Seriell Compression for Vocals with Opto as first instance

[LunarKitten]

Hello,

a friend has sold me a Joemeek ThreeQ channelstrip with opto compression that has a variable ratio (depending on the gain reduction).

It is my first hardware compressor and I would like to use it for future projects in the vocal chain.

I have always used an 1176 first and a LA-2A second in series, with an occasional thrid compressor. As I understand it the LA-2A is like the ThreeQ an opto comprosser. The 1176 on the other hand is a quick FET compressor.

Now that I have an opto compressor in the beginning of the vocal chain, I wonder what compression I should add later down the road if the signal needs it?

Thanks for any suggestion.

[LunarKitten]

My bad. I can see that this is not the right forum for this type of question.

[stillshaded]

Generally you would want to do the 1176 before the opto. Opto is slower and smoother, so it will miss the big peaks. 1176 is fast and will tame the big peaks, then you would run it into the opto for overall smoothing. Not really sure what else you would need from this. Maybe a cleaner, more “clinical” compressor.

[legendCNCD]

1176 4:1 -3dB to -10dB, attack and release - slow for staccato vocal cut through, fast for smoothing legato notes, release according to the timing of vocals and then opto around -1 - -2dB, EQ and then De-Ess.

[Ploki]

I run Pro-C2 with very lean settings for general 2-3dB evening out (with look ahead so peaks don't shoot over) then use something characterful at the end to push it.
Voxengo Deft Compressor, 1176, Unisum with Hygge, Pulsar Mu, Molot, Presswerk.

I know it's not hardware but the general principle is the same and i'd approach it the same with hardware. First control, then character.

I usually follow the whole vocal bus with Pro-L2 2-3dB to control the overshoots.

Really, the question is "what am i trying to achieve with this processing" and the answer is the tool that does that best.

[jamcat]

The purpose of the 1176 first is to catch sharp transients that the LA-2A is too slow to catch in time, but nonetheless send the LA-2A into overdrive which in turn leads to the release being less transparent. The LA-2A works better when it doesn't have to work too hard.

[LunarKitten]

Generally you would want to do the 1176 before the opto. Opto is slower and smoother, so it will miss the big peaks. 1176 is fast and will tame the big peaks, then you would run it into the opto for overall smoothing. Not really sure what else you would need from this. Maybe a cleaner, more “clinical” compressor.

Yes. If you had only one hardware compressor and it's opto, would you use it on vocals or do it all in the box?

1176 4:1 -3dB to -10dB, attack and release - slow for staccato vocal cut through, fast for smoothing legato notes, release according to the timing of vocals and then opto around -1 - -2dB, EQ and then De-Ess.

Hey, thanks for the instructions. I'm going to give this a try. The thing is I have a hardware opto compressor and if I want to use that it's going to be the first compressor in the chain. I wonder if it is a good idea to use it at all on vocals, because I can't have a 1176 as the first compressor then. Any ideas?

I run Pro-C2 with very lean settings for general 2-3dB evening out (with look ahead so peaks don't shoot over) then use something characterful at the end to push it.
Voxengo Deft Compressor, 1176, Unisum with Hygge, Pulsar Mu, Molot, Presswerk.

I know it's not hardware but the general principle is the same and i'd approach it the same with hardware. First control, then character.

I usually follow the whole vocal bus with Pro-L2 2-3dB to control the overshoots.

Really, the question is "what am i trying to achieve with this processing" and the answer is the tool that does that best.

I'd like to try out some types of compressors that I can put after the opto variable ratio ThreeQ compressor for vocals in rock type productions. The 1176 first and LA-2A combintaion has worked for me, however if I want to use this hardware compressor I could only go for opto style first and 1176 second. Or should I try something completly different?

The purpose of the 1176 first is to catch sharp transients that the LA-2A is too slow to catch in time, but nonetheless send the LA-2A into overdrive which in turn leads to the release being less transparent. The LA-2A works better when it doesn't have to work too hard.

