Hi
Not getting my setup with ASUS to 100% free from faint ticks in either ear, some minutes in between.
I've now tried 3 different audio usb interfaces
- an old Avid Fasttrack Solo
- current RME Digiface USB
- Presonus Studio 1824c(returned)
Same thing. I exclude audio interfaces by now.
- thinking either chipset drivers
It should bleeding be perfect. I did not spend this money to be so-so.
- it just nags me
So ordered a Gigabyte Z690 UD DDR4 to replace ASUS Z690-P DDR4.
- memory chips are compatible
- M2 SSD I guess should wor, 2 x 2 TB with everything installed
- available usb and those on headers on MB should be enough
- same cpu i7-12700F
- same graphics card Asus GT 1030 and only card slot used.
I have I think 2 software that are challenge response, and might take id from mac address on ethernet port that needs reauthorize.
Anything to worry about otherwise?
Some ASUS drivers maybe need uninstall, not sure.
I saw downloading manual to MB that dated april 14th 2023, so real new maybe or if just updated. Maybe some BIOS bugs might be there, not sure.
Thanks.
Changing MB from ASUS to Gigabyte - what can I expect in reinstall etc?
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FranklyFlawless FranklyFlawless https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=586325
- KVRian
- 1091 posts since 24 Oct, 2022
Seems thorough to me. I stopped dealing with DRM and EULAs a long time ago, so I cannot help you with any software issues surrounding them.
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- KVRian
- 636 posts since 21 Jun, 2013
Usually you want to reinstall windows on a new motherboard. Especially if you have suspicious software or drivers.
I would try to run everything at stock without messing with the stuff too much (apart from usual windows and nvidia high performance mode). Don't install any additional software and devices, slowly add the stuff bit by bit. Right out of the box it should work without issues.
I would try to run everything at stock without messing with the stuff too much (apart from usual windows and nvidia high performance mode). Don't install any additional software and devices, slowly add the stuff bit by bit. Right out of the box it should work without issues.
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- KVRer
- 23 posts since 3 Mar, 2023
I would reinstall Windows. Skip any manufacturer overclocking software. Usual suspects, High Performance Windows / High Performance NVIDIA. Make sure you're signed in to your Microsoft account if possible, then your Windows license should just hop over when you make a new profile on the new mobo.
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- KVRian
- 565 posts since 3 Jan, 2021
I would keep the install and just move it.
One reason is diagnosis. You want to know whether the audio problems are still there and therefore were not the fault of the previous board. Also, lazy.
One reason is diagnosis. You want to know whether the audio problems are still there and therefore were not the fault of the previous board. Also, lazy.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 7120 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden
So I got the MB yesterday and all went smooth.
- kept internet up as adviced
- just moved the SSD's and all of it over
- you are met with a dialog in windows with a dozen checkboxes which things to install
- nothing more to it
Addictive drums said wrong computer id, but logging in to account that seem to fix itself. Windows did not react to other computer not authorized or anything.
Very impressed with Gigabyte so far. Much attention to detail and lots of really good utilities to watch temperature, voltages, fans speeds etc, in realtime, as grafs in realtime. And nothing intrusive about it as Asus AI Suite, that you had to close a lot of stuff staying on top of other applications or just uninstall, which I did.
Touched a few minor bios settings, like XMP for memory. Running a project that I use as reference went from 33% utilization to 18%. That's where Asus board were too.
If Asus board had faint ticks in the end tweaking it, Gigabyte is faint faint ticks and much more rare, surely minutes in between. But just ran for an hour listening or so with computer up for 7-8 hours. If I press one ear cup on phones and rubber foam is moved, it's that level but just a single faint faint thingy, not as many as pressing ear cup which are hundreds or so. Like some rare static or something. But usually in one ear only, fully left or right, so nothing on analog side as far as I can tell. Dip on voltage would be on both sides.
But Gigabyte MB is a keeper. Really worth the swap itself. Education money as I call it.
Things I noticed
- Asus board was a bit bent, and when setting two screws in MB the third one was 3mm up in the air
- I took the board out and placed on a flat surface and it was certainly bent
- also checked with straight ruler in chassis if that might be off, but straight and fine
- Gigabyte board was all flat, no bend at all
Tells a bit about build quality I think.
