Any Christians making music here?

[tetraplan]

I am Antichrist...does that count?

Only when you're near, at the door.

Groet, Erik

[Emerald Tablet]

Christians unite

I don`t ask a question like are there any atheists or agnostics on this board making music.

[Panda]

I think you are both right. It is true that polyphony and harmony go back a long time in China and Asia in general, but also that *in general* the role of harmony is more important in western music than in Chinese.
You can say Chinese music is rather modal, that is, more melody-oriented, and western music is more tonal, being more harmony-oriented. That of course doesn't mean that in modal music there's no room for harmony and vice versa...

Well maybe but don't forget what started this was the statement that Polyphony started with the Christian Church. The stuff about harmony, notation etc was added later.

hm, sorry, i didn't read the whole thread, just the end to see what kept this topic going. But that statement is nonsense to me for sure.
AFAIK, polyphony got into the Christian music via folk music, so it was already there... In fact, the Christians didn't even want polyphony in the beginning, because according to them, music should concentrate on the message, on the word of god, and not the means or the envelope, hence for example the monotonic gregorian chants.
Unless you count paraphony and heterophony as forms of polyphony (which i don't because polyphony to me means several *equivalent* voices at the same time), polyphony didn't appear in 'high western culture' before the renaissance, which in fact was in a way a movement *away* from the church.

[cptgone]

I once saw a pic about the Roman era, feat. an arena filled with christians. Enter the lions and the christians started singing hymns.

It was an old movie, animal rights weren't much of an issue back then I guess...

[oldevil]

even on a music forum religion rears its ugly little head...there is no such thing as 'christian music', 'muslim music', etc...there is music with christian lyrics, muslim lyrics, etc...but music is just music, good or bad...religion is the Great Divider, pitting one 'true religion' against another...'are there any Jews here making music', 'any Muslims', etc...what does it matter when it comes music? any Scientologists making music here? where's Tom Cruise?

[Panda]

even on a music forum religion rears its ugly little head...there is no such thing as 'christian music', 'muslim music', etc...there is music with christian lyrics, muslim lyrics, etc...but music is just music, good or bad...religion is the Great Divider, pitting one 'true religion' against another...'are there any Jews here making music', 'any Muslims', etc...what does it matter when it comes music? any Scientologists making music here? where's Tom Cruise?

Don't agree, there's plenty of music that's tied to a religion without any lyrics necessary. I do agree that 'any Chriqtians making music here' is kind of an awkward question...

[Meffy]

any Scientologists making music here?

You're a little late on that. Thread's already been and died*. :-)

* I hope.

[Wopelka]

even on a music forum religion rears its ugly little head...there is no such thing as 'christian music', 'muslim music', etc...there is music with christian lyrics, muslim lyrics, etc...but music is just music, good or bad...religion is the Great Divider, pitting one 'true religion' against another...'are there any Jews here making music', 'any Muslims', etc...what does it matter when it comes music? any Scientologists making music here? where's Tom Cruise?

well i fail to see why all the fuss about this simple question.

it could have been: are there any Swiss here making music? are there any banker here making music? etc. etc.

it wouldn't sound like the Swiss are more right, more cool or more anything. Bankers? sure not (i work in a bank, i know what i'm talking about).

it's a human thing to seek fellowship with their peers, whatever criteria it might be. why assuming it is against others that we are happy to meet persons sharing the same religion, the same nationality, the same sex, etc? as long as it's open and friendly, not sectarist, it shouldn't annoy anybody, really.

who's doing the witch hunt nowadays?

[Rangtangtang]

Well, are there any sico's or perverts making music?

[abi]

it's a human thing to seek fellowship with their peers, whatever criteria it might be. why assuming it is against others that we are happy to meet persons sharing the same religion, the same nationality, the same sex, etc? as long as it's open and friendly, not sectarist, it shouldn't annoy anybody, really.

who's doing the witch hunt nowadays?

i´m happy to meet people sharing the same desire which is music. i´m happy to meet people sharing the same air and the same planet.

the question disturbed me because being so bound to something that you are in search of "mates" is the premise for seperation, really. of course, it wouldn´t be better to search people from holland or from somalia.

something is wrong when i have to share someone´s religious beliefs in order to be accepted as his "mate", isn´t it?

the fact that you search for christians suggests that there must be something special about them. apart from that they are christians of course. am i wrong?

[abi]

religion rears its ugly little head

this is the best sentence uttered so far in this thread!!

[Wopelka]

something is wrong when i have to share someone´s religious beliefs in order to be accepted as his "mate", isn´t it?

yes, something would be wrong, but that's absolutely not the case here.

religion rears its ugly little head

this is the best sentence uttered so far in this thread!!

nice lesson of tolerance and humanism, thank you.

[herodotus]

I think you are both right. It is true that polyphony and harmony go back a long time in China and Asia in general, but also that *in general* the role of harmony is more important in western music than in Chinese.
You can say Chinese music is rather modal, that is, more melody-oriented, and western music is more tonal, being more harmony-oriented. That of course doesn't mean that in modal music there's no room for harmony and vice versa...

Well maybe but don't forget what started this was the statement that Polyphony started with the Christian Church. The stuff about harmony, notation etc was added later.

hm, sorry, i didn't read the whole thread, just the end to see what kept this topic going. But that statement is nonsense to me for sure.
AFAIK, polyphony got into the Christian music via folk music, so it was already there... In fact, the Christians didn't even want polyphony in the beginning, because according to them, music should concentrate on the message, on the word of god, and not the means or the envelope, hence for example the monotonic gregorian chants.
Unless you count paraphony and heterophony as forms of polyphony (which i don't because polyphony to me means several *equivalent* voices at the same time), polyphony didn't appear in 'high western culture' before the renaissance, which in fact was in a way a movement *away* from the church.

OK, it is time to make some distinctions here

First, "Polyphony" is a word that has both general and specific meanings. Literally, of course, it means "Many voices" which is a pretty damn general term. I was using it in a more specific sense common in musicological writings. In this sense it means a specific form of 'Many voiced' part writing wherein melodic lines of distinct pitches are coordinated in accordance with certain rules of concordance. There is not really an argument here on that point, just some definitional vagueness.

I must point out, though, that of all the references and links that I have seen in this thread point to contemporary polyphony. When I pointed out that music of most parts of the world has no notation, it wasn't a cut, it was to point out that we have no way of knowing what it might have sounded like. I mean how could we know given the total absence of a notational or phonographic record?

Christians didn't even want polyphony in the beginning, because according to them, music should concentrate on the message, on the word of god, and not the means or the envelope, hence for example the monotonic gregorian chants.
Unless you count paraphony and heterophony as forms of polyphony (which i don't because polyphony to me means several *equivalent* voices at the same time), polyphony didn't appear in 'high western culture' before the renaissance, which in fact was in a way a movement *away* from the church

This "What Christians wanted" sort of statement is rather too sweeping. Just about everyone in medieval europe was a christian. Some of them were stodgy old men, and some were enthusiastic young people. Some were trying to conserve the past and some were trying to break from it. But in any case, the first firmly attested, documented polyphony was from the Ars Nova period (circa 1290-1360), well before the Rennaissance.

[Rangtangtang]

well,





Whats he got there behind him, could be a laptop and some monitors, yes he looks out the window and plays a bit of music in his spare time.


That looks like a cool studio to me?








.....................in the hay with mary

[Meffy]

First, "Polyphony" is a word that has both general and specific meanings. Literally, of course, it means "fake parrot"

Glad SOMEONE knows the facts!