On the flip side what you might find is more hardware manufacturers supported the Mackie Control protocol..I Want A Midi Controller For My Birthday
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- KVRAF
- 1974 posts since 21 Jun, 2002 from Earth
yes barbarossa.. Mackie is pure evil.. god forbid they would want to sell their products.. On the flip side what you might find is more hardware manufacturers supported the Mackie Control protocol..
On the flip side what you might find is more hardware manufacturers supported the Mackie Control protocol..ModuLR / Radio
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- Beware the Quoth
- 35500 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair
Barbarossa quoth Whiterabbit
Learn to read. Its 'Whyterabbyt'
first i suggest you to become grown up, afterwards get experience in mixing to understand the topic, before you piss on other peoples feet.
Firstly, I suggest you actually pay attention to the contents of the thread you are actually engaged in. Its not about mixing, its about the capabilities of specific software and specific hardware. Not mixing. The fact that its hardware or software that might be used in mixing doesnt make it about mixing.
You not being able to tell the difference is your problem, but since you cant, maybe you shuld be the one growing up a bit.
And if there's piss on your feet, its because you obviously need your nappy changed, cos its overflowing, sunshine.
Your arguments are ridiculous and you seem still not to get the point.
Ah, really. Well, thats all very well for you to say, but since there are people here using controllers without feedback, and you can't tell the difference between the requirements of hardware and the requirements of software, it would kind of imply that your grasp on the facts is minimal.
So, bereft of facts, 'ridiculous' is all you've got to show of yourself.
Once again just for you: the point is, that Mackie restricts parameter feedback to their own, very expensive units
Or those cheap units which are compatible.
[/i](or units with an emulation-mode, which is a restriced mode anyway, because it can't be adopted) which is the oposite of user-friendly politics, because T is a sequencer used mostly by non-pros, which are not willing/able to go for a MC or C4.[/i]
Would you like to try and rephrase that with some grammar in it, please?
While more and more other sequencers support parameter feedback, the plan is, most T-users should be excluded, if they do not invest in a MC/C4.
Oh is that 'the plan'. Thanks for your insight.
Additionally, the Behringer units had a huge impact on the market and will force other companies to produce much better controllers with feedback-functionality but Mackie obviously doesn't want T2 users to profit from that. They primarily want to sell their own controllers with T and not improve T, which should be observed cautiously.
And your factual basis for this?
[i[You also stated, there were no total-recall units for under 100 BP available, which is plain wrong.[/i]
Please provide one reference for a unit with motorised faders, with an RRP of less than £100, that is available right now. Thank you.
And because you obviously have no clue about the topic: mixing with knobs is indeed quite easy and with some practice very good possible, while mixing and tweaking without a visual feedback on the console is not possible in a productive way.
Im more used to mixing with motorised faders than knobs, on ProTools systems, as well as my own Sonar rig, thanks. But Ive used knobs as well.
And its a complete nonsense to say that its 'not possible in a productive way'. You might not be able to, but plenty of other people are obviously more talented at it than you.
That's the reason, why feedback is really necessary and is the future in the controller-market, from which T2 users should be excluded, if they don't pay $$$.
No, its why you think its necessary. Which is a bit different from whether it can be done without it at all, as you claimed. And its definitely different from your nonsense about Mackie's supposed 'evil masterplan'
The problem with non-touch sensitive faders like from the BCF is, that it doesn't support a latch-mode, so it is necessary to push a button to update the automation, which tends to be of a big problem, in difficult mixing-situations.
Quite irrelevant to your statements about parameter feedback, your ad hominem attacks, or your drivel about Mackie. Witter on...
So rotary units like the BCR could have been a real great solution for T2 users, too.
Of course; no T2 user could ever have made use of the BCR. How clever of you to notice.
The Behringer units would have fit almost perfectly for most T2-users but since some very clever people like you prefer to attack others instead of Mackie, Mackie will probably see absolutely no reason, to rethink their IMO very nasty move against the user-base.
My you do rank your own self-importance overmuch dont you. I guess that makes up for your nonsense.
This is about someone choosing a controller, in case you'd forgotten. Not your little soapbox spiel.
To exclude such a huge improvement in functionality, just to sell their own controllers is not acceptable for me and T2 is not that cheap anymore, that this would be sacrified nor could it be argued, that it needs cross-subsidy and i'm afraid this gives already an impression, in what direction T will develop.