I will continue some tests like putting cores allowed to park in windows to default and such things. And then talk to Intel directly what is going on and if having suggestions for settings. It's Intel usb root hub, Intel chipset and Intel cpu.
If you put default core parking, 4% was value, so all but one, on Asus it was seriously bad noise, like constant overs, or radio station not properly tuned in. You could see in Process Lasso that cores jumped all over many times per second. Not sure why core allocation goes on like that. I will do that test now again.
- already this is strange that this core handling would interfere on things on usb that much
- but the hunt for performance and frequencies going up and down, voltages too to keep temperatures in range make this happend, it seems.
I really think there is something for Intel or me to tune a bit.
It does not really intefere with daw work but just curious what is going on. It should not be anything entering audio like that. It should be spotless.
But will continue to work on the songs as usuall.
- kept internet up as adviced
- just moved the SSD's and all of it over
- you are met with a dialog in windows with a dozen checkboxes which things to install
- nothing more to it
Addictive drums said wrong computer id, but logging in to account that seem to fix itself. Windows did not react to other computer not authorized or anything.
Very impressed with Gigabyte so far. Much attention to detail and lots of really good utilities to watch temperature, voltages, fans speeds etc, in realtime, as grafs in realtime. And nothing intrusive about it as Asus AI Suite, that you had to close a lot of stuff staying on top of other applications or just uninstall, which I did.
Touched a few minor bios settings, like XMP for memory. Running a project that I use as reference went from 33% utilization to 18%. That's where Asus board were too.
If Asus board had faint ticks in the end tweaking it, Gigabyte is faint faint ticks and much more rare, surely minutes in between. But just ran for an hour listening or so with computer up for 7-8 hours. If I press one ear cup on phones and rubber foam is moved, it's that level but just a single faint faint thingy, not as many as pressing ear cup which are hundreds or so. Like some rare static or something. But usually in one ear only, fully left or right, so nothing on analog side as far as I can tell. Dip on voltage would be on both sides.
But Gigabyte MB is a keeper. Really worth the swap itself. Education money as I call it.
Things I noticed
- Asus board was a bit bent, and when setting two screws in MB the third one was 3mm up in the air
- I took the board out and placed on a flat surface and it was certainly bent
- also checked with straight ruler in chassis if that might be off, but straight and fine
- Gigabyte board was all flat, no bend at all
Tells a bit about build quality I think.
I will continue some tests like putting cores allowed to park in windows to default and such things. And then talk to Intel directly what is going on and if having suggestions for settings. It's Intel usb root hub, Intel chipset and Intel cpu.
If you put default core parking, 4% was value, so all but one, on Asus it was seriously bad noise, like constant overs, or radio station not properly tuned in. You could see in Process Lasso that cores jumped all over many times per second. Not sure why core allocation goes on like that. I will do that test now again.
- already this is strange that this core handling would interfere on things on usb that much
- but the hunt for performance and frequencies going up and down, voltages too to keep temperatures in range make this happend, it seems.
I really think there is something for Intel or me to tune a bit.
It does not really intefere with daw work but just curious what is going on. It should not be anything entering audio like that. It should be spotless.
But will continue to work on the songs as usuall.
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- KVRian
- 1188 posts since 21 Aug, 2017 from Brasil
Congratulations, that is good to hear.
-Make sure the motherboard BIOS is updated.I really think there is something for Intel or me to tune a bit.
-Use the LAN driver from the Realtek site
https://www.realtek.com/en/component/zo ... s-software
- The latest Intel® Extreme Tuning Utility is version 7.11.1.5
https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en ... l-xtu.html
- Do the tweaks
viewtopic.php?p=8667750#p8667750
I included new stuff like
https://github.com/hellzerg/optimizer
BTW, I didn't check the latest versions, but a long time ago the ASUS/Gigabyte/ETC suit was crap. To verify temperature/clock/etc.
https://www.hwinfo.com/download/
To control the fans, it can make the case fans react to both CPU/GPU temperature.
https://linustechtips.com/topic/1099996 ... placement/
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 7120 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden
Thanks again, Pictus. 
A pity intel utility is only for K and X series processors.
So i7-12700KF is supported, but not i7-12700F.
