Masterverb 5

[greendoor]

Just for the record ... since this software seems to be hardware specific, what about users who choose to never connect their music computer to the internet?

I'm peeved that important information about these security schemes is not made visible and has to be pried out of the vendors. Like I said before, it's only the people who want to do the right thing that have these hassles.

[kylen]

greendoor - what's a vendor to do for protection then? I know there are various ways, maybe there's a web page or new companies that offer crack-proof schemes. Maybe you even mentioned this somewhere else, what you recommend in other words. I've seen you talk about this a lot.

Not every one of the plugs I have licensed need C/R - a fair amount do though, less than 35% of the ones I use I think (guessing).

Here's an example: I bought an exiter bundle today...on the way to purchase it I ran across 6 cracks of it. My whole purpose of supporting these independant developers is so they CAN stay in business for a while although it's probably not enough of an income to live in many cases. Nothing is forever but it's more fun for me when things come to a natural conclusion instead of some premature accident or losing out to a crack...

[rpmartino]

Rob - thank you for replying. My rant wasn't intended to mean any disrepect. It was just frustration, because I hav no intention of trying your product due to this C/R issue.

You seem to be confirming my worst suspicion that this software is hardware specific, and if I purchased this, I would forever be dependant on you to provide new registration keys each time I change hardware. That is a situation I can't tolerate.

And the point I was trying to make is that this process is as automated as possible and our customer support borders on obsessive to the point where we make sure there is really no down time as far as your use of our plug-ins. We go out of our way to make sure you will not be left hanging from using our products, and we were fully willing to take on this extra support when we decided to go back to C/R protection.

The short version: you don't trust me not to copy your software. You don't know me, and you don't know how passionate I am about protecting intellectual property. I want to make music - I don't want to be ripped off, and I don't want to rip anyone else off. What goes around comes around.

As much as I respect your good intentions, I have a trust issue, so I only want to buy products I can use with no strings attached.

Sorry I can't be your customer.

We trust our customers enough that we don't have separate demo/full installer versions, and we allow multiple registrations to unlock as many copies of the software as you need. With a simple serial number that unlocked ANY copy of a plug-in, all it takes is one person out of thousands to ruin it all by making their serial number public. The solution we have is the best way we could come up with to minimize extra steps and make it easy as possible to use our software. The worst that can happen is that you get a new machine, install the plug-ins again (which are fully functional for 30-days) get a new keycode from our website, and if you have used them up and need another we provide that within a day or add more registrations to your serial number (well before any demo version would expire). And in the case of a contingency plan (should something bad happen to the company) we could modify the system to provide unlimited keycodes or permanently unlocked versions. I don't see how you can lose.

When we had the simple serial number scheme, sales slowed to a crawl. When we re-instituted the C/R scheme, sales picked up. What else can I possibly conclude from that? We had to take SOME measure to protect our livelihood, and we chose a solution that minimized hassle to the customer.

[Frippertronix]

you have a creamware card?

or did you test the Timeworks 4080L vst reverb?

I was asking about the two that are available in DX format. The latest one is $250. I've been considering it but would have to use a wrapper since Tracktion 2 doesn't do DX. I have the demo but haven't tested it yet.

[rpmartino]

Just for the record ... since this software seems to be hardware specific, what about users who choose to never connect their music computer to the internet?

I'm peeved that important information about these security schemes is not made visible and has to be pried out of the vendors. Like I said before, it's only the people who want to do the right thing that have these hassles.

We do have users who don't have their DAW computer connected to the internet, all you need is the Machine ID (a 5 digit number) from the About box of the plug-in, and you can register from a different computer, or call or email us to get the keycode. There is no behind-the-scenes negotiation between the computer with the plug-ins and our registration system.

We also have a FAQ on our website that attempts to explain the deal with our registration system. Hopefully none of what I've been saying is coming as a surprise to anyone.

I can't make the point strong enough... I respect the PRINCIPLE of what you are saying but from a PRACTICAL perspective there is really no way anyone is going to get stuck, unable to use a product they bought from us.

