Considering Linux for my next music production computer - wise or not?

[kvotchin]

Like the title says. Putting together a new machine soon (new AMD CPU, plenty of storage).

The other options are Windows 11 - which is literally looking worse every time I check tech news or whatever - or MacOS, which ties me to Mac hardware and therefore the pricing and limitations of such.

I’ve used Linux years ago, and still know my way around it, more or less. Windows 10 is my current DAW machine OS. MacOS, I have tried. Didn’t get along with it all that well.

Would prefer to be able to game, somewhat, but it’s not the highest priority.

Interface is an RME Babyface Pro (not the FS model) - willing to trade that in for something else if necessary. Currently using Reaper and Ableton, with a bunch of VSTs.

Looks like Mint might be a good distro? Have used that one, and others. What would you suggest?

Let me know if other details are needed.

Thanks!

[stoopicus]

Well, if you do, you won't be using Ableton any more. Bitwig is available though.

You should also be sure to check your plugins to make sure they are available.

Your choices of software will be drastically limited in comparison to MacOS or Windows.

For Gaming as well, as much as I hate to say it, Windows by a mile, sadly.

[audiojunkie]

Linux has a learning curve. But also, Linux has a lot more freedom and configurability. It functions just as well as Windows and MacOS. But yes, there are less software and plugin options. The good thing is that the amount of available software is growing very rapidly. There are over over 1000+ plugins and software currently. The essentials are there, and not just from independent developers. Many big names, such as U-he, TAL-Software, ToneBoosters, AudioThing, Plogue, etc now support Linux. It all gets better and better with each passing day.

[starflakeprj]

Everything has a learning curve if you are not used to it. I don't think Linux is any harder (nowadays) to learn to use, as an general user, than Windows or MacOS. If all you do is browsing the internet, emailing, installing apps, running apps (any apps), there is hardly no learning curve at all (IMO).

[GaryG]

For Gaming as well, as much as I hate to say it, Windows by a mile, sadly.

I dont think it's quite so clear cut nowadays. with Steam etc, lots of people reporting better performance under Linux (going by YT videos). But, like everything, depends on the specific titles etc.

I tried to go 100% linux last year, it was generally fine but found myself losing evenings to silly problems, randomly the menu bars in apps would disappear, Wine kept getting uninstalled somehow etc. I currently have a dual boot and decided to stick to 100% native apps as an experiment and that seems smoother (though had no issue with my goto plugs, valhalla, unfiltered audio etc in yabridge)(until Wine went AWOL again...)

Also depends what you want to use. If you have a large Kontact library then do you want to jump through the hoops to get NI stuff working? Same with ilok protected products. I boot to windows for anything not available natively so, TBH, use Windows a lot more. But have completed projects purely in linux, just adapting to different tools, maybe i'll get to a point eventually where I'm purely linux.

[stoopicus]

For Gaming as well, as much as I hate to say it, Windows by a mile, sadly.

I dont think it's quite so clear cut nowadays. with Steam etc, lots of people reporting better performance under Linux (going by YT videos). But, like everything, depends on the specific titles etc.

It's even more clear cut now than it ever has been. The availability of game titles on linux is an insignificant blip compared to Windows. So, since 99% of the titles are not available native, your only other options there are hacky partial support for a fraction of titles under crossover/winex/etc, or streaming, both of which are bad. I have tried maining linux gaming for years in the past; it's so ridiculously not even a close contest it doesn't make sense to discuss at all.

I use linux now at work, I have used it at home for years (though at the moment only on one machine I am using as a server), and in the past I have mained linux as a desktop, sometimes for years in a row. For three years I even attempted a pure games machine running gentoo. I've been there, trust me

I love linux, but it's important to be honest about its limitations. It is not a serious player in gaming. And it will not be competitive in music production either, in terms of available software, now or any point in the medium term future. Long term, who knows?

[GaryG]

I've been there, trust me

I'm basing my comments on what a couple of people have told me (though kind of linux fanbois come to think of it....) so... I'll bow to your superior experience here

But, yeah, it's getting better with music software but I still use windows mainly for music because of the hoops you need to get things like NI, ilok stuff etc running, fun if you have the time/inclination for that. Certainly if big libraries and high end plugs are what you need for your business then you need to be pretty dedicated to it, I guess some studios do this? Would be interested if anyone knew examples.

