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Location: My Computer
Start Date: ASAP (following de-frag and PC re-boot)
Salary: Slave (you are bought)
Benefits: Fantastic working environment - Tracktion (PC)
We are a single audio production individual who enjoys remixing songs in much the same way that 2 Many DJs does. We are looking for a talented application that can either function as a VST or a separate application. You must be able to time-stretch audio loops to a very high standard, and possibly incorporate decent audio mangling and editing functionality. The ability to integrate with Tracktion via ReWire would be a great benefit and stability is a must.
Application is via marketing websites only and demos must be available.
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In other words, I really like to mess with samples, either mixing bootlegs like 2 Many DJs or creating tracks out of samples like the man-god DJ Shadow. It is well documented that Tracktion's time-stretching doesn't cut the mustard yet, so I was wondering what other apps are out there that can time-stretch really well and ideally have other audio mangling functions built in. I would like something along the lines of Tracktion, where I can get loops I have time-stretched to play together and mess around with, then I can import them back into Tracktion and create my audio quilt (so a WAV editor doesn't cut the mustard).
What do you people suggest would suit these requirements? Replies via forum post would be acceptable, but the inclusion of a CV and covering letter will greatly improve your chances.
Flexible Loop Mangler
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- KVRian
- 926 posts since 15 Mar, 2004 from Tokyo, Japan
Hi,
I would strongly recommend Ableton Live for playing/syncing/triggering and, to some extent, messing around with loops. Also Live has a solid pack of useful fx of actually pretty good quality, that u can still use even if you use the program as a Rewire slave (it also supports VST fx but not in Rewire mode).
As for mangling loops, I cannot think of anything better than Zero-x's BeatCreator, you can do basic beatslicing with it or you can just turn loops around until they are totally (and I mean totally) unrecognisable - far better than Recycle, although timestretch and tune are separate i BeatCreator.
This is a separate app though, but a very flexible one.
I would strongly recommend Ableton Live for playing/syncing/triggering and, to some extent, messing around with loops. Also Live has a solid pack of useful fx of actually pretty good quality, that u can still use even if you use the program as a Rewire slave (it also supports VST fx but not in Rewire mode).
As for mangling loops, I cannot think of anything better than Zero-x's BeatCreator, you can do basic beatslicing with it or you can just turn loops around until they are totally (and I mean totally) unrecognisable - far better than Recycle, although timestretch and tune are separate i BeatCreator.
This is a separate app though, but a very flexible one.
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- KVRAF
- 2417 posts since 17 Jun, 2003
Concrete FX's dicer is also worth a look, quite cheap and is a VST. Small download too, and has a demo version. Rather nice little bit of software that i keep meaning to buy ... but then remember i'm supposed to be paying off debts 
"my gosh it's a friggin hardware"
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- KVRAF
- 4644 posts since 28 Nov, 2002 from Chicago
Acid is still the king of looping/stretching blah, but development seems to be somewhat subpar now Sony own it.
I guess it depends whether you need time stretch or whether recycle style splitting work for your needs.
There is a whole big article on using things like recycle in this months SoS.
As for Acid, I dunno if it can be rewired.
I guess it depends whether you need time stretch or whether recycle style splitting work for your needs.
There is a whole big article on using things like recycle in this months SoS.
As for Acid, I dunno if it can be rewired.
Someone shot the food. Remember: don't shoot food!
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- KVRAF
- 1974 posts since 21 Jun, 2002 from Earth
if you don't need the time stretching, you can actually handle some serious mangling within tracktion itself. Purely based on the fact that you can slice very quick manually.. and you can import those slices right into the sampler. it sounds like you are into using audio clips vs. midi... and tracktion is really good for working with audio. If you really want to timestretch loops and use tracktion, I think Ableton will be your only choice. Another alternative for severe mangling is Audiomulch. you could sit and tweak while recording you experiments.. then import it all into Tracktion, and begin assembling the masterpiece. 
I would have to agree tho... Acid is the best loop handler ever. Even in it's age, it's still the king! I think it's timestretching algo is better than Live's. But live is SO easy to work with realtime.. that it might be more inspirational.
I would have to agree tho... Acid is the best loop handler ever. Even in it's age, it's still the king! I think it's timestretching algo is better than Live's. But live is SO easy to work with realtime.. that it might be more inspirational.