[fritzman]

...
We trust our customers enough that we don't have separate demo/full installer versions, and we allow multiple registrations to unlock as many copies of the software as you need. With a simple serial number that unlocked ANY copy of a plug-in, all it takes is one person out of thousands to ruin it all by making their serial number public. The solution we have is the best way we could come up with to minimize extra steps and make it easy as possible to use our software. The worst that can happen is that you get a new machine, install the plug-ins again (which are fully functional for 30-days) get a new keycode from our website, and if you have used them up and need another we provide that within a day or add more registrations to your serial number (well before any demo version would expire). And in the case of a contingency plan (should something bad happen to the company) we could modify the system to provide unlimited keycodes or permanently unlocked versions. I don't see how you can lose.

When we had the simple serial number scheme, sales slowed to a crawl. When we re-instituted the C/R scheme, sales picked up. What else can I possibly conclude from that? We had to take SOME measure to protect our livelihood, and we chose a solution that minimized hassle to the customer.

That all sounds very reasonable to me! Respect!

[greendoor]

I can respect that too - by not buying this product.

I would dare to suggest that sales of the old verb dried up because there are hundreds of reverb plugins and the old version simply doesn't compete with the best out there.

Maybe the new one is good, and people are buying it despite the C/R limitation.

If a company is giving "obsessive support", pretty soon that company is going to experience burn out and just walk away.

I predict in a few years most people will have had bad experiences with C/R and hopefully the tide will turn. I just don't need the hassel.

As Kylen said - he could have bought cracks, but he choses to support a vendor by buying the product.

This reverb will probably be cracked anyway - that's not the point. The point is, let the buyer beware.

[Squish]

I decided not to buy a Hamburger today because I didn't like the type of cheese they used.
Just thought I'd let everyone know.

[scam_artist]

I've had a change of heart about copy protection this last year or so. I'd rather go through the challenge/response process when installing plugs, than discover that the company making the plugs has gone out of business and will no longer be developing them. I think CR is a small price to pay to protect your investment

For the record, I've found Wavearts CR to be painless, and they respond helpfully if there are any CR issues.... I recently maxed out my number of installs on TrackPlug due to reformatting machines and changing to new machines, but Wavearts were helpful and got me back in business without much delay (and they're on the other side of the world from me)

[scam_artist]

... since this software seems to be hardware specific, what about users who choose to never connect their music computer to the internet?

my music machine has internet access. you're right, for people who's music computer doesn't have access the issue needs to be addressed

[Squish]

It has been,, 6 posts up.

[dirtnap]

I decided not to buy a Hamburger today because I didn't like the type of cheese they used.
Just thought I'd let everyone know.

Seriously. To heck with this c/r "issue". Quit wasting the developer's time with this dribble. Voice your concerns with email.

You want to complain about future support? How about the time I bought a $500 multi fx unit from an unnamed manufacturer and it went tits up about a month after the 1 yr warranty period. They wanted... $300 to repair it.

Did I spend the next year crusading against 1 yr warranties and demand lifetime warranties for all future products or I'd never buy again? No, I took it to an electronics shop and they fixed it for $40.

the end.

[scam_artist]

It has been,, 6 posts up.

oops, i hadn't thought of what rpmartino said as I've never had to enable a plugin from a internet disabled machine... sounds pretty painless though

[Squish]

I decided not to buy a Hamburger today because I didn't like the type of cheese they used.
Just thought I'd let everyone know.

Seriously. To heck with this c/r "issue". Quit wasting the developer's time with this dribble. Voice your concerns with email.

You want to complain about future support? How about the time I bought a $500 multi fx unit from an unnamed manufacturer and it went tits up about a month after the 1 yr warranty period. They wanted... $300 to repair it.

Did I spend the next year crusading against 1 yr warranties and demand lifetime warranties for all future products or I'd never buy again? No, I took it to an electronics shop and they fixed it for $40.

the end.

Umm, that was sarcasm pointed AT the C/R complainers.
My point is, some people come on here and complain everytime there's a new plug with C/R and it goes nowhere. I thought I would complain about something alse that won't change.
I happen to really like the Wave Arts stuff and am really impressed by their support. And with a mild C/R and a statement from the company that all will be in favor of the costumer if the plugs ever stop being developed, that's the type of company I want to support.
Now, if it were a dongle....

[kmonkey]

Can we go back to the sound of this great reverb please

Cant believe. Few of you guys can write down a whole satan bible about C/R scheme...But at the end of day we all know what are those peoples.

Dongles, wrongles, numbers, can we speak about music now and about that reverb?

THX