Behringer pro 800

[cryophonik]

Holy crap, 50K preorders already?!

Not sure if Uli is rolling around joyfully in a pile of money or trembling in the fetal position in a dark corner somewhere

[T-CM11]

Holy crap, 50K preorders already?!

Not sure if Uli is rolling around joyfully in a pile of money or trembling in the fetal position in a dark corner somewhere

50K orders by retailers - part of that could just be stock too...

[ghettosynth]

Holy crap, 50K preorders already?!

Not sure if Uli is rolling around joyfully in a pile of money or trembling in the fetal position in a dark corner somewhere

This was predictable, I mean it was my first thought when I heard the price. Let's all enjoy the "commitment to low cost music" while they don't have a monopoly.

[Uncle E]

Well, I don't know how accurate the Behringer clones are supposed to be, but i've owned both a Pro-1 and a Sixtrack, and both are very different beast. I've sold the Sixtrack quickly.
If the Pro800 is close to the Sixtrack (The Sixtrack and the Pro8 are supposed to sound identical), getting both the Pro800 and the Pro1 still make sense

Six Trak is a synth on a chip, each voice is VCO-VCF-VCA on a single Curtis 3394. Prophet-600 has the Curtis 3340 chip for its VCO (same as the Prophet-5 REV3) and has separate 3372 chips for VCF and VCA. Behringer re-created the 3340 but, AFAIK, has not re-created the 3372.

With all that said, my guess is this is all surface mount on a single board and that they won't be using their own chips at all. The Pro-800 videos do not sound like the Prophet-600's I've owned, I actually think they sound better.

[EvilDragon]

They def used their own chips on this one, 3372 is replaced with their V3320 tho. So yeah it won't sound like a vintage P600. It will sound better.

[Aliens]

50K orders by retailers is 50k sales for Behringer.

[VitaminD]

Holy crap, 50K preorders already?!

Not sure if Uli is rolling around joyfully in a pile of money or trembling in the fetal position in a dark corner somewhere

Maybe any competitors trying to sell products with this feature set or price are the ones trembling in the fetal position somewhere.

400 USD is cheap for an 8 voice poly analog with preset recall, an Arpeggiator, Unison mode, a chord memory, and a 2 track sequencer. I don't see how anyone in this product category competes. It's around the same price as the Roland Boutiques but stuffed with more features.

This synth (and it's sound) is going to be everywhereee. Especially if it comes with some default presets. Probably lots of synthwave incoming..

It does make me wonder how long before Roland, Korg, and others abandon the low end market because Behringer is just doing it for less?

[ghettosynth]

They def used their own chips on this one, 3372 is replaced with their V3320 tho. So yeah it won't sound like a vintage P600. It will sound better.

Do you have a source for that? I'm only asking because practically they are very different chips. The 3372 has a lot of the voice for a two VCO synth including a two channel input mixer and an output VCA. As well, what the 3320 doesn't have built in that's an important characteristic is resonance compensation. Well, really, the 3320 is just some OTAs on a chip, like some other filter chips from the day. The 3372, OTOH, requires fewer external parts. So, using the 3320 would drive up the cost, both in terms of costs for the filter, but also, because you'd need the rest of the 3372 for the synth voice.

So, if they're using the 3320, are they doing resonance compensation? Did they just replicate the P5/P1 filter design otherwise? What are they using for an output VCA? Noise mixing is easy because it's not per voice, but, oscillator mixing is per-voice so they still need the input VCAs.

[Uncle E]

Oh, I see now that they made a surface mount version of the 3340. I had only seen their original through hole version before.

What did they use for the VCA in the Pro-1? AFAIK, they don’t make a 3310.

[ghettosynth]

Oh, I see now that they made a surface mount version of the 3340. I had only seen their original through hole version before.

What did they use for the VCA in the Pro-1? AFAIK, they don’t make a 3310.

