KVR Audio

LiteOn · Post by **LiteOn** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 9:49 pm

Urs wrote:
LiteOn wrote:Do the competitors talk about at tradeshows?
Whenever we find time between the beers!

Always a pleasure to have you in a conversation.

fabi · Post by **fabi** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 9:59 pm

dover666 wrote:yeah, freeware is of lesser quality... maybe there are some people out there that feel that way....

there are also thousands of freeware developers out there who feel like they are doing a good thing, sharing a learning process and not trying to make a buck out of EVERY SINGLE THING THEY CAN PULL OUT OF THEIR COLLECTIVE ASSES!!!!!!!!!!

you DO KNOW THAT THAT WASN'T HIS opinion, right? NO NEED TO YELL!!!! WE CAN HEAR YOU JUST FINE!!!!

dover666 · Post by **dover666** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 10:06 pm

yeah, sorry, i just get real defensive about freeware... animation software is highly over priced as well... and i also had a buyware demo of se modules bite me the other day.. I am an advocate of open source as it allows knowledge to be imparted upon all of us, and also give us freedom to add our own "things".... any way, i'm sorry for shouting... ever been to sourceforge?

fabi · Post by **fabi** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 10:29 pm

dover666 wrote:yeah, sorry, i just get real defensive about freeware...

ever been to sourceforge?

it's okay, i get defensive, too. sorry for yelling back.

nope, never been to sourceforge - why do you ask, is there a lot of yelling or a lot of knowledge shared? maybe both?

BONES · Post by **BONES** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 10:33 pm

shamann wrote:I saw elsewhere about your discovery of Toxic, but come to think of it, Maxx Claster's entire synth line fits squarely in good, simple, cheap.

Yeah and it gets better. I sent Maxx an email last night and he seems interested in doing a 4-op/oscillator version of it which would be even more awesome. He was cold on my idea of modulating the values in the FM matrix though, which is a shame.

Red_Force wrote:And he doesn't really know about freeware (which is supposedly of lesser quality than the warezware in his mind)

He probably got that idea from around here.

pdxindy wrote:It is just expectations in your mind (each persons mind). Coupled with your ability to make a synth yourself.

I can't make synths myself, I can use SynthEdit and I mostly do that because no-one else makes the kind of instruments I want/need. I find it takes a big effort of will to sit down and do it, its not fun.

Something like Zebra2 is capable enough that you do not need much more. add in an inexpensive host like Tracktion. A few effects items maybe. An audio interface, a controller, and a computer, and you have abilities that people would have paid tens of thousands of dollars for just a decade ago and many that far surpass what was possible then.

My Trinity could do all of that and more for around $4000 which not a whole lot more expensive than a PC+software+controller and has a whole 'nuther set of advantages. When I sold mine someone got all that for $1100 which makes a PC+software+controller look very expensive.

sosayweall · Post by **sosayweall** » Wed Jan 11, 2006 11:16 pm

Red_Force wrote:
fabi wrote:i just had a look at the symptohm tutorial and manual download numbers - 1549 and 3223. i guess units sold will be less than that. a shame, really.
Last time I checked it was something like 560 units (not including PE). It's not big considering the dev cost (by far the biggest in our catalog) but it's important to note it's not bad either, just average for us. Twice this number would be a big hit for the online market.

Keep in mind than the afford mentionned 5k happy fews did it via boxes, and that four boxes at least are needed to be as rewarding (for the manufacturer) than an online one.

This said there are far more than five that passed the 5K roof imo. Nearly all are packed with large samples amount...

Can't help it but have to say this. I've always thought a brilliant product like symptohm should have sold more than 10,000 copies easily. Really. Everyone alive should buy one if they can. It's a crying shame that such a great plug still can't make a huge hit, for whatever reason. There must be something seriously wrong with the way the market of audio software works.

BONES · Post by **BONES** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 12:19 am

Well, for me it is nowhere near immediate enough for the way I like to work. Then there are its filters which, if I recall, left me cold.

uvacom · Post by **uvacom** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 2:17 am

I like the sound of symptohm, but the artsy layout and silly parameter names and such really turn me off. I won't buy a synth that I don't like using. With a more utilitarian GUI, I might consider it - but I might not, I am pretty happy with what I have. Between Fabfilter Twin, Spectra, Surge, and Shortcircuit I feel like I've got my bases pretty well covered. If anything at all is missing, it's FM. But I'm holding out for something that can truly best an FS1R.

Amberience · Post by **Amberience** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 2:21 am

I find making synths in Max really fun. I just never have sat down to learn SynthEdit. One day I will have to get around to that and provide some decent enough sound manglers.

snooky · Post by **snooky** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 2:25 am

Chibs' Bath Toy wrote:I find making synths in Max really fun. I just never have sat down to learn SynthEdit. One day I will have to get around to that and provide some decent enough sound manglers.

gott any to share

hu? hu?

shamann · Post by **shamann** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 2:25 am

Chibs' Bath Toy wrote:I just never have sat down to learn SynthEdit. One day I will have to get around to that and provide some decent enough sound manglers.

It'll take you about an hour to learn the basics. Just open the help file and follow the tutorial to the letter. Seriously, one hour. The complicated stuff comes later, mostly with the graphics.

mooter · Post by **mooter** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 3:24 am

Prices?

How much is milk in Glasgow?

A Gallon

Improv · Post by **Improv** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 5:56 am

uvacom wrote:I like the sound of symptohm, but the artsy layout and silly parameter names and such really turn me off. I won't buy a synth that I don't like using. With a more utilitarian GUI, I might consider it - but I might not,

Did you know that all Ohmforce effects units and synths (including Symptohm) come in both Classic or Funky skins?

http://www.ohmforce.com/ViewProduct.do?p=SymptohmPE

The classic skin is like a rack mount unit functional look and the Funky skin is the over the top artsy look. Your choice.

Red_Force · Post by **Red_Force** » Thu Jan 12, 2006 11:51 am

Red_Force wrote:
And he doesn't really know about freeware (which is supposedly of lesser quality than the warezware in his mind)
He probably got that idea from around here.

I hope not. kvraudio is probably the place where freeware got the best representation and this is IMO one of the things that makes kvr... kvr.

Free plug are just great. I personnally use the Kjaherus stuff at least during the "rough" part of composing and I don't mind keeping them in the final mix if I am too lazy to fire my Vintage Warmer NFR

BTW I really can't tell an exact number but frohmageitself has pretty certainly be downloaded more than a million time, and possibily two. Some other sites host it and it has been included on a lot of free CDs so it's hard to tell... But even just ohmforce downloads history are allready close or passed the million. Of course, it's here for five years now so... And I am not counting this

!

About what could be done ? I honestly think the best chance lay in people here. Evangelise the idea of paying for software, explain how much better it is to have a free Synth1 than a cracked Imposcar if you're new to synthesis, that you rarely happend to use efficiently something you didn't buy, than direct link with devs is so valuable. Remind that you can buy a controler, some monitors, a screen and a CPU but that none of this will help you define your sound - only your plugin does, so in the end, this is the one industry you need to support most. Threaten them, manipulate them, seduce them... whatever

. You probably can't convince them frontally but having this question in the background year after year after year do convert ppl IMO.

On our side, we shall take opportunity to have cheap plugins. Like Bones said, something at or below the $100 is often needed. Something significant but that won't put your month in a mess...

EDIT : the winamp.com stats is weak as it has been reseted a few years ago. Last time I checked before the reset it was something like 500K... Not that it matters thus

why are most soft synths and effects so expensive?