Is there anything ground breaking on the horizon?

[herodotus]

But I'm so tired of having to deal exclusively with a 4/4 grid for drums. I mean drum innovation now, shouldn't that also include a way to program drumlines differently

Why do you feel stuck in 4/4?

I'm not being coy, just honestly curious. Remember I am a super newbie here in VSTi land, especially when it comes to drum machine type things.

[Bassballjg]

No one should ever feel stuck with these:

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=84866

Groundbreaking indeed.

[McLilith]

I would like to hear some music written in some really experimental time signature, like 4/3, or 7/5. (Yes, a third or fifth note would get one beat, respectively.)

I would also like to hear some music that didn't restrict every note to a power-of-two value. I would like to see any fractional value accepted as a legitimate note length. Things like 11/15th and 5/9th notes should be more common.

That said, I'm not sure if we absolutely need this flexibility, but I would certainly like to hear a few songs composed like this. It might turn out really interesting. This could be a rhythmic counterpart to the microtonal movement.


take care,
McLilith

[danielmm]

Strange how this devolved into a "how it's all made" thread. I mean really, as a musician, who gives a toss? All I want is to make music, if something is coming that allows me to do it differently than I have, then I am interested in seeing it developed.

That's what I'm talking about!

Come on guys, this is simply an argument nobody will win...

That's what makes it fun!

Come on BONES ...this is just turning into a pissing match. You're a guy that has delved into SE for some time...don't you ever say "man, if only there was something capable of doing ... (insertmoderntechycreativewordyexplaination here)"

dano

[shamann]

Why do you feel stuck in 4/4?

I'm not sure I understand the question fully. Do you mean that 4/4 is limitless, or that drum machine grids don't limit you?

Here's a highlight of the Guru grid:



Now I'm sure it'll subdivide into 8ths, 16ths, etc, but on the screenshot and the documentation so far released, I don't find anything that shows where one could change the time signature and have it reflected in the grid.

So for 5/4, I want 5 slots per measure. I also want to be able to deftly handle having one 4 slot measure followed by a 5 slot measure. I also want to be able to work with polyrhythms, so that one voice has a 4 slotted grid and the other is a 5 slotted grid, etc. I also want to be able to work effectively with triplets.

Maybe I'm daft and missing something, so feel free to correct me. I'm also pretty good at working around these things, but I'd like not to have to do that all the time.

[herodotus]

Why do you feel stuck in 4/4?

I'm not sure I understand the question fully. Do you mean that 4/4 is limitless, or that drum machine grids don't limit you?

Here's a highlight of the Guru grid:



Now I'm sure it'll subdivide into 8ths, 16ths, etc, but on the screenshot and the documentation so far released, I don't find anything that shows where one could change the time signature and have it reflected in the grid.

So for 5/4, I want 5 slots per measure. I also want to be able to deftly handle having one 4 slot measure followed by a 5 slot measure. I also want to be able to work with polyrhythms, so that one voice has a 4 slotted grid and the other is a 5 slotted grid, etc. I also want to be able to work effectively with triplets.

Maybe I'm daft and missing something, so feel free to correct me. I'm also pretty good at working around these things, but I'd like not to have to do that all the time.

As I suspected, I was being daft. I thought that you meant 'stuck in 4/4' as a general thing, but your remarks (as the context should have told me) were specific to Guru.

Sorry, I am on my ninth workday in a row. Time for me to listen to some music, and shutup.

[shamann]

As I suspected, I was being daft. I thought that you meant 'stuck in 4/4' as a general thing, but your remarks (as the context should have told me) were specific to Guru.

No worries, it happens to the best of us. One thing though, a great deal of drum machines have the same grid problem, not just Guru. There are workarounds, like limiting a pattern length, but I'm not sure I know of any with a really flexible grid. Maybe some hosts, but even then, which ones?

Hey, you have Daniel Boorstin in your sig!

[SJ_Digriz]

Come on guys, this is simply an argument nobody will win...

