimaatteri · Post by **anttimaatteri** » Sat Nov 26, 2022 2:36 pm

while certainly go for ryzen. intels 13600, for the budget, or even better 13700 is a very nice cpu.

Jim Roseberry · Post by **Jim Roseberry** » Tue Nov 29, 2022 2:04 pm

I've tested both the 7950x and 13900k extensively.
Have both running next to me.

Fastest DAW CPU currently available is the 13900k.
The 7950x is a very close second.
Both require large AIO cooler.
Air cooling is not sufficient under heavy loads.
I wouldn't use anything less than top-tier 420mm AIO.
That keeps either CPU both cool and quiet.
ie: We're hitting over 40k with Cinebench R23.
Temps are nowhere near 90 degrees C (nowhere close to thermal-throttling)

If you want to stick to air-cooling, I'd recommend the 12700k.
It's much less complex to configure.

DDR5 can also be more complex to configure (especially if your running 128GB).
It's not as simple as setting XMP.

rod_zero · Post by **rod_zero** » Tue Nov 29, 2022 6:57 pm

Just going to share how much performance i get from my i5 12th gen, with Diva which is way more demanding that what you use.

If you are on a desktop I honestly think energy efficiency goes out of the window, what for? it is not like you are running a mining rig.

Now noise is a more real concern but again a DAW can run with no GPU or a very small one, no need for high airflow, fast fans etc, just get a good case with a couple of silent fans and it can be very silent.

Captura de pantalla 2022-05-24 2351172.png

losangeles · Post by **losangeles** » Tue Nov 29, 2022 7:32 pm

If you can account for the jet engine audio produced by the high-end Intel processors, then go for those.

Another not so bad idea is waiting until 2023 when the M2 Pro/Max/Ultra/Extreme are released.

M3 is also rumored to use 3nm technology subsequently (if you can hold off)

sQeetz · Post by **sQeetz** » Wed Nov 30, 2022 5:23 am

Couple of instances of the most CPU hungry plugins, plus a lot of FX on a measly M1 Macbook.... and the fan never ever spun up .... to be honest, I don't even know if the fan works on that thing, because I've never heard it.
I'm considering going with whatever MacBook Air they come up with, with an M3 or maybe the year after that M4 without a fan.

losangeles · Post by **losangeles** » Wed Nov 30, 2022 6:36 am

sQeetz wrote: ↑Wed Nov 30, 2022 5:23 am Couple of instances of the most CPU hungry plugins, plus a lot of FX on a measly M1 Macbook.... and the fan never ever spun up .... to be honest, I don't even know if the fan works on that thing, because I've never heard it.
I'm considering going with whatever MacBook Air they come up with, with an M3 or maybe the year after that M4 without a fan.

Actually, no- regular M1 MacBooks (Air) do not have a fan- hence, throttling can become an issue, if pushed. However, even on my M1 Max, I have never heard the fan come on.

sQeetz · Post by **sQeetz** » Wed Nov 30, 2022 7:47 am

losangeles wrote: ↑Wed Nov 30, 2022 6:36 am
Actually, no- regular M1 MacBooks (Air) do not have a fan- hence, throttling can become an issue, if pushed. However, even on my M1 Max, I have never heard the fan come on.

Reading. You genius. I recommend doing it.

buzz1 · Post by **buzz1** » Wed Nov 30, 2022 8:07 am

[quote="Jim Roseberry" post_id=8567558 time=1669730648 user_id=67952

If you want to stick to air-cooling, I'd recommend the 12700k.
It's much less complex to configure.

DDR5 can also be more complex to configure (especially if your running 128GB).
It's not as simple as setting XMP.
[/quote]

Can you explain a bit more what that means in practice. Thanks.

sQeetz · Post by **sQeetz** » Wed Nov 30, 2022 8:40 am

buzz1 wrote: ↑Wed Nov 30, 2022 8:07 am Can you explain a bit more what that means in practice. Thanks.

It means in practice that if you want to run a rig using an Intel or AMD CPU you better be a fireman.

And that all that energy you want to dissipate could be (and will be) used to heat your room instead of being used to actually render your music.

Ableton 11 Music prod cpu recommendations? 12th or 13th Gen?