In the meantime, I can do what I need in Linux, being a Reaper user so much native/jsfx/script stuff about to scratch most itches but certainly miss some NI stuff, the Valhalla plugs etc (this is staying strictly native of course)

[stoopicus]

yeah that's a good summary. It's come a long way but software availability is still going to be the thorn in its side for at minimum a few years, maybe more. We'll see. It's kind of a chicken/egg thing, where to get more companies interested, it needs critical mass of users, but to get the users, there needs to be a reason to go there and enough support for their needs.

It's been in more or less the same adoption state for 10+ years.

[lunardigs]

It all depends on how hip you want to be to the latest hardware and software:
On the one hand, you can set yourself up on a solid foundation of applications and knowledge that can't be easily rug-pulled.
On the other, you won't be able to run out and jump into the latest most exciting thing necessarily. At best it might just work or you'll have to wait a bit--which is usually the case with new hardware, like GPUs. At worst, it'll never come to Linux and you can save your money.

That said, I've used Linux for production (audio, video, graphic design, etc.) going on like 20 years or something.
It's not been easy, but it's been WELL worth it.

Yes, you can game with Steam on Linux and it works really well, even for marquee games that only run on Win/Mac thanks to Proton which is a compatibility layer for Steam. In fact, I was surprised to find out that my Xbox One controllers are recognized and fully work (USB) with Steam/Linux. PS controllers work as well apparently.

RME stuff in general works, including the flagship Fireface UFX series! I have two generations of RME Fireface and also a Babyface Pro FS--they all work and I couldn't be happier about that. Only issue is no TotalMix, which I don't miss anyways.

In terms of distros, hmmm ... I run an Arch based distro lately and it's great. I intend to stick with it.
I've never been a fan of Ubuntu--Debian is another story, which I do like for servers and minimal--nor Fedora/Red Hat. I don't like either of the companies involved with those products.
That said, you might try an Arch based distro like Manjaro, which is a rolling distro ( what is a rolling distro? - https://linuxblog.io/linux-rolling-release-distros/ ).

I think the big thing you'll want to make sure to have though is Pipewire with Wireplumber ( https://bennett.dev/auto-link-pipewire- ... replumber/ ). These are the modern audio streaming bits that makes for a really good Linux audio experience. Installing them is easy and transparent. Previous to this we had to rely upon Jack, which I never loved.

Also, while Pipewire/Wireplumber can do all kinds of cool stuff, you'll want a nice GUI to control it with and for that I'd recommend RaySession, which will give you a patchbay-like experience.

Realistically, there's a lot of little things, but once you get the hang of it, you'll probably be very pleased. You'll also wonder what the hell went so wrong with the commercial OS world and feel better about your decision to abandon it.

[mabian]

You may want to take a look at this... as other said it's a long and hard road, quite a journey, but it sometimes gives back in return

https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php?p ... stcount=72

- Mario

[stoopicus]

Yes, you can game with Steam on Linux and it works really well, even for marquee games that only run on Win/Mac thanks to Proton which is a compatibility layer for Steam. In fact, I was surprised to find out that my Xbox One controllers are recognized and fully work (USB) with Steam/Linux. PS controllers work as well apparently.

I think this is overselling it. Proton is just another Wine layer - in fact it's even the same folks, it's a collab between the Crossover devs and Valve.

I did this route for quite a while. It's okay. I would not describe it as great. There are tons of compatibility issues.

The time I went this route I was on Ubuntu and usually I am pretty happy with Ubuntu. I like the Debian-based distros. Next time I would probably go Arch too though.

Never doing something like Gentoo again

Once again, I love linux, but guys we need to be honest about the experience running AAA games on it - it's not spectacular.

[lunardigs]

Yes, you can game with Steam on Linux and it works really well, even for marquee games that only run on Win/Mac thanks to Proton which is a compatibility layer for Steam. In fact, I was surprised to find out that my Xbox One controllers are recognized and fully work (USB) with Steam/Linux. PS controllers work as well apparently.