ModuLR / Radio
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- KVRian
- 1110 posts since 31 Aug, 2001 from Los Angeles, CA
I personally feel Live is superior to ACID (well all soft) in realtime stretch handling. It can stretch in near-identical methods to ACID (non looping segments) as well as other modes for non-rhythmic elements (Tones etc). Of course with most technology, there is artifacts that cruder methods (ACID) provide you might find desirable.I would have to agree tho... Acid is the best loop handler ever. Even in it's age, it's still the king! I think it's timestretching algo is better than Live's. But live is SO easy to work with realtime.. that it might be more inspirational.
One thing I love about ACID is the ability to make a bunch of edits on a loop, clone this track, and then drag another loop on to it. Your edits are now taking place on this second loop! Cool stuff.
Im using Ableton Live and Devine-Machine for all my loop manipulation needs. ACID pissed me off with one too many charged upgrades and I abandoned it with no remorse. Now my paid updates go to Ableton. BTW, Devine-Machine is currently sold with free updates for life, and with what is planned for the future this is a pretty good investment. Nothing else makes loop-manipulation *performable* like DM does.
-Steve
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- KVRian
- 565 posts since 16 Dec, 2002 from Pittsburgh, PA
FL Studio would be perfect for what you want, except no loop stretching. You can kind of do it, but it is not perfect. I have a good feeling they will add it eventually.
Here is what you can do with FL. The Beat Slicer and Granulizer have lots of cool sample mangling features. The Granulizer can do weird Aphex Twin style sounds and can be real harsh. The Beat Slicer is nice for chpping up samples. Another nice feature is the Wave Traveller. You can create some nice scratching sounds, but with some experimentation it can do lots more.
I have not used ReWire with FL Studio. So if you can wait for loop stretching or know a good work around that suits what you need to do, check it out. Also, it can run as a VST.
Here is what you can do with FL. The Beat Slicer and Granulizer have lots of cool sample mangling features. The Granulizer can do weird Aphex Twin style sounds and can be real harsh. The Beat Slicer is nice for chpping up samples. Another nice feature is the Wave Traveller. You can create some nice scratching sounds, but with some experimentation it can do lots more.
I have not used ReWire with FL Studio. So if you can wait for loop stretching or know a good work around that suits what you need to do, check it out. Also, it can run as a VST.
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 63 posts since 7 Aug, 2002 from Bristol, UK
Hi People, thanks for all your replies.
It seems that for now, Acid is the best choice, after messing with the demo, the Beatmapper thing is truly awesome, and coupled with its excellent time stretching, I can truly mash up tunes to my heart's content.
If Tracktion's time stretching gets sorted, then I can stick to using only that, since the cut and paste options are far superior as Mod said, it is so much easier to work with. But until then I will have to just make do with using a friends copy of Acid, since the price is way too steep.
Ableton is also pretty good, but more as a scratch pad I thik, I've already got the cheap cut down version (Steinberg's Remix, which does the job pretty well, but no ReWire).
Guess I'll just have to keep hassling Jules to sort out the time stretching algos for v2.
I think the beatslicing stuff aint so necessary for me, I have pHATmatik PRO and Orion Platinum's Sampler's cutty thing. Of course I remember the day when Jules said Tracktion's sampler would incorporate a beat slicer, but that was eons ago...
Thanks again for all your input.
It seems that for now, Acid is the best choice, after messing with the demo, the Beatmapper thing is truly awesome, and coupled with its excellent time stretching, I can truly mash up tunes to my heart's content.
If Tracktion's time stretching gets sorted, then I can stick to using only that, since the cut and paste options are far superior as Mod said, it is so much easier to work with. But until then I will have to just make do with using a friends copy of Acid, since the price is way too steep.
Ableton is also pretty good, but more as a scratch pad I thik, I've already got the cheap cut down version (Steinberg's Remix, which does the job pretty well, but no ReWire).
Guess I'll just have to keep hassling Jules to sort out the time stretching algos for v2.
I think the beatslicing stuff aint so necessary for me, I have pHATmatik PRO and Orion Platinum's Sampler's cutty thing. Of course I remember the day when Jules said Tracktion's sampler would incorporate a beat slicer, but that was eons ago...
Thanks again for all your input.
