recording 2GB+ wav's in traction (title edited)

[chico.co.uk]

This is pretty rare stuff. I mean really, 3 hours of solid recording, not an everyday requirement. This board has been going for 2 years and this is the first time it's cropped up, and the fault seems to lie in the WAV file specification at least in part.

I seem to remember it coming up once before, someone else had the same thing, a long time back, and again their attitude was very much "I CANNOT BELIEVE no'one has ever tested this, or came across it before, it's SUCH AN OVERSIGHT" etc etc, cue another year or so passes before anyone else even notices the limitations of the wav file format size.

In other words, despite what mmmatt clearly thinks, he's very much in the minority of users. Most people just don't do three hour straight multitrack recordings on a daily basis. Amazingly, neither do most beta testers. Besides, the problem is the wav file format. So the only workaround would be to autosplit wavs as they approach 2 gig per channel in size.

Which presumably can be done, but so can all sorts of things, given unlimited time and resources. It's a question of priorities.

Show of hands for beat slicing features? Show of hands for folder tracks? Show of hands for ability to record 2 hour jam sessions with no breaks?

yeah, thought so ...

[djsubject]

Maybe I'm coming off like a prick, but I don't feel Mackie took the time to learn about this product before they started selling it, or learning the basic limitations of 24bit audio for that matter. I have an excuse because I'm new to 24bit, but Mackie has been selling 24bit recording equiptment for years.

Matt

dood like you was told by mackie

you got it for free

this software is made by 1 man (not mackie) & thay are also new kids on the block when it comes to Tracktion,

now this has come to lite i am shore it will be fixed soon

now chill bun a spliff & go make some musik (in tracktion of corse)

[Beno]

Well to clarify, "Mackie" are aware that wave files have size limits. This isn't new information. I'll bet the particular tech you talked to even new about it. But from your original bug report it might not have been apparent that this is the cause of the problem, especially because this is the first time I've seen this bug. After a quick four hour test record, I easily duplicated the problem. So we now know about. It's been entered into our database. We'll be sure it gets fixed so that long recordings are not corrupted. Thanks for your help in the matter Matt.

Ben

[nuisance sonore]

After a quick four hour test record

A quick four hour test? How do you do a "quick" four hour test

[Crossinger]

After a quick four hour test record

A quick four hour test? How do you do a "quick" four hour test

If there's "Groundhog day" each day, then - according to Einstein's theories - hours are squashed to minutes!

[SuitcaseOfLizards]

After a quick four hour test record

A quick four hour test? How do you do a "quick" four hour test

Easy! Start it recording (doesn't have to have anything coming in, maybe set up a test tone or something) - go to the pub for a few hours - come back and look! Time goes faster when you're at the pub, you know...

[Mr. Tingle]

Good to know its beening looked at. It is not inconcievable that Tracktion will get alot more long recording sessions now that the Onyx desks are being sold with Tracktion. I should like to be able to trust in T sould the situation ever arise for me. cheers Matt.

[mmmatt]

Thanks guys,
I do appreciate all of the support I've gotten from this forum. Thanks Beno for making sure this gets looked at. Kurt was the tech I talked to and he did the same 2hr test as I was doing... never made mention of a filesize being too big.

Matt

[voidar]

I know it will record more than a 2 GB wav though...

I have been using a mix of stereo and mono wav's for most of my testing, but I have also tried all stereo or all mono. It hasn't ever made a difference as far as I can tell. The bulk of the successes I have had have been when I fell asleep on my couch watching tv, (waiting for that 3 hr point so I could hit the stop button) only to wake up in the morning and find I had a perfect 4 hr recording. The stereo files at 24/96 for 4hrs are over 8GB.

Matt

Ever tried automatically punching in and punching out at around 2.5 h? You should be able to test things this way .

But it really doesn't matter anymore really.

I second an auto-split function. Or at least the possiblity to pre-allocate files, which actually is possible; there is a possibily to insert empty audio-files into tracktion, but not to write into them. What's up with that?
If this was possible it would be no problem allocating multiple 1hour 24/96 files and then recording into them.

[cellular]

1) If you let Tracktion record over the wav file limit, curroption occurs of the resulting file.

b) Sometimes the long recorded files disapear after recording. Can you clarify for me, does this only happen for files over the wav limit? Or does it happen for smalller 'long' files as well?

You sure count funny Beno... 1, b, ?

Oh, and when is T2 coming out?

[Todd24]

You sure count funny Beno... 1, b, ?