Wow; what an amazing grap of gibberish you bring to your paranoic fantasies.
Jules is obviously no longer the mastermind.
But if no one stands up and complains, we will just get, what we deserve...
Yeah, fight da power.
Learn to read. Its 'Whyterabbyt'
first i suggest you to become grown up, afterwards get experience in mixing to understand the topic, before you piss on other peoples feet.
Firstly, I suggest you actually pay attention to the contents of the thread you are actually engaged in. Its not about mixing, its about the capabilities of specific software and specific hardware. Not mixing. The fact that its hardware or software that might be used in mixing doesnt make it about mixing.
You not being able to tell the difference is your problem, but since you cant, maybe you shuld be the one growing up a bit.
And if there's piss on your feet, its because you obviously need your nappy changed, cos its overflowing, sunshine.
Your arguments are ridiculous and you seem still not to get the point.
Ah, really. Well, thats all very well for you to say, but since there are people here using controllers without feedback, and you can't tell the difference between the requirements of hardware and the requirements of software, it would kind of imply that your grasp on the facts is minimal.
So, bereft of facts, 'ridiculous' is all you've got to show of yourself.
Once again just for you: the point is, that Mackie restricts parameter feedback to their own, very expensive units
Or those cheap units which are compatible.
[/i](or units with an emulation-mode, which is a restriced mode anyway, because it can't be adopted) which is the oposite of user-friendly politics, because T is a sequencer used mostly by non-pros, which are not willing/able to go for a MC or C4.[/i]
Would you like to try and rephrase that with some grammar in it, please?
While more and more other sequencers support parameter feedback, the plan is, most T-users should be excluded, if they do not invest in a MC/C4.
Oh is that 'the plan'. Thanks for your insight.
Additionally, the Behringer units had a huge impact on the market and will force other companies to produce much better controllers with feedback-functionality but Mackie obviously doesn't want T2 users to profit from that. They primarily want to sell their own controllers with T and not improve T, which should be observed cautiously.
And your factual basis for this?
[i[You also stated, there were no total-recall units for under 100 BP available, which is plain wrong.[/i]
Please provide one reference for a unit with motorised faders, with an RRP of less than £100, that is available right now. Thank you.
And because you obviously have no clue about the topic: mixing with knobs is indeed quite easy and with some practice very good possible, while mixing and tweaking without a visual feedback on the console is not possible in a productive way.
Im more used to mixing with motorised faders than knobs, on ProTools systems, as well as my own Sonar rig, thanks. But Ive used knobs as well.
And its a complete nonsense to say that its 'not possible in a productive way'. You might not be able to, but plenty of other people are obviously more talented at it than you.
That's the reason, why feedback is really necessary and is the future in the controller-market, from which T2 users should be excluded, if they don't pay $$$.
No, its why you think its necessary. Which is a bit different from whether it can be done without it at all, as you claimed. And its definitely different from your nonsense about Mackie's supposed 'evil masterplan'
The problem with non-touch sensitive faders like from the BCF is, that it doesn't support a latch-mode, so it is necessary to push a button to update the automation, which tends to be of a big problem, in difficult mixing-situations.
Quite irrelevant to your statements about parameter feedback, your ad hominem attacks, or your drivel about Mackie. Witter on...
So rotary units like the BCR could have been a real great solution for T2 users, too.
Of course; no T2 user could ever have made use of the BCR. How clever of you to notice.
The Behringer units would have fit almost perfectly for most T2-users but since some very clever people like you prefer to attack others instead of Mackie, Mackie will probably see absolutely no reason, to rethink their IMO very nasty move against the user-base.
My you do rank your own self-importance overmuch dont you. I guess that makes up for your nonsense.
This is about someone choosing a controller, in case you'd forgotten. Not your little soapbox spiel.
To exclude such a huge improvement in functionality, just to sell their own controllers is not acceptable for me and T2 is not that cheap anymore, that this would be sacrified nor could it be argued, that it needs cross-subsidy and i'm afraid this gives already an impression, in what direction T will develop.
Wow; what an amazing grap of gibberish you bring to your paranoic fantasies.
Jules is obviously no longer the mastermind.
But if no one stands up and complains, we will just get, what we deserve...
Yeah, fight da power.
An idiot on Set Theory:
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."