That's what makes it fun!

exactly, it wouldn't be any fun if anyone was right.

[SJ_Digriz]

but I'm not sure I know of any with a really flexible grid. Maybe some hosts, but even then, which ones?

All the hosts I've ever used, even ones with bad MIDI implementations like PT and Samp, can have the grid be any signature. That includes Cubase, Logic and Sonar for starters. I'm sure eXT and Tracktion can do it as well, but I can't remember off the top of my head.

Also, you can usually turn snap off so that note values don't have to be "fixed" within the signature.

[herodotus]

As I suspected, I was being daft. I thought that you meant 'stuck in 4/4' as a general thing, but your remarks (as the context should have told me) were specific to Guru.

No worries, it happens to the best of us. One thing though, a great deal of drum machines have the same grid problem, not just Guru. There are workarounds, like limiting a pattern length, but I'm not sure I know of any with a really flexible grid. Maybe some hosts, but even then, which ones?

I use a notation editor (an ancient but much loved relic called Midisoft Studio). It is really amazingly flexible. You can use any conceivable time sig, and the beat can be divided into any number of user definable 'tuplets'. I can't really imagine trying to use a piano roll style grid (though the aforementioned app does offer one), it is totally counterintuitive for me.

My problem is that Midisoft Studio Is nothing like a host. It can only use the XP midi player. So I have to import the .mid files I make in it to Tracktion to do anything with them in terms of production.

Slow, but I still have fun.

Hey, you have Daniel Boorstin in your sig!

Whenever someone I know says "History is boring" I try to point them toward old Daniel B. It's not just brilliant, it's fun.

[vurt]

I would like to hear some music written in some really experimental time signature, like 4/3, or 7/5. (Yes, a third or fifth note would get one beat, respectively.)

I would also like to hear some music that didn't restrict every note to a power-of-two value. I would like to see any fractional value accepted as a legitimate note length. Things like 11/15th and 5/9th notes should be more common.

That said, I'm not sure if we absolutely need this flexibility, but I would certainly like to hear a few songs composed like this. It might turn out really interesting. This could be a rhythmic counterpart to the microtonal movement.


take care,
McLilith

er my notes are often messed up lengths hehe

[SJ_Digriz]

I would like to hear some music written in some really experimental time signature, like 4/3, or 7/5. (Yes, a third or fifth note would get one beat, respectively.)

I would also like to hear some music that didn't restrict every note to a power-of-two value. I would like to see any fractional value accepted as a legitimate note length. Things like 11/15th and 5/9th notes should be more common.

That said, I'm not sure if we absolutely need this flexibility, but I would certainly like to hear a few songs composed like this. It might turn out really interesting. This could be a rhythmic counterpart to the microtonal movement.


take care,
McLilith

You might want to buy a couple of the old Bill Bruford albums. He does stuff like play different signatures with each hand and the two parts only come in synch every so many measures. You can hear them diverge and then start to merge again. Not the most "lyrical" stuff in the world, but technically brilliant and kinda cool to listen to every now and again. The down side is it always reminds me I suck.

[Sicklecell666]

Maybe some hosts, but even then, which ones?

Orion.

[The Chase]

Wierd that the topic of being stuck in 4/4 had arisen in this thread as this new thread is about it in FLStudio

[The Chase]

I would like to hear some music written in some really experimental time signature, like 4/3, or 7/5. (Yes, a third or fifth note would get one beat, respectively.)

I would also like to hear some music that didn't restrict every note to a power-of-two value. I would like to see any fractional value accepted as a legitimate note length. Things like 11/15th and 5/9th notes should be more common.

That said, I'm not sure if we absolutely need this flexibility, but I would certainly like to hear a few songs composed like this. It might turn out really interesting. This could be a rhythmic counterpart to the microtonal movement.


take care,
McLilith

"Radiohead - Everything in its right place" is the only track I've ever heard with an abnormal time signature without being cheese.