Last findings ------------------------------
All DPC are below 500 us. NTOSKRNL is the worst, graphics below 200 us.
No temperatures seems abnormal
CPU 42 C, PCH 45 C, VRM MOS 47 C at most.
CPU and core package around 20W.
My cpu cooler is to fix 220W.
Enclosed cooler from Intel was for 65W.
Fans are running on quiet mode and does not make much difference to temps.
CPU fans 700 rpm, System 750 rpm or so. So don''t think fans are an issue.
Gigabyte monitor stuff is really good.
Noticed when computer have been running all day an increase in tick dust as I call it by now.
It's really faint. And you hear listening to not too busy piano track only.
So in this state, getting ticks more often, I shifted and activated onboard audio as well.
And now that computer is really warm all through, that also had these faint ticks in between.
So thought was is common factor here
- usb used for audio interface was on ATX panel
- onboard audio used also ATX panel line output
- is this probably crowded with digital noise or something in that area around atx panel?
So thought what about the usb 3.x headers and cable to front of chassis.
- these headers are in the other end of MB
Move Digiface USB to that port and voila - noise is even more faint
- if to estimate around -80 dB or something that these faint ticks are
If this sticks as testing today, I am done.
There are loads of poorly written stuff in software, both MS stuff part of windows and applications having auto update stuff they do. Mostly some minutes after boot.
They just throw themselves on network calls expecting internet to be there. There are calls to check if internet is up first, and this would be no problem at all. So rookie thinking about this not to cause issues for other software and realtime stuff like audio.
I found one GCLOUD.EXE that make audio stall completely for part of a second. Turning that off with SysInternals Autostarts that one went away. This in within minutes after boot, but still.
- poorly written software in this regards
I had similar issues with Windows 7 machine over the 13 years used, looked up applications that do autoupdate with no regard whether network is up at all. Finding those and turning off autocheck for updates all ticks from that it went away.
As retired programmer I find so many poorly written applications that cause audio issues. The fall back from exceptions should not interfere like this. These are probably causing DPC latency in these cases.
I reported a range of these to Microsoft and seems last updates they did something at least on their own stuff in Task Scheduler. I don't see these in event viewer anymore. There were loads, like a dozen remarks about tracing something over some obscure urls and tcp ports never used normally. This is probably MS prying into what you are doing.
Windows has a lot in common with spyware these days.
But exposed almost all of the power settings and some other listed by this excellent feature PowerSettingsExplorer you gave link to before. Really, really useful. that helped a lot.
I could experiment with how many checks are to be done before cores are going down in performance and things. So setting those counts up quite a bit one could see how temperatures on VRM and PCH went up 4-5 degrees C. Seems logical. But turned down to defaults again that they did no difference to ticks.
So experiment and learn what does what - that is computer for you.
A pity intel utility is only for K and X series processors.
So i7-12700KF is supported, but not i7-12700F.
Last findings ------------------------------
All DPC are below 500 us. NTOSKRNL is the worst, graphics below 200 us.
No temperatures seems abnormal
CPU 42 C, PCH 45 C, VRM MOS 47 C at most.
CPU and core package around 20W.
My cpu cooler is to fix 220W.
Enclosed cooler from Intel was for 65W.
Fans are running on quiet mode and does not make much difference to temps.
CPU fans 700 rpm, System 750 rpm or so. So don''t think fans are an issue.
Gigabyte monitor stuff is really good.
Noticed when computer have been running all day an increase in tick dust as I call it by now.
It's really faint. And you hear listening to not too busy piano track only.
So in this state, getting ticks more often, I shifted and activated onboard audio as well.
And now that computer is really warm all through, that also had these faint ticks in between.
So thought was is common factor here
- usb used for audio interface was on ATX panel
- onboard audio used also ATX panel line output
- is this probably crowded with digital noise or something in that area around atx panel?
So thought what about the usb 3.x headers and cable to front of chassis.
- these headers are in the other end of MB
Move Digiface USB to that port and voila - noise is even more faint
- if to estimate around -80 dB or something that these faint ticks are
If this sticks as testing today, I am done.
There are loads of poorly written stuff in software, both MS stuff part of windows and applications having auto update stuff they do. Mostly some minutes after boot.