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- KVRian
- 831 posts since 7 Sep, 2004
ModulR,
oh, no, not another fanatic.
Well, it's Mackies job, to do their job.
But if the user confuses this with his interests, then he has a problem...
Strangely you are defending a marketing-strategy, that is aimed against the user's interests.
So either you are affilited with Mackie, then your statement is understandable but arrogant, or you are a normal consumer, then your statement is, hm - quite stupid.
But it shows the typical problem with fans: they are simply not capable to see things from a neutral perspective.
@whiterabbit:
i don't have the time, to answer garbage
oh, no, not another fanatic.
Well, it's Mackies job, to do their job.
But if the user confuses this with his interests, then he has a problem...
Strangely you are defending a marketing-strategy, that is aimed against the user's interests.
So either you are affilited with Mackie, then your statement is understandable but arrogant, or you are a normal consumer, then your statement is, hm - quite stupid.
But it shows the typical problem with fans: they are simply not capable to see things from a neutral perspective.
@whiterabbit:
i don't have the time, to answer garbage
Last edited by Barbarossa on Mon Apr 11, 2005 6:21 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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- KVRAF
- 1615 posts since 28 Mar, 2005
Hey Whyte, Rossa wtf ???
Will Mackie support feedback other than for Mackie prods. ?
we don't know.
Would it be good if they did?
yes.
would it be bad if they purposely didn't?
yes.
Is there some nice midi controller support in T2
yes
could it be much better?
certainly.
OK?
now go smoke a calming spleef please!
Will Mackie support feedback other than for Mackie prods. ?
we don't know.
Would it be good if they did?
yes.
would it be bad if they purposely didn't?
yes.
Is there some nice midi controller support in T2
yes
could it be much better?
certainly.
OK?
now go smoke a calming spleef please!
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- Beware the Quoth
- 35500 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair
And just to add some factual information into the mix, it took me 45 seconds to set up my Edirol UR-80 for control of over volume and pan of the first few channels of a Tracktion2 project. That included enabling T2 to see the UR-80's MIDI inputs.
An idiot on Set Theory:
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 10815 posts since 26 Nov, 2004 from UK
http://www.behringer.com/05_support/bc_ ... m?lang=ENG
Hmm this makes my £83 look verry sexy indeed!
Hmm this makes my £83 look verry sexy indeed!
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- Beware the Quoth
- 35500 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair
Sorry, semiquaver, but I generally find it better to provide factual information when someone is looking for advice than a half-witted munge of misleading nonsense and paranoid ravings.
For some reason the nonsensical paranoics tend then to rely on further nonsense, more paranoia, and personal attacks. Hey ho, its a funny old world.
In the meantime, Ive let folk know how easy it was to use a real controller, in the real world; I set up an Edirol UR-80 to control T2 for mixing. Even although it doesnt emulate a Mackie, and it doesnt have parameter feedback...
For some reason the nonsensical paranoics tend then to rely on further nonsense, more paranoia, and personal attacks. Hey ho, its a funny old world.
In the meantime, Ive let folk know how easy it was to use a real controller, in the real world; I set up an Edirol UR-80 to control T2 for mixing. Even although it doesnt emulate a Mackie, and it doesnt have parameter feedback...
An idiot on Set Theory:
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."
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- KVRAF
- 6740 posts since 25 Mar, 2002 from sheffield, england
Oxygen8 and UC-16 working perfectly here, with the option to use the three knobs on the front of my Micro-Modular aswell if I really need too.. lack of controller feedback is a complete non-issue over here.
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- Beware the Quoth
- 35500 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair
djsubject quoth http://www.behringer.com/05_support/bc_ ... m?lang=ENG
Hmm this makes my £83 look verry sexy indeed!
Yeah, Im after a BCR later on this year meself... I want something dedicated to my Nord G2 module. Ah well, mebbe after Ive put in the G2's expansion card...
Hmm this makes my £83 look verry sexy indeed!
Yeah, Im after a BCR later on this year meself... I want something dedicated to my Nord G2 module. Ah well, mebbe after Ive put in the G2's expansion card...
An idiot on Set Theory:
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."
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- KVRian
- 779 posts since 3 Apr, 2003 from UK
Funny how in the last couple of weeks I've seen three people invoke the word "fanboy" (in totally disparate subjects) and they've all been more fanatic about their own POV than the people with which they've been arguing. Go figure.
