Software has NEVER ACHIEVED Decent Guitar Distortion. Nope.

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Trevor, I have to think that you don't know from much, if you think that the Warp's Mesa is the best sim "so far" (as of page 3... I gave up reading the rest...).

That opinion makes the rest of the thread pointless by comparison to other (and there have been hundreds) similar threads with better info.

And a Bad Monkey? Into what? The distortion pedal alone, you mean?

:nutter:

Sascha is very diplomatic, and I guess I should be, too, since I'm carrying a "company badge" in my signature line. But speaking only as Greg Pettit, guitar player, your opinion can never mean anything to me. You like the worst VST amp sim ever created, and that's all I need to know. ;)

Now, a related but hopefully separate point: The most intelligent point so far was made by Sascha when he pointed out that people have gotten GOD-AWFUL tone out of tube amps. Tubes don't instantly create good tone. Boss and others have proven that "analog" (ie. resistors, capacitors, etc.) can be sonically horrible as well. However, these same people with 'terrible tone' have recorded legendary tracks and are very well known as innovators. And, their tone, 'terrible' as it may seem when compared to the "standard good tone" formulas, is unique to each player. Go figure.

Greg
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Lunch Money wrote:I have to think that you don't know from much, if you think that the Warp's Mesa is the best sim "so far" (as of page 3... I gave up reading the rest...).
Thing is, there's a few aspects in that warp sim that others still haven't quite covered. Keep in mind it's an "early VST" licensed implementation of the Hughes & Kettner zenTera technology. Those amps still mop the floor with line6 stuff.

Sure the plug sounds buzzy and aliases like hell, but it does have the zentera components in it (although not in full precision), and for example the plexi model has a certain "thunk" that I haven't heard elsewhere, same with the Mesa model cabinet "sag".

Yes it's outdated, but let's not forget these little bits of greatness it still has. For 50e, it's not an entirely bad deal.

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aciddose wrote:any time someone posts a thread like this it should result in immediate posting of goatse and tubgirl links
i like the way this guy thinks

(xhip is great)

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its shows up peoples 'preset junkie' attitude a lot of the time i reckon when they load up an amp sim and cant get a sound they like out of it.

each sim is different. just like each real amp is different. you can expect to carry over the kind of setting u'd use on real kit into virtual stuff. you have to learn your virtual amp. just like any bit of kit, hard or soft - you need to learn it inside out so u can make the sound u want.

bottom line - virtual amps are fine - if you use them well. real amps are maybe a little easier to get a certain tone out of - but with the right signal chain and a bit of know-how - you can add a whole lot more to your sonic pallette with virtual stuff.

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My spies inform me that Kingston wrote:Sure the plug sounds buzzy and aliases like hell
Hmm, isn't that what the engineers said about Hendrix?
Wait... loot _then_ burn? D'oh!

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Kingston,

No doubt there's a silver lining in ANY cloud, but let's vace it... Warp VST is teh suxorz, and I wouldn't recommend it to ANYONE at the $35 CDN you could get it for here. I mean, some effects are absolutely coveted for the fact that they sound nothing like what they should sound like, but that's only relevant if it's the "side-effect sound" that you're after. As an amp sim, Warp is notoriously bad. Good for the time doesn't mean good now.

Greg
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Empty Uranus wrote:Anyway - I went out and checked a few.

X-Amp. I was impressed. Best heavy distorted sound I've heard yet. In fact, I was impressed enough to where I might use it some. No - I still couldn't get the natural balls out of it that my MkIIC has, but still - damn!

Juicy 77 - not impressed at all. Sounded like a carefully executed fart. Not good.

Chimp - Sucked. You can't get music out of a damned monkey.

Crunchdude - Pathetic.

G-Amp Classic - Not very good at all.

Alien Connections Revalver - Not really.
Im sorry but there is no way you could fairly judge those like so in one day.
Mind you, I'm pretty much going into these things and trying to get Iommi right off that bat. Why? Because THOSE are the hardest sounds to get.
Which is why you should actually put time into them. :D

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Iommi's tone sucks goat balls on many tracks. He's the riff-master, but that doesn't mean his tone was any good.

I agree, it IS hard to get the sound of a mediocre amp with bad mic technique and poor sound engineering and production values. ;)

Greg
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Greg,

Your post is frankly abusive.

Regardless of what you think of my choices in VST's, you have shown yourself to be a person of really poor social skills (sound familiar?).

But let's cut to the chase:

I'll post music that I have actually produced and performed on if you do the same. Then we shall see who the true incompetent is.

Deal?

