Here the video, Tracktion 1 with a touchscreen...
http://www.sonicstate.com/news/shownews.cfm?newsid=1892#
who wants one of thease in Tracktion
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- KVRist
- 230 posts since 25 Nov, 2004
Yeah, that's exactly what you don't want: people being comfortable working in your app.Lunch Money wrote: It's a destructive and pointless pursuit adding features just because you anticipate that it will make some people more "comfortable".
Greg
A marketing man you're not Greg.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 10815 posts since 26 Nov, 2004 from UK
dealwithit wrote: Yeah, that's exactly what you don't want: people being comfortable working in your app.
yea comfort just has no value now days
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- KVRAF
- 1820 posts since 28 Mar, 2005
omicrom wrote:Having a mixer view tab in Tracktion
goes against the philosophy of having everything you need on one screen.
if you think having everything on one screen is great. i agree; for the waveform editor view.
i have one question for you: how are you enjoying your other tabs in tracktion? say, like..the settings tab, the other tab.... .....eh? anything to add here?
it'd be another tab. nothing spread across the stuff you're used to. nothing to get in the way of you using tracktion just like you do now, only there's another tab, out of view if you don't need it, for you to use if and when you should ever need a mixer.
if you don't need it, don't go to that tab. simple.
haha. such a simple concept. such a simple solution to a hotly debated feature addition. it's the intelligent way of making this a more rounded app.
i understand why some don't want it. i really do. so please understand why i wanrt tracktion (an app that i love) to have a mixer tab section. i want it in there just as bad, or more, than you don't want it in there. and so do alot of other users. but im going to bow out of this conversation before it gets ugly.
i've made my point. i've made a clear and viable argument for a feature addition. im not going to argue it any more. there's no need. you guys can discuss it further if you want. im sure mackie has seen this and im sure they understand as well.
i mean, im not asking for an unreasonable feature. and im sure that it's on a list somewhere being debated. they may go with it, they may not. if they don't, i will still own tracktion, it has its uses and is a GREAT application. but if it's not included, it just won't be MY main app. that's all. not that it won't be great for a few other folks out there that aren't used to mixing on real (hardware) equipment, and are in need of the familiar paradigm.
it's great as is. and it will great no matter the outcome of this little discussion.
have a nice day and please do discuss. im out of the circle now.
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- KVRAF
- 1820 posts since 28 Mar, 2005
oh, and greg and everybody else, i didn't take offense at anything anybody said. this is only a discussion about a feature in software, lol. hehe. i still love everybody and everybody is cool by me. i don't get too upset. i may seem like it, but i don't. mostly im just trying to make my own shit easier to get by with.
iirs, i understand your point of view too, and your argument is viable as well. it makes me think a little bit. but mostly i go back to my original tabbed idea of the mixer. but i hear you. i do.
...i do.
iirs, i understand your point of view too, and your argument is viable as well. it makes me think a little bit. but mostly i go back to my original tabbed idea of the mixer. but i hear you. i do.
...i do.
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- KVRAF
- Topic Starter
- 10815 posts since 26 Nov, 2004 from UK
i would like the set up for my faders to be different from my setup for my arraingment
thats the point BTW
Subz
thats the point BTW
Subz
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- KVRAF
- 12977 posts since 29 Sep, 2003 from Ottawa, Canada
Yeah, there's something to be said for that, bastien.
A tabbed mixer is just so superfluous. It's not that it wouldn't be useful to some people (apparently it would be the most useful thing in the world to Lee), but it's that of ALL the feature requests, it's something that would require the most work for the least payoff.
On the recent poll thread, I can think of dozens of features that I'd want to see before a mixer tab that I'll never use. I haven't seen updated poll results lately, but I suspect the results will agree.
Another problem I have with it at the core: if there IS a mixer tab, newcomers will see it and perhaps automatically try to use it, instead of understanding the beauty and elegance of Tracktion's current workflow. I mean, you come from Cubase to Tracktion, you see a mixer, you start using it. I'd rather shake things up a bit and 'force' people to think a different way. Which they won't do (humans being essentially lazy bastards) unless there's no other choice.
OR, conversely-- people who don't have previous experience buy Tracktion as their first sequencer and flip back and forth between the two tabs, trying to figure out what the f**k they're supposed to do with them. Imagine: "OK, I've adjusted my levels and pan on the track. Now to the mixer. Hrm... guess I should tweak the levels and pan here? Or no? Or what? Why do I have to do it again? What's the mixer for?"
It's a poor idea, in my opinion. The only good I can see to come of it would be satisfying people whose comfort zones are accomodated by a more traditional 'mixer'. And that's not enough, when compared to the greater good.
As for me being a marketing guy, I disagree. I'm not bothering to put a 'spin' on it because I don't have to sell the people here anything. But I think that forward-thinking and simple ways of working is an easy sell. Thinking outside of tradition is an easy sell. I could take the whole mixer thing and make a whole marketing spin on why it's great that Tracktion doesn't have one. So no, in this thread, I'm not a marketing guy. But I think that when you consider the goals of marketing and sales in general, surely you MUST realize that giving in and adding a mixer tab (whose function is dubious at best, completely redundant at worst) isn't going to increase sales. The people who like Cubase's way of working are already using Cubase.
I asked for one good reason for a 'mixer', and so far, bastien's the only person who's able to provide one.
Get a pivoting display, change the orientation, and you're set. <grin>
Since most of us won't get pivoting displays, I'm just joking, but I guess really, we COULD do that and it'd work with Tracktion's way.
