"art" dj-ing ... ?

[rachmiel]

greetings all around!

this is my first posting to a kvr forum, so forgive any heinous kvr-iquette faux pas's i am making.

i am interested in trying my hand(s) at dj-ing. alas, my music (and the music i love) is very (very!) non-4/4. in fact, it's non-N/4, non-N/8, models its rhythmic flow after spoken dialogue (or interestingly broken machines) rather than a metronome/grid. clearly, my mixes would not be appropriate for conventional club (or other) dancing.

so my question is: do djs ever dj for *listening* rather than *dancing* audiences? or is this considered blasphemous, i.e., is dj-ing, by definition, an activity to enable/inspire dance?

thanks,

rachMiel

[tuz]

welcome to kvr. I don't even own reaktor but know your fame. as for the djing part I have no idea. sorry... just wanted to say welcome to kvr and hope you'll find a good answer to your question.

[Mr. Tunes]

so my question is: do djs ever dj for *listening* rather than *dancing* audiences? or is this considered blasphemous, i.e., is dj-ing, by definition, an activity to enable/inspire dance?

welcome to the forum. i think there is actually a space for that in many cities. many of my djing gigs have been to rather sedate audiences who enjoy the music but are given the option to sit in the bar.

you have to find the right bar and you will be able to do whatever you want and be respected for that.
also in time look into teaming up with artistic dance groups that put shows on in bars.

i had a dream the other night that i had to go to a native reservation in rochester to give a product demo. i think there are bars for you in your city. i wonder if rochester has grown much since i've last been there in the mid 90s?

[Eric Bourne]

A "DJ bar" is what you're after. There are a few in San Francisco... I dunno if it's just a S.F. thing though.

[bwilbee]

Hi rechmiel,

I recon Merce Cunningham would have a pretty good try at dancing to your selection, i've been djing random things for a year or so now and dont worry too much about what time signatures, if any, i'm mixing, to me a dj set should take someone on a journey, thats where, imo the 'art' of djing comes in, its about song selection and knowing what timbres will merge well into one another as much as it is beatmatching and scratching ect. - anyone can learn to be technicly good at matching up the speed of 2 records, but if the music isnt interesting i couldnt care less.

Most of my mixes are for myself to listen to, and to give out to friends to expose them to things i have been enjoying, and the mood of my mixes typicaly spans many of genres, so i guess my style is very much different to that of your typical club dj. You would think that it wouldent go down too well with the 'general public' but i've played at a few partys (usualy around the 6 am period when people cant manage to stand up never mind dance) where the 'vibe' has gone down really well.

remember - there are no rules to making music - all that matters is that you enjoy yourself in the prossess of making it and if you do then hopefully others will enjoy listening to it as well.

good luck,

Ben

[rachmiel]

thanks for the responses, everyone.

i'm getting the sense that my so-called "art" dj-ing is unconventional, but perhaps do-able ... in the right city/club. good to know.

next dj question (and these are, i know, very naive):

where do djs play?

- clubs
- bars
- parties
- galleries ?
- concert halls ?
- dance performances ?

thanks,

rachMiel

[bwilbee]

Nice site by the way, i think we have a pretty similar philosophy with regards to music, liking the cLog idea alot - may have to rip it off hehe.

I too experience that unexplained plesure when i hear that satisfying click coming from the fridge.

if your interested in going a bit deeper into visual music programing then we are trying to orgonise a group perchase of max/msp in the buy/sell forum that may interest you - not sure if its gona work out but if it does there could be a BIG discount on the $500 price tag.

a quick note on your comment on the rhythmic focus of much modern electronic composision - to me the focus on rhythm and timbre are the things that stand out in contemporary music, sure alot of people don't exploit the possibilitys for all they are worth (i blame the hardware manufatures) but there is still room to develop in this area. This way of making music is so much different to everything (talking in terms of western music) that has gone before. Your looking at hundreds of years of harmonicly and melodicly inspired composison, and then, with the advent of digital technology, everything has changed and we can look at music from so many different perspectives.

[bwilbee]

where ever they let me play! i'd get on with practising and opotunitys should come your way... i have mostly played at partys, managed to wrangle a set at a small festival thats being orgonised - but there again there aren't many places to play living on a small island at the bottom of england. A word of warning tho - pick your venues carefuly - the 'general public' like to hear things they expect to hear (have heard before) from my experience, playing Autechre's gantz graf or a bit of John Cage aint gona make you any friends in a small pub.

[videzyrah]

I think some guys are wanting to refer to themselves as 'turntablists' rather than 'dj's' if they are approaching their gear as though it is an instrument. I think 'turntablism' is more geared towards a listening audience than a dancing audience.

[Polychrome]

Art openings at galleries would probably be a nice venue for your stuff, in addition to the more standard venues such as clubs.

[Mr. Tunes]

if you pick a club to pursue, make sure it is a certain type of "after hours" club as mentioned before. also there are certain bars that are really like coffee houses where cool people hang out but dont dance, and they dont want to dance so they go to places like this. maybe a spacey internet cafe? maybe a weird type of arcade? i really dont know much about your city but in a place like Toronto near you there is a lot of variety in terms of venue selection.

[hjack]

you could play here at kvr and listen some sets, but for that you need the key
ihihi

[dystonia_ek]

There's definitely non-dance oriented DJing in certain circles... tends to happen in one-off events more than clubs, though a few adventurous venues will occasionally dabble. If people like William Bennett (of Whitehouse) can get DJ gigs playing noise and electroacoustic music then there must be others...

I like your Reaktor work very much BTW, and welcome to this crazy place.

[endmusik]

I did a continuous night of sound collage and rhythmic and non-rhythmic noise at a club for a couple of years, to low attendance, but it was well received in general (mostly because the people who came were freaking alcoholics )

If there is a club near you with a night that doesn't normally have entertainment (live band or dj's) then that's the best night to see if they'll let you hold events. I always had a great time doing my night, and would love to do it again some day.

[dystonia_ek]

I did a continuous night of sound collage and rhythmic and non-rhythmic noise at a club for a couple of years, to low attendance, but it was well received in general (mostly because the people who came were freaking alcoholics )

If there is a club near you with a night that doesn't normally have entertainment (live band or dj's) then that's the best night to see if they'll let you hold events. I always had a great time doing my night, and would love to do it again some day.

Hey Mike, you ever thought of hooking up with the Noizguild/Tesco USA folks, also in NYC? Seems some of your stuff would be right up their alley.