Looping is irritating

[fake_fake]

Are there any tips for doing loop based music in T2? The midi clips I have to copy/paste, and if I change something I have to redo it... and for a 5-7min song it can be irritating copying/pasting since I see no "paste a billion times" button.

There is the audio clip looping feature, but usually the clip isn't an entire bar long, and if there is other stuff in the bar then the looping mode makes it clip and click. So I guess I'd have to add silence and edit it to be a full bar to loop it with that.

I've also tried making a separate edit for just loops, exporting, and then arranging them in another edit... but this is a terrible method to me.

I'm just wondering if there is something I'm overlooking because I'm becoming pretty irritated trying to do songs with loops like this.

[Mr. Tingle]

ctr-c ctr-v is all I use (using the lasso to grab regions)

It works for me.

[spacefox]

Well, Tracktion isn't really suitable for pattern based music.


Assuming your'e on PC, you can get either EnergyXT or ERA. ERA is midi only, EnergyXT is most powerful and des almost anything.

[Lunch Money]

I use loops all the time. You just need to understand the limitations, such as the biggest one-- lack of timestretch means you need to do your song in the loops' original BPM. Forget about switching tempo.

Other than that (and it IS a huge one for people who use primarily loops), CTRL+V is all anyone could really need.

[rockstar_not]

I use loops all the time. You just need to understand the limitations, such as the biggest one-- lack of timestretch means you need to do your song in the loops' original BPM. Forget about switching tempo.

Other than that (and it IS a huge one for people who use primarily loops), CTRL+V is all anyone could really need.

Lunch,

Not true my friend - the bit about CTRL+V being all you need.

There should be a loop midi clips feature. It would also be nice to have a multiple slot clipboard for clips, whether audio or midi - name the clip - place on the clipboard and insert that named clip wherever you would like. Very quick way to construct songs from sections.

I can think of a few more sequencer tricks that my old Ensoniq ESQ-1 and VFX SD on-board sequencers used to do.

-Scott

[Lunch Money]

On-board sequencers need that stuff because you can't just visually copy-and-paste with the same elegance.

I mean, once the tempo-fit problem is out of the way (ie. assuming your loops are the right length already) how could it be easier than copying and pasting?

Option 1: I know that I want Loop A to loop 5 times, so I drag it all out 5 measures, Acid-style. Slick, done.

Option 2: I right-click or context-click somewhere and get a drop-down menu. I select "5 times". Slick, done.

Option 3: I click the loop, press CTRL+C, and then with my finger still on the CTRL key, I go 'tip tap tip tap' on the "V". Slick, done.

I don't see a distinct advantage of any one of these methods over another, for such a very basic and simple task. Since I use CTRL+C and CTRL+V all the time anyhow for word-processing or whatever, I find it more intuitive and even faster, even though in 'theory', a mouse-click, a drag, and another mouse-click might be faster for some people. For me, it's literally less than a second to do what I need to do.

But let's not stop there. Let's say I've cobbled together my 'verse' section from 5 different loops. Chances are you're not using a true 'loop' mode anyhow, since each measure the loop changes. Unless you're doing dance music you probably shouldn't be using static loops that many times in a row anyhow. I try to make it a rule to never use the same loop back-to-back more than 2 measures. Point being:

Now, I SHIFT+click or use ALT+Drag to select all the 'verse' loops at once. CTRL+C and then CTRL+V them to the second time my verse appears. Delete "Fill variation 1" from this new set of loops, and drop in "Fill variation 2" to change things up a bit.

Sorted.

I honestly don't see how it can be much easier or more efficient than that, but I'd be willing to hear an example.

[Rock]

Well, Tracktion isn't really suitable for pattern based music.


Assuming your'e on PC, you can get either EnergyXT or ERA. ERA is midi only, EnergyXT is most powerful and des almost anything.

I know a lot of you guys use EnergyXT with Tracktion, does it work inside of Tracktion as a VST and how does it do looping?

[fake_fake]

I don't mean loops you downloaded that are already a full bar. I mean taking something like 5 tracks, and having tons of different 1-hit clips setup.

A sampler could be used for this, but it would take more work because you have to make all the clips and load them all in.

It would be nice to be able to select a full bars worth of scattered lil clips that are setup for the loop, then hit a button that says, "Repeat 50 times", or whatever. Otherwise what I do is I paste one once, then select again, paste that, select them all again, paste that, repeat until finally it is long enough.... then if you make a change, delete them all, and repeat. grrr

[jens]

Well, Tracktion isn't really suitable for pattern based music.


Assuming your'e on PC, you can get either EnergyXT or ERA. ERA is midi only, EnergyXT is most powerful and des almost anything.

I know a lot of you guys use EnergyXT with Tracktion, does it work inside of Tracktion as a VST and how does it do looping?

you can load the whole sequencer into the plugin-version of eXT and it is able to automacitally sync to Tracktion.

Its sequencing stuff is rather advanced compared to Tracktion - that's the reason why personally I prefer to use it standalone instead of Tracktion. But of course it makes sense to just leod it into Tracktion and use the best of both worlds!

[oxbee]

Tracktion is not really intended to be a loop production sequencer. I used to do more looped music than nowadays before and Acid was my tool. Now there is Ableton Live and Fruity Loop and they are more comfortable than a general sequencer.

[haydxn]

if i have a 1 bar / 4 bar arrangement of mini clips, i put the markers around the section i want to loop, and click export - i render only the marked section on the selected track, and then i reimport that on a new empty track. that clip is then exactly the right length to use the audio clip loop function, so i do that, and i'm sorted. i shrink the 'source' track and keep it handy just in case i need to edit the original and rebounce it. not too much work, and definitely not something i feel tempted to complain about. i actually enjoy doing all those steps.

does that make me weird?...

[Rock]

thanks jens

[rockstar_not]

if i have a 1 bar / 4 bar arrangement of mini clips, i put the markers around the section i want to loop, and click export - i render only the marked section on the selected track, and then i reimport that on a new empty track. that clip is then exactly the right length to use the audio clip loop function, so i do that, and i'm sorted. i shrink the 'source' track and keep it handy just in case i need to edit the original and rebounce it. not too much work, and definitely not something i feel tempted to complain about. i actually enjoy doing all those steps.

does that make me weird?...

haydxn,

If you are weird, that makes two of us - this is exactly what I do, but then it would be so much nicer if it didn't require all of those extra steps and cluttering of the hard drive with clips.

-Scott

[Sascha Franck]

I'm not familiar with how T2 is doing it, but that's one of the great features of Logic. Once you have a clip, all you need to do is press "L" (by default) and it will just loop the section as long as you want (it will only stop once you insert something else on the same track).
This is pretty much speeding up quick composing IMO. In addition, whenever you change something in the source pattern, it'll be reflected inside the loops. Of course similar things are possible with alias parts (possible in most sequencers), but creating them isn't as fast as Logics loop function.
Further, if you want some interesting polyrhythmic effects, instead of looping a full bar of, say, a 16th note based synth line, you could just shorten the source part by a 16th and have some instant 15/16th loop going on (this usually won't work with aliases). Also nice to use for things such as hihats, to make them sound less predictable.

I wish more sequencers had such an easy to use and speeding up loop functionality.

[jens]

I'm not familiar with how T2 is doing it, but that's one of the great features of Logic. Once you have a clip, all you need to do is press "L" (by default) and it will just loop the section as long as you want (it will only stop once you insert something else on the same track).

yes, it works pretty well as long as you get used to inserting empty clips for stopping the loop...