They just throw themselves on network calls expecting internet to be there. There are calls to check if internet is up first, and this would be no problem at all. So rookie thinking about this not to cause issues for other software and realtime stuff like audio.
I found one GCLOUD.EXE that make audio stall completely for part of a second. Turning that off with SysInternals Autostarts that one went away. This in within minutes after boot, but still.
- poorly written software in this regards
I had similar issues with Windows 7 machine over the 13 years used, looked up applications that do autoupdate with no regard whether network is up at all. Finding those and turning off autocheck for updates all ticks from that it went away.
As retired programmer I find so many poorly written applications that cause audio issues. The fall back from exceptions should not interfere like this. These are probably causing DPC latency in these cases.
I reported a range of these to Microsoft and seems last updates they did something at least on their own stuff in Task Scheduler. I don't see these in event viewer anymore. There were loads, like a dozen remarks about tracing something over some obscure urls and tcp ports never used normally. This is probably MS prying into what you are doing.
Windows has a lot in common with spyware these days.
But exposed almost all of the power settings and some other listed by this excellent feature PowerSettingsExplorer you gave link to before. Really, really useful. that helped a lot.
I could experiment with how many checks are to be done before cores are going down in performance and things. So setting those counts up quite a bit one could see how temperatures on VRM and PCH went up 4-5 degrees C. Seems logical. But turned down to defaults again that they did no difference to ticks.
So experiment and learn what does what - that is computer for you.
-
FranklyFlawless FranklyFlawless https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=586325
- KVRian
- 1091 posts since 24 Oct, 2022
Do not forget adware. To them, you are just a consumer to be used for marketing purposes, and to keep locked up in their ecosystem. This is just standard industry practice.lfm wrote: Mon May 08, 2023 6:07 am I reported a range of these to Microsoft and seems last updates they did something at least on their own stuff in Task Scheduler. I don't see these in event viewer anymore. There were loads, like a dozen remarks about tracing something over some obscure urls and tcp ports never used normally. This is probably MS prying into what you are doing.
Windows has a lot in common with spyware these days.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 7120 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden
Starting to prepare a report to Intel anyway from my findings on friday night late, while I still could get real ticks.
This is part of it:
This is how two ticks sound, recorded with a recorder from headphone amp:
http://cloudmanfilms.ownit.nu/ticks0505.wav
It's a declining piano note, and reduced to just the tick part.
So this is what I hear on phones.
and this is how it looks closeup in daw later taking that from recorder
http://cloudmanfilms.ownit.nu/tick0505-1.png
http://cloudmanfilms.ownit.nu/tick0505-2.png
something weird entering audio stream. Note that this is the same taking optical out from interface and record on another system. So actually enters audio stream.
At time with really faint ticks in one ear can look like this
http://cloudmanfilms.ownit.nu/digiface96-righttick.jpg
The strongest common denominator is Intel
- Z690 chipset
- i7-12700F cpu
- usb 3.0 controller
but could be Windows 11 something also.
This is part of it:
This is how two ticks sound, recorded with a recorder from headphone amp:
http://cloudmanfilms.ownit.nu/ticks0505.wav
It's a declining piano note, and reduced to just the tick part.
So this is what I hear on phones.
and this is how it looks closeup in daw later taking that from recorder
http://cloudmanfilms.ownit.nu/tick0505-1.png
http://cloudmanfilms.ownit.nu/tick0505-2.png
something weird entering audio stream. Note that this is the same taking optical out from interface and record on another system. So actually enters audio stream.
At time with really faint ticks in one ear can look like this
http://cloudmanfilms.ownit.nu/digiface96-righttick.jpg
The strongest common denominator is Intel
- Z690 chipset
- i7-12700F cpu
- usb 3.0 controller
but could be Windows 11 something also.
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- KVRian
- 1185 posts since 27 Apr, 2016
Have you tried a ground/earth continuity check between motherboard and case / psu
and the tin output guard, cards to chassis etc. Sometimes if there is a poor earthing
odd sounds get a chance to come through audio. Probably best to do it with the machine not plugged in. (and observe static precautions yourself)
Though given you have rebuild the machine the above is fairly unlikely. Annoying it is still there a bit.