P.S.: Performed AND produced :wink:


Lunch Money wrote:Trevor, I have to think that you don't know from much, if you think that the Warp's Mesa is the best sim "so far" (as of page 3... I gave up reading the rest...).

That opinion makes the rest of the thread pointless by comparison to other (and there have been hundreds) similar threads with better info.

And a Bad Monkey? Into what? The distortion pedal alone, you mean?

:nutter:

Sascha is very diplomatic, and I guess I should be, too, since I'm carrying a "company badge" in my signature line. But speaking only as Greg Pettit, guitar player, your opinion can never mean anything to me. You like the worst VST amp sim ever created, and that's all I need to know. ;)

Now, a related but hopefully separate point: The most intelligent point so far was made by Sascha when he pointed out that people have gotten GOD-AWFUL tone out of tube amps. Tubes don't instantly create good tone. Boss and others have proven that "analog" (ie. resistors, capacitors, etc.) can be sonically horrible as well. However, these same people with 'terrible tone' have recorded legendary tracks and are very well known as innovators. And, their tone, 'terrible' as it may seem when compared to the "standard good tone" formulas, is unique to each player. Go figure.

Greg

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i'm not a geetar player however, in all other areas of music distortion is such a subjective thing that there is no good and bad, only different.

personally i have several and they all get some use from time to time. stomp box, vst, f**k off huge geetar amp... who gives a crap what box they are in as long as they do what you want.

as i say, i know very little about playing geetar but if it was me i'd stop chasing the "holy grail" and get on with making some music.

mostly i just wanted to post this cos the thread title reminds me of my little lad in the playground with his freinds...

batman could never beat spidermain in a fight ever... nope.

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bah

for me this sound is good :

(right mouse button and save as)
http://guitarnik.altervista.org/sounds/cruncho.mp3

and this is a VST plug

Today the vst ampsim made giant steps...

the rest are words...

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Niksounds wrote:bah

for me this sound is good :

(right mouse button and save as)
http://guitarnik.altervista.org/sounds/cruncho.mp3

and this is a VST plug

Today the vst ampsim made giant steps...

the rest are words...
What ampsim? Sounds like Waves GTR. That's a great tone but for some odd reason it sounds too... direct. I'm not sure how to word it, sorry. Maybe it's just too dry?

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Read until page 4, and well Sascha, have some drinks during hot nights, these days Hannover and Amburgo beat them all, 33° in my flat last night, arrghhh, but reading your posts here was something to learn from. (By the way, and staying OT, my girlfriend is from a peasant's home, and yes, pigs don't sweat, they get a heart-attack and die in such temperatures. You might understand a bit now my dislike of "diszszsz the ecologists" (which after all were right in their anticipations what was to come) by boasting people like DJ Marusha in shows about "the 70s and 80s" in music.)

Concerning WAVES, I wanted to test that thing, and didn't, well, because of dongles. And I wrote a review for KVR why I couldn't review Amplitube2, but it was deleted by KVR :D . Still, maybe roaring a bit more about such companies was something too hot nights are good for :lol: .

Lunch, why should you stop telling what you think just because of the company :) . But then, others like this Warp I don't know, and what the heck is bad in that. I'd wish I had Sascha's hands maybe (never seen them except a part of them on some pic yesterday :lol: ) and the ability to test 1/20 of his equipment, hard/software. I have not. So the result is, you can learn much from him, not really much from me (apart from the "fact" that Jan Akkerman isn't bad as a guitar-player, one of the best for me besides the well-known names too, maybe not for many others). So I use what I can get my hands on, and read through 6 pages of threads like this, and get about 1-2 sites with information.
What was this thread about? Distortion? I play 4 Samick-guitars (because a nephew I really like always wants 2, so it was no good idea to get just one master-axe), great value for money if you'd ask me (what you didn't :hihi: ). Surely crap for guys with a most versatile master-Strat and so on, but I talked to about 20 Hamburg-guitar-players around, listened to one as he played, he owns a most expensive Strat, a ES-335 copy (brand forgotten, epiphone and old??) and a Gibson SG. He played the "SG" -copy of Samick and it sounded MARVELLOUS to my ears, and of course if I played the Gibson he'd not find it this great... I played with the GR2-demo and loved it, but maybe because I never owned a real fine amp (and I couldn't use it too, another story which leads to moving from here anyway).
Then there are those hot nights, I just have QuantumFX with various effects, Aura pro, a up to now not released free VST as beta-tester :love: , then some other freebies anyone likes like Simulanalog, Free ampSE and more, and a maybe not very well thought of GXstack which I use with various other effects, trying them out in hot nights (did I mention we have 33° under the roof, the walls giving a shitty heat, minimal addition being the rather many postmodern glass-buildings of enormous beauty around everywhere, they just forgot to think about humans - humans and pigs can't go into those architectural - philosophical wonders at all, only if the huge huge air-conditioning-systems run 24 HOURS A DAY, unbelievable, thanks you philosophers and architects!).