Oh, and when is T2 coming out?

I hear its comming out March 2b

[rockstar_not]

This is pretty rare stuff. I mean really, 3 hours of solid recording, not an everyday requirement. This board has been going for 2 years and this is the first time it's cropped up, and the fault seems to lie in the WAV file specification at least in part.

I seem to remember it coming up once before, someone else had the same thing, a long time back, and again their attitude was very much "I CANNOT BELIEVE no'one has ever tested this, or came across it before, it's SUCH AN OVERSIGHT" etc etc, cue another year or so passes before anyone else even notices the limitations of the wav file format size.

In other words, despite what mmmatt clearly thinks, he's very much in the minority of users. Most people just don't do three hour straight multitrack recordings on a daily basis. Amazingly, neither do most beta testers. Besides, the problem is the wav file format. So the only workaround would be to autosplit wavs as they approach 2 gig per channel in size.

Which presumably can be done, but so can all sorts of things, given unlimited time and resources. It's a question of priorities.

Show of hands for beat slicing features? Show of hands for folder tracks? Show of hands for ability to record 2 hour jam sessions with no breaks?

yeah, thought so ...

What chico and Tingle said - I agree.

I would just get nervous about the partition sizes and length of files. 200 GB split into 3 partitions is only 66 GB each. Somewhere back on page 3 or something, I seem to remember a 52 GB filesize being mentioned. Maybe I'm just stooooopid, but is it healthy for any drive and OS to have 1 project take up such a huge amount of 1 drive?

Question - is there any jam band worth recording at 24/96? I mean, even Phish isn't that good - and I like them.

While I don't say this often - in fact this is the first I've said it regarding Tracktion - this problem will persist until more money is thrown at it with likely a solution other than Tracktion. This is not Mackie's problem. It's an 80$ application for heaven's sakes written by one dude. I wonder how many people it takes over at AVID just to keep the ship afloat? Can you even do this with ProTools and which system - some multi thousands system, right?

I read TapeOp, Mix, Electronic Musician, and sometimes S.O.S., and I've never heard of anything like this mentioned by readers nor by pro recording guys. Seems like pretty much a one-off situation here Matt - at least amongst this userbase.

-Scott

[Todd24]

I was thinking...seeing as how Jerry is dead. You must be recording Phish. Nobody plays 2 hours straight without pause. Who the hell wants to hear that?

Sounds like a rough gig.

Anyways if there is an easy way to fix it for you, I hope they do.

[chimmy]

Is there a general consensus resulting from this discussion as to the best current method to accomplish "live" stereo (2 track) recording? My situation would be nothing longer than a 45 minute set. From what I've read here am I on the right track (no pun intended) to use the stop record/start record method? When recording a show, the least amount of clicks on the laptop is preferable.

Also, can someone point me in the right direction where I can know how to calculate file size beforehand, by using specific numerical values for bit depth, sample rate and # of tracks in order to determine file size?

I do have 20-30 seconds between songs and I'm wanting to test 8 track simultaneous live recording. I have time to stop/start record between songs. Will it work this way in T1, recording all songs in one edit, then moving each song to it's own seperate edit for mixing back at the studio?

Thanks in advance.....chimmy

[rockstar_not]

Is there a general consensus resulting from this discussion as to the best current method to accomplish "live" stereo (2 track) recording? My situation would be nothing longer than a 45 minute set. From what I've read here am I on the right track (no pun intended) to use the stop record/start record method? When recording a show, the least amount of clicks on the laptop is preferable.

Also, can someone point me in the right direction where I can know how to calculate file size beforehand, by using specific numerical values for bit depth, sample rate and # of tracks in order to determine file size?

I do have 20-30 seconds between songs and I'm wanting to test 8 track simultaneous live recording. I have time to stop/start record between songs. Will it work this way in T1, recording all songs in one edit, then moving each song to it's own seperate edit for mixing back at the studio?

Thanks in advance.....chimmy

chimmy, the only one I have committed to memory is 16bit 44.1kHz = approximately 5MB/minute per channel or track. So 2 channels (1 track of L/R stereo) is 10MB / minute. I don't know about the others - but I did read through this whole thread, and there was a mention of something similar for other depths& rates earlier in this now 6 page thread.

Also, I found this page which is handy if it's right. At least the 16/44.1 info is close to what I've always experienced.

http://www.sounddevices.com/tech/recordtime.htm

It also mentions the FAT32 4GB filesize limit previously mentioned in this thread.

-Scott

-Scott