The sound really does sound a like a piano with the attack cut off.. not very computer-y
It seems unlikely to be the motherboard since being changed totally. Any other peripherals, video card etc ? I will re-read your original post.
Maybe try on board graphics only ?
What PSU brand.. have you tried a mains noise / choke filter ? Possibly could be noise on the mains electricity. Any big RF sources near by like Mobile phone towers, taxi, FM broadcast etc. Try a new mouse and keyboard.
and the tin output guard, cards to chassis etc. Sometimes if there is a poor earthing
odd sounds get a chance to come through audio. Probably best to do it with the machine not plugged in. (and observe static precautions yourself)
Though given you have rebuild the machine the above is fairly unlikely. Annoying it is still there a bit.
The sound really does sound a like a piano with the attack cut off.. not very computer-y
It seems unlikely to be the motherboard since being changed totally. Any other peripherals, video card etc ? I will re-read your original post.
Maybe try on board graphics only ?
What PSU brand.. have you tried a mains noise / choke filter ? Possibly could be noise on the mains electricity. Any big RF sources near by like Mobile phone towers, taxi, FM broadcast etc. Try a new mouse and keyboard.
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- KVRAF
- 2982 posts since 31 Jan, 2003 from Ghent, Belgium
Something to try:
Turn off XMP
(from a somewhat similar experience)
Turn off XMP
(from a somewhat similar experience)
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 7120 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden
Thanks, read all over about mb grounding and it all said this is through case standoffs and not needed. Manual to mb say nothing either. So figure it is good as is.Synthman2000 wrote: Mon May 08, 2023 9:24 am Have you tried a ground/earth continuity check between motherboard and case / psu
and the tin output guard, cards to chassis etc. Sometimes if there is a poor earthing
odd sounds get a chance to come through audio. Probably best to do it with the machine not plugged in. (and observe static precautions yourself)
Though given you have rebuild the machine the above is fairly unlikely. Annoying it is still there a bit.
The sound really does sound a like a piano with the attack cut off.. not very computer-y
It seems unlikely to be the motherboard since being changed totally. Any other peripherals, video card etc ? I will re-read your original post.
Maybe try on board graphics only ?
What PSU brand.. have you tried a mains noise / choke filter ? Possibly could be noise on the mains electricity. Any big RF sources near by like Mobile phone towers, taxi, FM broadcast etc. Try a new mouse and keyboard.
- and you say, two different mb's
It's release of piano note decaying.
Corsair psu RM750x.
The cpu has no graphics being F-model, I think.
And since settings for GT1030 give below 200us DPC, don't think it is involved.
When computer just was up and serious clicks and crackles all over, I tested another GT730 also to maybe look into getting another GPU. But same thing.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 7120 posts since 22 Jan, 2005 from Sweden
Not a bad idea, will do. Thanks. Easy to try.T-CM11 wrote: Mon May 08, 2023 9:40 am Something to try:
Turn off XMP
(from a somewhat similar experience)
Had no instabilities though, but one just have to trial and error with computers.
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- KVRian
- 1188 posts since 21 Aug, 2017 from Brasil
You are welcome!lfm wrote: Mon May 08, 2023 6:07 am Thanks again, Pictus.
- is this probably crowded with digital noise or something in that area around atx panel?
I do not know what is happening...
In the BIOS verify if you have any "Spread Spectrum".
This thing reduces electromagnetic interference(EMI), but it is worst for the PC.
For example, the "SB clock spread spectrum" keeps altering the BCLK clock 0.9MHz up and down.
- Get this bootable USB tool for pendrive
https://sergeistrelec.name/winpe-10-8-s ... rsion.html
- Use Macrium Reflect from the bootable pendrive to create a System Image
- In the BIOS disable the onboard audio
- Format drive C and do a clean Windows installation
- If does not work you can use Macrium Reflect to restore the previous installation.
BTW, I am using Windows 11, version 22H2 build 22621.1555
You can create an updated installation ISO with this script
https://uupdump.net/selectedition.php?i ... pack=en-us
Install the latest Visual C++ 2022 Redistributable
https://github.com/abbodi1406/vcredist/releases
AMD Ryzen 5600X + tweaked Windows 11 22H2 build 22621.1555
VCV Rack in the background playing some regenerative stuff and
internet browsing(wired LAN) via LibreWolf.