I think this is overselling it. Proton is just another Wine layer - in fact it's even the same folks, it's a collab between the Crossover devs and Valve.

I did this route for quite a while. It's okay. I would not describe it as great. There are tons of compatibility issues.

The time I went this route I was on Ubuntu and usually I am pretty happy with Ubuntu. I like the Debian-based distros. Next time I would probably go Arch too though.

Never doing something like Gentoo again

Once again, I love linux, but guys we need to be honest about the experience running AAA games on it - it's not spectacular.

If it's all about gaming, then no. Yet still, gaming on linux is a thing now. I don't remember ever being able to play big titles on Linux before, so ... things are looking pretty good--and that's pretty honest!

[stoopicus]

Getting Valve on board was a big deal and a big boost to CodeWeavers, yeah.

Music production is in a similar place. Bitwig and Reaper help a lot.

But the fact remains that in terms music production it’s still a tiny fraction of availability compared to Windows or MacOS. It’s doable but it’s not going to be the most productive path. It’s something you should choose to do going in with full expectation of its considerable limitations, not something you do because it’s the best choice. In terms of unix-based OSen for music production it’s simply not a reasonable contender compared to MacOS in terms of software availability.

So the question becomes “can it do enough for you?”

The most reasonable answer to that would have to be “yes” for most of us, but mostly because Bitwig is so good and comes with so much that you can be fine with just its builtins.

u-he support is fantastic too and great to see.

[glokraw]

@ kvotchin:

1. With painful honesty, define your needs regarding audio production*, and what you hope to accomplish. Establish a baseline of productive capability, and when you achieve it, STOP upgrading that OS. It is now a studio and _only_ a studio.
2. Be willing to have multiple bootable linux distros on separate drives, for testing new software, and for your other computer-enabled pursuits.
3. Be willing to get the hardware that linux supports, selling, trading, gifting items that don't meet your baseline. (Scarlit has good support now, if your RME is problematic, and Presonus have a linux beta of their Studio One daw, that may be bundled with their various interfaces)

Integrating pro rompler/synth sounds from Korg, Roland, Yamaha, Arturia, Nord** etc should be easy in Reaper and Bitwig, and eliminate futzing with NI's Native Access, or IK's 'Program Manager' and other app registration villains, while providing a wide range of sounds used to make both hits and coasters

Linux kernel modules for video, and alsa sound module support typically lag behind win/mac,
so getting the newest computer mobo, and the shiniest bits and bobs could backfire on you!
I use an ancient i7 8gig mobo, ancient nVidia 9400GT video card, and ancient mAudio 24/96 soundcard, the sound is fine, and my untouchable _studio_ fails me not You may have far higher needs than I do, so that's a trail you alone can blaze, but it's not that hard.

*for electric guitar, linux now has 'NeuralRack' to host NAM files and IR's in a nice gui, sounding as great as the captures you acquire.

For Piano, PianoTeq is native linux, and hard to beat, with a range of extra models for vibes, harp etc

Effects are plentiful and of high quality, should daw-supplied effects fall short at times. Kazrog have ported theirs to linux recently. I tried the Avalon EQ, looks like a very nice plugin.

AVLinux distro (based on debian MX Linux has a release candidate with a gui (wine4vst) to easily install wine, and the plugin-wrapper yabridge. It will install wine-staging 9.21, known to work well with most of the small-shop and freeware plugins that use standard installers. It also will install a gui called 'Yadbridge', that greatly simplifies yabridge (note the spelling difference) wrapping vst plugins for use in Reaper and other linux daws. I installed the pre-release, that also included a pipewire connections/setup panel called 'Cable' that worked well. A selection of old 32 bit freeware, and new 64 bit commercial softwares worked well. The full release of AVLinux will arrive, but I don't know when, and the dev recommends Ubuntu Studio in the interim.

** A rompler/synth is very handy for those serious about practice I have an IK UNO synth hooked up to one, and it's great fun to drive the rompler sound combos from the UNO arpeggiator

Mi dos centavos

[camsr]

When going back and forth between Linux and Windows sample paths are not interchangeable, you have to remap them, both in drum samplers and DAW...

Thanks for spotting this.