3310 is the EG, 3360 is the VCA. I don't know what "they" made, but both are available as re-made chips at the moment. My guess is that if the demand keeps up we may see more resurgence in these synth voice chips, and one can only hope, but maybe some new ones as well.

[EvilDragon]

Do you have a source for that? I'm only asking because practically they are very different chips. The 3372 has a lot of the voice for a two VCO synth including a two channel input mixer and an output VCA. As well, what the 3320 doesn't have built in that's an important characteristic is resonance compensation. Well, really, the 3320 is just some OTAs on a chip, like some other filter chips from the day. The 3372, OTOH, requires fewer external parts. So, using the 3320 would drive up the cost, both in terms of costs for the filter, but also, because you'd need the rest of the 3372 for the synth voice.

So, if they're using the 3320, are they doing resonance compensation? Did they just replicate the P5/P1 filter design otherwise? What are they using for an output VCA? Noise mixing is easy because it's not per voice, but, oscillator mixing is per-voice so they still need the input VCAs.

Dunno exactly what they're doing in Pro-800 but it has been confirmed they're using their V3320 for the filter. In comment chain of this FB post.

Resonance compensation can of course be done externally if needed (and actually unsure if it was even used in Prophet-600 originally). Not really a problem with surface mount tech, cost-wise or otherwise since apparently they aren't bothered with it so much that they lowered the release price by 200 bucks from the originally projected one!

Also note that 3372 was just input mixing, filter and VCA, but no oscillators or envs, so it's not exactly a whole synth voice (like, say, CEM3396). Prophet-600 used CEM3340 for oscillators (Behr does the same with their CoolAudio version of it).

[ghettosynth]

Do you have a source for that? I'm only asking because practically they are very different chips. The 3372 has a lot of the voice for a two VCO synth including a two channel input mixer and an output VCA. As well, what the 3320 doesn't have built in that's an important characteristic is resonance compensation. Well, really, the 3320 is just some OTAs on a chip, like some other filter chips from the day. The 3372, OTOH, requires fewer external parts. So, using the 3320 would drive up the cost, both in terms of costs for the filter, but also, because you'd need the rest of the 3372 for the synth voice.

So, if they're using the 3320, are they doing resonance compensation? Did they just replicate the P5/P1 filter design otherwise? What are they using for an output VCA? Noise mixing is easy because it's not per voice, but, oscillator mixing is per-voice so they still need the input VCAs.

Dunno exactly what they're doing in Pro-800 but it has been confirmed they're using their V3320 for the filter. In comment chain of this FB post.

Resonance compensation can of course be done externally if needed (and actually unsure if it was even used in Prophet-600 originally). Not really a problem with surface mount tech, cost-wise or otherwise since apparently they aren't bothered with it so much that they lowered the release price by 200 bucks from the originally projected one!

Also note that 3372 was just input mixing, filter and VCA, but no oscillators or envs, so it's not exactly a whole synth voice (like, say, CEM3396). Prophet-600 used CEM3340 for oscillators (Behr does the same with their CoolAudio version of it).

Yes, I'm pretty familiar with the 3372. AFAIK, you can't disable the gain compensation for the resonance, it's built into the chip. There's nothing in the P600 schematic that suggests that they are doing anything outside of what the chip provides, as is. I still find it fascinating that B can include so much additional circuitry for peanuts.

I'm still curious what the VCAs are. I couldn't find any pictures that I was able to get a close enough look to discern details. I guess we'll see in good time.

[ghettosynth]

Sweetwater says "October" for the first shipment. I'm like number 23245 on the waiting list, so, I should have mine by the end of 2026...or so...I think.

[kritikon]

Holy crap, at that rate down here in far away middle earth, I'll not get a Pro800 until fcuk knows when. Never mind King Spaniel III's coronation...it'll be his silver fkin jubilee.

[cryophonik]

Sweetwater says "October" for the first shipment. I'm like number 23245 on the waiting list, so, I should have mine by the end of 2026...or so...I think.

I wonder how many new synths Behringer will announce before you get it.