What is T2 Midi editor missing?

[sghoughton]

Hi,

Basically, being new to sequencers (only really used the sequencer in Reason til now), what are some features that the midi editor in tracktion is missing? Seems like there is a basic set of tools, but without much experience, I really don't know what else to look for in a midi editor and specifically what I'm missing here.

Just curious really. But might be nice to start a wish list for midi features if there are some that would be very beneficial.

thanks

steve

[pHz]

granted the T2 MIDI editor is relatively basic (or bloat-free depending on your viewpoint) but it does ALL your everyday MIDI editing tasks in a very friendly and (IMHO) efficient GUI ...

... im not into deep MIDI editing but i wouldnt mind something like the MIDI 'randomisation' features that the energyXT sequencer has ...

... another popular request has been for an event list ...

slainte rob

[IIRs]

The missing features split into two broad camps: those designed for external hardware synths, and those intended to speed up tedious tasks that are already possible.

Examples of the first include patch-name scripts and bank select messages.

Examples of the second (from my Cubase VST key-bindings) are auto legato (to move note-offs to the next note-on) and restrict polyphony to user defined value (very handy for ringtones!)

Then there's the other ways to view the data such as drum grids and event lists (as pHz mentioned) which can both be very handy in some situations..

That's without even mentioning Cubase's Logical Editor!

From my point of view, the extra functionality that Cubase gives me is really handy at work, where time is money, and the tasks tend to be very routine. For example, I have a logical preset that will multiply all note lengths by 1.5, while also multiplying the note's position in the song by the same amount. If I then also increase the song tempo by a factor of 1.5, I will have converted the song's triplet groove into a straight quantise that can be converted to a mono-phonic ringtone format.. If I did this a bit more often, I could even assign it a hot-key..

On the other hand, Tracktion inspires me greatly in other ways, and when I'm working on my own music I don't mind taking the extra bit of time over some MIDI editing procedures.. sometimes doing things manually will result in a happy accident that I end up keeping.. and anyway, I make that time back up when I come to sorting out my sub-grouping!

Anyway, that's a perspective from someone who edits MIDI for 8 hours a day in Cubase VST, then comes home and carries on in T2.

[malamut]

The missing features split into two broad camps

I see a third camp: support for high-end master keyboards. Such keyboards produce velocities for note-off messages and aftertouch (or at least channel pressure) messages. The T2 midi editor does not support editing any of those.

On the other hand, adding support for this would be trivial. Hence, I'm optimistic that this little missing feature will be implemented in a minor T2 upgrade. In fact, I'm surprised that the revamped T2 midi editor does not contain this already.

Enjoy T2,
malamut

[braj]

I'd like to see a chord-entry shortcut sorta thing, and a force to scale option. But these are frivolous, I admit. But they would still be cool. Metro on Mac has a step-entry mode that lets you step enter random notes in a defined scale. Pretty good for when you have a creative block. You can generate some random stuff, go in and grab out something that sounds fresh, and build your composition from there.

[IIRs]

a force to scale option.

I got quite excited about the prospect of being able to 'switch off' certain notes of the piano-roll. This could provide way to create customised drum-maps, but could also be set up to conform to a specific scale, which could make the piano-roll much easier to 'read'..

[lharless]

forgive me if im wrong, and i probably am... but aren't all those features in bloatware there for all of the "potential" uses that many many different people will eventually come across the need to have those functions? i mean, if cubase, sonar, protools and all those guys seem to have bloated midi capabilities there must have been a series of events that led up to them including all of those features in their editors.

i just wonder what determines, and what critera come into play when jules decides that something is not "essential", and/or important within tracktion.

i don't do midi at all. never havem never will. i only do audio. mainly because im a musician tht got into tracking and editing live music a few years back, which really isn't conducive to learning the ins and outs of midi.

i guess the only thing i would ever need midi for is if i ever break down and buy one of those control surfaces, but even then, it's not like editing ACTUAL MIDI music. i guess i should really take a look into it at some point, but right now, i don't see a need.

sorry to hijack the thread like this, but that just crossed my mind. im istting here at the checkout counter at the guitar shop and curiosity got the better of me. it would be interesting to know what determines (int he mind of julian) what gets cut out of the feature list for midi and what stays...

and for that matter, the same for audio. what determines what gets put in and what stays out. is it largely determined by feature requests and julian's whims, or is it something that you work out during beta testing? and who's projects get tested during this time period? do you work on real world projects and then see what you might need or what fails under stress? how does this work? have you ever tested the software with the onyx 1640 on a live project during beta testing? with a laptop, like in the ads?