I'd get Guitar Rig 2 if it would be included in this Native-instruments-anniversary-thing (just saw that there is a dropped price for K2-owners for the Akoustik piano, if anyone's interested. My grand-grandma had a Bechstein - Fluegel until the Nazis stole it, and this is apparently the first simulation of that apart from a 11000Hz-Bechstein-sf2 which isn't sounding in any way like a simulation of a Bechstein).
I'd love to test this Waves-thing just to buy a 2nd-hand-one later at ebay, but as explained by others, forget dongles.

I don't own any decent hardware besides the ampsim of Vamp2 and some older Korg AX100G or so. But then, with Voxengo and Kjaerhus and QuantumFX and Cloneensemble and Bigtick and Ohmforce and Silverspike and envelope followers from Cockaigne and countless more plugins I get a tone from time to time that I love.

Now there are 2 possibilities (besides killing oneself, like Hermann Hesse thought of as being a good idea to have in your life as a possible solution if nothing helps, Steppenwolf, still a wonderful book).
I could go to the CDs I have, listen to Jan Akkerman or SRV or anyone, say Akkerman and read what he uses, ooh ahh Lowden OS 25, oo Peavey, oh Gibson, oh Framus made especially for him (or another brand, forgot), and any things he uses. Then sit down and cry.
Or I can open the window (always open at nights these weeks), shout something like "could you please reduce the volume of your 187minutes-4-to-the-floor-housedrums from 135dB to 129,9dB please", and getting no answer like all nights. Then I could sigh and simply play with my headphones, (don't ask me why the neighbour comes to ME if I wouldn't play with headphones :roll: ) delete what I don't like, save what I like.

On the other hand, I couldn't make a living out of this, but from time to time threads like "which reverb-setting do you use for your guitar, and how is R2 from Silverspike for this" is a good read. So why ranting against Warp or Wasp or Wax or nightmares?
What is this about? Well, it's some arguments in here, and then it's this damn damn hot... :hihi:

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markdeaton wrote:
Niksounds wrote:bah

for me this sound is good :

(right mouse button and save as)
http://guitarnik.altervista.org/sounds/cruncho.mp3

and this is a VST plug

Today the vst ampsim made giant steps...

the rest are words...
What ampsim? Sounds like Waves GTR. That's a great tone but for some odd reason it sounds too... direct. I'm not sure how to word it, sorry. Maybe it's just too dry?

It sounds pretty damn good to me. I personally never owned an expensive tube amp (only played them in studios etc), but I would imagine you would need to spend at least 1k+ to get a nice clean sound like that. And I agree with Sasha, GTR sounds the most realistic, but the distortions (as the topic of this post) suck on all sims, and waves just seemed to "tack them on", as they sound especially lame to me.

I don't give a shit anymore as I hardly want to play with distortion anyway (just for kicks, time to time) , I'd much rather have a purty sound like the one posted above...
Everything we call real is made of things that cannot be regarded as real.
-Niels Bohr

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Cosmic Bandito wrote:
markdeaton wrote:
Niksounds wrote:bah

for me this sound is good :

(right mouse button and save as)
http://guitarnik.altervista.org/sounds/cruncho.mp3

and this is a VST plug

Today the vst ampsim made giant steps...

the rest are words...
What ampsim? Sounds like Waves GTR. That's a great tone but for some odd reason it sounds too... direct. I'm not sure how to word it, sorry. Maybe it's just too dry?

It sounds pretty damn good to me. I personally never owned an expensive tube amp (only played them in studios etc), but I would imagine you would need to spend at least 1k+ to get a nice clean sound like that. And I agree with Sasha, GTR sounds the most realistic, but the distortions (as the topic of this post) suck on all sims, and waves just seemed to "tack them on", as they sound especially lame to me.

I don't give a shit anymore as I hardly want to play with distortion anyway (just for kicks, time to time) , I'd much rather have a purty sound like the one posted above...

ALL my sample is on Waves GTR

really dinamic and realistic "machine"

GTR, for dinamics and "natural transparency" on guitar picks, is the best. IMHO and for my ears.

Is not a AMP SIM... but a RECORDING AMP SIM

This sound is really good, no words for me too (sound that i created in five minuts...)

BYE to all. Nik.

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