Greg
A tabbed mixer is just so superfluous. It's not that it wouldn't be useful to some people (apparently it would be the most useful thing in the world to Lee), but it's that of ALL the feature requests, it's something that would require the most work for the least payoff.
On the recent poll thread, I can think of dozens of features that I'd want to see before a mixer tab that I'll never use. I haven't seen updated poll results lately, but I suspect the results will agree.
Another problem I have with it at the core: if there IS a mixer tab, newcomers will see it and perhaps automatically try to use it, instead of understanding the beauty and elegance of Tracktion's current workflow. I mean, you come from Cubase to Tracktion, you see a mixer, you start using it. I'd rather shake things up a bit and 'force' people to think a different way. Which they won't do (humans being essentially lazy bastards) unless there's no other choice.
OR, conversely-- people who don't have previous experience buy Tracktion as their first sequencer and flip back and forth between the two tabs, trying to figure out what the f**k they're supposed to do with them. Imagine: "OK, I've adjusted my levels and pan on the track. Now to the mixer. Hrm... guess I should tweak the levels and pan here? Or no? Or what? Why do I have to do it again? What's the mixer for?"
It's a poor idea, in my opinion. The only good I can see to come of it would be satisfying people whose comfort zones are accomodated by a more traditional 'mixer'. And that's not enough, when compared to the greater good.
As for me being a marketing guy, I disagree. I'm not bothering to put a 'spin' on it because I don't have to sell the people here anything. But I think that forward-thinking and simple ways of working is an easy sell. Thinking outside of tradition is an easy sell. I could take the whole mixer thing and make a whole marketing spin on why it's great that Tracktion doesn't have one. So no, in this thread, I'm not a marketing guy. But I think that when you consider the goals of marketing and sales in general, surely you MUST realize that giving in and adding a mixer tab (whose function is dubious at best, completely redundant at worst) isn't going to increase sales. The people who like Cubase's way of working are already using Cubase.
I asked for one good reason for a 'mixer', and so far, bastien's the only person who's able to provide one.
Get a pivoting display, change the orientation, and you're set. <grin>
Since most of us won't get pivoting displays, I'm just joking, but I guess really, we COULD do that and it'd work with Tracktion's way.
Greg
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- KVRist
- 127 posts since 28 Dec, 2004
If a mixer ever finds its way into "T" I just hope someone's smart enough to provide an option on the settings screen to disable it so no resources are comsumed at all when it is disabled. I don't need it, don't want it, and don't see any use for it.
It would be a step backwards as far as I'm concerned.
notice: This post is meant to state my opinion only, not to attack anyone elses.
It would be a step backwards as far as I'm concerned.
notice: This post is meant to state my opinion only, not to attack anyone elses.
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- KVRAF
- 1820 posts since 28 Mar, 2005
i just had a novel idea. just want to say that i hear and understand the arguments against.
i believe i get jist of why it's perhaps not a pressing feature for the devs. also, i see the potential problems that could muck up the trademark tracktion workflow. so, i have a proposal.
perhaps there could be a download from the mymackie website. perhaps a "modular tab", or an extra download that could be downloaded, or not, by the new user and experienced user alike. this modular addition would just be a simple mixer tab. nothing more. just a pseudo plugin that comes in the form of an extra tab that has a vector graphic mixer, simple in features, being more like the flipped arrangement view that you guys were speaking of earlier. but without the waveform being visible. it would have little bars that represent the "filters" and their order. clicking on them brings up a box in the center of the screen that is the same as the parameter area in the arrangement view. this box would have something in it or on it that would provide an easy way for it to become invisible untilthe next instance of the need to change a parameter. all of this could be worked out later. there are endless ways to work this kind of stuff out.
the main thing being that this could be an addition that would be an extra download from mymackie or the tracktion download site. that way, new users would see tracktion, see it's traditional workflow and have the ability to get used to that way of working at first glance, and see the way it originated and then decide to add the extra funcionality or not, for themselves.
it empowers the user to have what they want, as with plugins, but it adds a functionality in the form of a tab, beside the settings tab and other tabs, out of plain view.
this is just ideas. it sounds like a good idea to several others that i have spoken to, and it should appeal to the traditionalists.
i believe i get jist of why it's perhaps not a pressing feature for the devs. also, i see the potential problems that could muck up the trademark tracktion workflow. so, i have a proposal.
perhaps there could be a download from the mymackie website. perhaps a "modular tab", or an extra download that could be downloaded, or not, by the new user and experienced user alike. this modular addition would just be a simple mixer tab. nothing more. just a pseudo plugin that comes in the form of an extra tab that has a vector graphic mixer, simple in features, being more like the flipped arrangement view that you guys were speaking of earlier. but without the waveform being visible. it would have little bars that represent the "filters" and their order. clicking on them brings up a box in the center of the screen that is the same as the parameter area in the arrangement view. this box would have something in it or on it that would provide an easy way for it to become invisible untilthe next instance of the need to change a parameter. all of this could be worked out later. there are endless ways to work this kind of stuff out.
the main thing being that this could be an addition that would be an extra download from mymackie or the tracktion download site. that way, new users would see tracktion, see it's traditional workflow and have the ability to get used to that way of working at first glance, and see the way it originated and then decide to add the extra funcionality or not, for themselves.
it empowers the user to have what they want, as with plugins, but it adds a functionality in the form of a tab, beside the settings tab and other tabs, out of plain view.
this is just ideas. it sounds like a good idea to several others that i have spoken to, and it should appeal to the traditionalists.