just trying to gain some insight here. i would like to know a little more about what goes on behind the scenes. others may know, but im clueless.

im thinking about going to cubase because of the cpu useage on my machine with tracktion and it's heartbreaking. i love this program. it's been so refreshing to use. and it's a total gas to look at. i havent even used the T2 full version yet... maybe that will solve my cpu problems..

im using a laptop based on p4 desktop chip.. a sager np5670, topped off on ram (1gig) and everything else i could get them to upgrade... the thing was 4grand when we were done upgrading everything on it. i went overboard i think... it ran pro tools like a frikkin dream.

i hate the high price of pro tools, but it sure was reliable.. ...sigh... and i had never heard of latency until i used tracktion.. really.

because up until then i had always used hardware based equipment and adats and the like..

im not the most technical savy of the people you have ever met..

just trying to learn as i go along, and make some friends in the process..

thanks guys/ladies!

[IIRs]

i mean, if cubase, sonar, protools and all those guys seem to have bloated midi capabilities there must have been a series of events that led up to them including all of those features in their editors.

For me, it isn't that fact that there are so many features (I'm a control freak! I like the power that Cubase VST gives me with the logical editor for example) .. what makes it 'bloated' is the way it all fits together.

It's taken me years to learn VST to the depth I know it: I can fly around the piano-roll using hot-keys and muscle memories .. but I've trained up a few other VST programmers and explaining it all to someone else makes me painfully aware of how much you have to just know.

On the other hand, I've trained up SX users too: SX has most of the same MIDI features as VST .. but they're all in different menus, some with different names, and some appear at first to be the same but turn out to work in fundamentally different ways when you examine them closer.. worst of all, there is still no overall logic to any of it, and you still just have to know.. (ie: invest the time in reading manuals / trawling forums etc..)

I also trained one programmer who used Logic.. he was a very experienced MIDI programmer already, and Logic was his chosen host to which he was loyal to the point of switching to Mac when that time came.. even after six months of working with him, he still hadn't worked out how to send MIDI volume controllers to a multi-timbral VSTi plug without them also affecting the mixer channel fader for that plug! His workaround was to run multiple instances of a multi-timbral synth, with complex MIDI filtering set up in the environment

What I love about Tracktion, is that it sets itself rules and follows them: whenever you need to find a parameter you haven't used before, chances are you just click the relevant part of the screen, and it will be sat in the properties panel waiting for you. Easy! So basically, I don't agree that Tracktion is 'simple' at all.. as racks show quite admirably .. rather I would call it 'elegant'. Racks are a case in point: once you have learnt the fundamentals of rack routing it becomes possible to set up aux sends, deal with multi-output plugs, set up side-chaining, set up parallel FX routings, store plug-in chains as presets etc.. all of those would be seperate functions in a conventional app!

[lharless]

i like the possibilities with tracktion. im just going to have to pay my dues i guess, and dig in i guess..

thanks for the info. makes sense. ...sort of, if you can understand where im coming from. haha! i don't do ANY midi. so some of that stuff just flew by like a U2.

hey, you guys have a nice evening, im going to eat some noodles and rest for the evening. and read some more.

[djsubject]

midi volisity pen tool would be lovley

[braj]

I think being able to assign the wheel-click to toggle between select and draw would be great.

[haydxn]

that'd be handy. for now i have my wheel click assigned to '/' in Tracktion (thru my mouse's utility program) so that i can use it to slice clips. i just keep my left hand over the keyboard to change tools (S/D for select/draw)

[IIRs]

Thats a good idea!

Actually the main thing I thing is missing from the new MIDI editor is key bindings: quantise. groove, transpose, note select etc. would all need to be available in the key-bindings menu for T's MIDI editing to speed up to Cubase VST levels (for me anyway)

[ceenda]

Priority over Marker and Cursor lines when MIDI editing.

I hate setting down notes at the beginning of MIDI edits (especially the start of songs) as the Draw cursor turns into a move cursor when you stray near the markers. I'd like the Draw/Select tools to have PRIORITY when you're using them within the space of the MIDI edit.

[deleted]

I need mouse free MIDI note step recording editing.
T2 already have insert a rest.
In addition, I need tie and back w/erase note.

Those controlls are able to record without mouse.
Only using MIDI keyboard and PC keyboard shortcut like hardware sequece recorder.