My own take on the matter is that list box on the controller is f*cking huge. If Mackie don't have plans to increase their support of other controllers which support feedback why devote so much screen space to it? They certainly don't have enough of their own brand controllers to fill even half of that box! We all know, regardless of which side they have been arguing on in this thread, that wider support would be a good thing for Mackie.
My own take on the matter is that list box on the controller is f*cking huge. If Mackie don't have plans to increase their support of other controllers which support feedback why devote so much screen space to it? They certainly don't have enough of their own brand controllers to fill even half of that box! We all know, regardless of which side they have been arguing on in this thread, that wider support would be a good thing for Mackie.
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- KVRAF
- 1974 posts since 21 Jun, 2002 from Earth
I use a Korg MicroKontrol as a controller. No feedback, no nada. It works. So is feedback a necessity? No. If you want endless encoders or motorized faders then, yes, you'll need something that emulates the mackie protocol. This is the reality. Wider support of course is better, but when people throw a hissy fit over something which isn't surprising, then it makes me scratch my head.Barbarossa wrote:ModulR,
oh, no, not another fanatic.
Well, it's Mackies job, to do their job.
But if the user confuses this with his interests, then he has a problem...
Strangely you are defending a marketing-strategy, that is aimed against the user's interests.
So either you are affilited with Mackie, then your statement is understandable but arrogant, or you are a normal consumer, then your statement is, hm - quite stupid.
But it shows the typical problem with fans: they are simply not capable to see things from a neutral perspective.
@whiterabbit:
i don't have the time, to answer garbage
and yes, I am an arrogant fanatic prick. If jules was still solo, I'd bet you'd be lucky to see any feedback controller support at all. So how is your situation any worse than before? it's not.
ModuLR / Radio
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- Beware the Quoth
- 35500 posts since 4 Sep, 2001 from R'lyeh Oceanic Amusement Park and Funfair
Barbarossa quoth
@whiterabbit:
i don't have the time, to answer garbage
Im so glad. Your garbage answers were becoming quite tedious. In the meantime, MIDI controllers without parameter feedback can be used to control mixing in Tracktion2, as anyone can prove to themselves in five minutes. Now wander off and go play in the traffic, there's a good little boy.
@whiterabbit:
i don't have the time, to answer garbage
Im so glad. Your garbage answers were becoming quite tedious. In the meantime, MIDI controllers without parameter feedback can be used to control mixing in Tracktion2, as anyone can prove to themselves in five minutes. Now wander off and go play in the traffic, there's a good little boy.
An idiot on Set Theory:
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."
"In some cases there is an object called red that contains everything that is red. In much the same way a pot is a plate."
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- KVRAF
- 4644 posts since 28 Nov, 2002 from Chicago
Oh, fer crying out loud. Not another bloody troll!
Where do they all come from?
Where do they all come from?
I couldn't have said it better if I had tried.rich_h wrote: My own take on the matter is that list box on the controller is f*cking huge. If Mackie don't have plans to increase their support of other controllers which support feedback why devote so much screen space to it?
Someone shot the food. Remember: don't shoot food!
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Daniel Pompougnac Daniel Pompougnac https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=51754 - KVRian
- 1433 posts since 15 Dec, 2004 from In a forest , France
A midi controller ? This thing like there was in Cubase (vol, pan, and others) ?
Like a mixer, but it's possible to choose the controllers ?
How do you imagine the interface of a perfect midi controller ?
Daniel
Like a mixer, but it's possible to choose the controllers ?
How do you imagine the interface of a perfect midi controller ?
Daniel
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- KVRAF
- 4644 posts since 28 Nov, 2002 from Chicago
Well, firstly, it's f-cking huge. That's an essential. It needs to look cool, and bigger is always better when it comes to studio cool.daniel- wrote:How do you imagine the interface of a perfect midi controller ?
Next up, it really needs to be freakin' covered in flashing LEDs and big LED matrixes. If it doesn't look like something out of a sci-fi show, it doesn't count.
Finally it needs knobs. Millions of the buggers. Plus a load of inscrutable buttons and options. I don't need to be able to actually use the thing, it just needs to make me drool.
It should be brushed aluminium so it looks functional but hip, and it should aim to use blue LEDs where possible as they just look cooler than the oldskool red ones.
Someone shot the food. Remember: don't shoot food!