Would it make sense, since I am using the opto style compressor frist, to have the attack low and catch transients with a 1176 later in the chain?

[Den*]

I have always used an 1176 first and a LA-2A second in series, with an occasional thrid compressor. As I understand it the LA-2A is like the ThreeQ an opto comprosser. The 1176 on the other hand is a quick FET compressor.

Now that I have an opto compressor in the beginning of the vocal chain, I wonder what compression I should add later down the road if the signal needs it?

Thanks for any suggestion.

There is such compressor all together, I mean double..

https://www.patreon.com/posts/comper-74729047

COMPER-1.png

[DCrown]

I use a 1176 comp first, Waves CLA 76 or IKM Comprexxor followed by Opto, Softube Summit TLA 100A or TimP Opto 32 (unfortunately causes latency!) and it works well. I have seen both, first1176 or first Opto, I prefer 1176 first.
It's also common to use 1176 or LA2A only on vocals.
If vocals are too dynamic with sudden peaks, it's also possible to fix it manually with volume automation or Waves Vocal Rider and add an opto compressor, I prefer ReaComp for this combination, though

[trmupstage]

I have both hardware and software LA2A and 1176 compressors. On the way in, I tend to only use the 1176 at 4:1 or 12:1 depending on the singer. Slowish attack and fastest release. On lighter singers that are doing something smooth, I will use the LA2A instead. I only knock off 5-6 dB at the loudest parts. I really don't want to paint myself into a corner.
Once ITB, I will use software compressors in this order, with EQ between.
1) EQ -Crave, HPF mostly and maybe just a little 10K
2) 1178 - Pulsar, 4:1 with tube setting, cutting 3-5dB on peaks
3) Softube Grand Channel, EQ first, just adding 8K
4) Softube Grand Channel, Med attack and fast release, 3dB of reduction
5) Waves MV2, just bringing up the low level fader
6) Weiss Deesser

Sounds like a lot, but each thing is only doing a little. That setup has worked sell over the last 4 years of albums I've mixed and/or recorded.

[muki]

another double-one:
ViatorDSP Duplex Comp

https://viatordsp.gumroad.com/l/zxdeus?layout=profile
free version:
https://viatordsp.gumroad.com/l/ihpwx?layout=profile

.

[LunarKitten]

I use a 1176 comp first, Waves CLA 76 or IKM Comprexxor followed by Opto, Softube Summit TLA 100A or TimP Opto 32 (unfortunately causes latency!) and it works well. I have seen both, first1176 or first Opto, I prefer 1176 first.
It's also common to use 1176 or LA2A only on vocals.

Okay, I have to look into what they are doing with the LA-2A alone or first.

I have both hardware and software LA2A and 1176 compressors. On the way in, I tend to only use the 1176 at 4:1 or 12:1 depending on the singer. Slowish attack and fastest release. On lighter singers that are doing something smooth, I will use the LA2A instead. I only knock off 5-6 dB at the loudest parts. I really don't want to paint myself into a corner.

What would you try when you've recorded with the LA-2A and decide you need more later on?

[trmupstage]

If you use an LA2A or any opto first, you can always follow it up with an 1176. I have other engineering friends that like the opto first. No real right or wrong. So many ways to get the dynamics under control. Just don't try and have a single compressor do all the work. Too many pumping artifacts then.

[jamcat]

Shadow Hills Mastering Compressor is also a dual compressor: Opto, Discrete (VCA), or both. There's a real (expensive) hardware unit, and a Brainworx modeled software version, available native or for UAD-2. Opto is before VCA.

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail ... compressor
https://www.uaudio.com/uad-plugins/mast ... essor.html
https://www.plugin-alliance.com/en/prod ... essor.html

[DCrown]

TBProAudio CS-5501 has two compressors, too, with different selectable modes and a lot more, not sure whether they can be used seriell, have not demoed.
To Waves Omnisheps one can add another Waves comps.
You could demo to find out how 1176 style works as first and as 2nd comp without your hardware, to see how it affects your vocals