Reasons why you are excited about T2 :)

[Lunch Money]

Fair enough... I can't even pretend to argue about Live because I don't know it well enough. After a few days, I discovered that I disliked it immensely. I know this borders on blasphemy, but I'd rather use Cubase than Live.

Regarding Tracktion's automation-- OK, you're not the only one who thinks it's a nightmare (though I haven't seen anyone in particular complaining), but that says nothing. I know of plenty of people who think it's sweet. The fact that we each know people who either dislike it or like it is irrelevant.

Greg

[braj]

After a few days, I discovered that I disliked it immensely.

What about it did you dislike immensely?

[jens]

Fair enough... I can't even pretend to argue about Live because I don't know it well enough. After a few days, I discovered that I disliked it immensely. I know this borders on blasphemy, but I'd rather use Cubase than Live.

Regarding Tracktion's automation-- OK, you're not the only one who thinks it's a nightmare (though I haven't seen anyone in particular complaining), but that says nothing. I know of plenty of people who think it's sweet. The fact that we each know people who either dislike it or like it is irrelevant.

Greg

yeah - you're right of course - it's irrelevant

but on the other hand I listed several reasons why exactly it is shite...

and b.t.w.: there's nothing wrong about disliking Live - either you like something or you don't...

the only problem I had with your original post about it was that your reasoning appeared to be factually wrong...

[lightshy]

The downside is high CPU use.

that's why i want to ditch live. i don/t have a really powerfull machine and it's really annoying when live crashes or stutters when i'm right on the right groove. i've tried t1.6 a bit and it seems practically lightweight. it starts in about 8-10 seconds with a full plugin search (compared to 45-120 seconds it takes live to do it)

[IIRs]

- it doesn't move when you move the clip it belongs to

But automation doesn't belong to clips..

you can't move more than one envelope at once)

soon..

- you can only read the values when you're moving the nodes

- you have to move the nodes by a huge amount before T reacts

I would class these as minor annoyances at most..

- there is no support for curves

Clip fade in/out has curves to choose from. Would be nice I agree, but not essential for most things..

- you can't easily assign an envelope you have drawn to a different parameter

- you can't easily assign an envelope you have drawn to an additional parameter

Cut, Copy & Paste too hard for you?

[braj]

The downside is high CPU use.

that's why i want to ditch live. i don/t have a really powerfull machine and it's really annoying when live crashes or stutters when i'm right on the right groove. i've tried t1.6 a bit and it seems practically lightweight. it starts in about 8-10 seconds with a full plugin search (compared to 45-120 seconds it takes live to do it)

Yeah, that's about the only reason I'm still not satisfied with Live4. Everything else works really well for me. Besides the fact that I'm a computer junkie and love playing with new software.

[ModuLR]

I think Live's automation is pretty schweet... primarily because it handles automation clips, as well as linear types of automation. I would love to see automation based clips in Tracktion cos it would be sick! I also like the fact that you can grab a section between two points and move it. It's probably one of the best things I actually like abot live. Beyond that I really hate trying to construct something linear in it. I just can't navigate it nearly as fast as T. I really detest the fact it doesn't utilize a two button mouse. This combo in tracktion, as trivial as it may seem, is killer for the way I work. Scroll left/right with the mouse wheel.. and rightclick+drag to zoom in out. I don't care for the mixer routing either... I'd much rather use a flat out modular object oriented interface like the racks, as it makes more sense to me. Lastly, it's a huge vst cpu hog.. I thought people where exaggerating, but it's eats cpu hardcore.

That being said, I find it fun to play stringing clips together, but ultimately it's not the way I work. I can rough ideas in Live, but beyond that I usually get stuck in loops.. it doesn't inspire me to go further.

[Lunch Money]

the only problem I had with your original post about it was that your reasoning appeared to be factually wrong...

Ah, but you see-- I didn't POST any facts. I only asked questions.

Greg

[AD80]

I personally cant stand Live.

Why not?

Its just the overall feel of the app that bugs me. Its like a more square rigid version of Tracktion. It also eats CPU like a hog. Little things like having to change snap to do things bugs me. It doesnt flow right. Having to alt-click to drop the playback cursor somewhere bugs me. It doesnt feel right. I also wasnt impressed with the sound of its time-stretch (I know they changed that in the new version but I havent tryed it). I mean I'm no Live expert but I've used it enough to know I dont like it.

[jens]

- it doesn't move when you move the clip it belongs to

But automation doesn't belong to clips..

apparently you overread my explanation for this statement - therefor I copied it to here for you from my original post

"i.e. you can't lock them to a clip"

you can't move more than one envelope at once)

soon...

fine, but we've been discussing explicitly only T1's automation - here's a reminder of your previous conversation:

oh, and even Live 1's automation was far better than T1's...

Whats so bad about T1's automation?

serious question?

tbh i'm not quite sure if it makes much sense to answer it as I think T2's automation will be much improved...

serious question?

Of course!

It didn't move when space was inserted into tracks, and there was no way to move multiple nodes together. Anything else?

- you can only read the values when you're moving the nodes

- you have to move the nodes by a huge amount before T reacts

I would class these as minor annoyances at most..

good for you - makes me wonder though how much you're using automation anyway... - for me it's a major annoyance - but everyone can make up his own mind - I'm just stating the facts

- there is no support for curves

Clip fade in/out has curves to choose from. Would be nice I agree, but not essential for most things..

yeah, sure - the fade curves are immensely helpful if you're automating pan or fx parameters...

- you can't easily assign an envelope you have drawn to a different parameter

- you can't easily assign an envelope you have drawn to an additional parameter

Cut, Copy & Paste too hard for you?

Yes, indeed - too hard for me!

[jens]

I just can't navigate it nearly as fast as T. I really detest the fact it doesn't utilize a two button mouse. This combo in tracktion, as trivial as it may seem, is killer for the way I work. Scroll left/right with the mouse wheel.. and rightclick+drag to zoom in out.

completely agreed!

[jens]

the only problem I had with your original post about it was that your reasoning appeared to be factually wrong...

Ah, but you see-- I didn't POST any facts. I only asked questions.

Greg

but by the way you formulated your post it appeared to me as if you made statements ironically disguised as questions - must be my bad english though of course...

[JazAddict]

Back to the original question for a moment.

I'm looking forward to MTC.

K, back to the "Live-bashing/loving"

[Warmonger]

Avoiding the whole Live vs. Tracktion debate spawned in this thread, I honestly have to say there's really no feature that makes me want to get T2. I'm interested to see how the piano roll is changed, but other than that, almost all the newly announced features are irrelevant to me.

Even so, as soon as I get the money, I will be buying it. That's how good T1 is.

[jens]

you can't move more than one envelope at once)

soon..

how?