Software has NEVER ACHIEVED Decent Guitar Distortion. Nope.

[Empty Uranus]

Others I've tried here in the last few hours:

"Tube Amp" - sucked.

"Free Amp" - not too bad.

Boogex - I'm shocked at all the happiness it's created in here. I just don't see it. Pretty lame to me.

Tube Baby - Now HERE was one that I've had a little fun with. Pretty simple, but I got to the "Fat Rock 2" setting, tweaked it just a tad, and that's pretty close to what Iommi was getting with his Laney around '72-'74. Has that cool low-mid "Grunt". I've always like that one.

[aciddose]

i've always kind of felt "amp sims" are a bit rediculous. i mean, isnt the majority of the feel of a cube amp in the tone of the speaker/cabinet? generally the drive on those amplitifers is pretty bad in my opinion. cant we all just mic the things and shut the f**k up?

i mean, find me a cube amp that doesnt rattle at certain frequencies because of the joints in the wood/metal being loose. find me one where the grill doesnt vibrate. find me one where it sounds even remotely the same when you tap the signal off before the main drivers to the speaker...

guitar guys seem to be nuts about different "types" of distortion where there are tiny differences that normally are hardly noticable. its simmilar to how the "synth" guys are attracted to the knobs and shiny front panels more than the sound of their gear. isnt it really all about actually having that cube amp rattle away like a nasty little bitch, producing bleeding ear tones that make me want to smash it with a sledge for being so damn shitty and useless?

if you really love the pedal box distortion effects, build your own. those are absolutely the most simple circuits in the world.. even a god damn crystal set is more complicated most of the time. stomp box distortion effects generally amount to being a poorly designed buffer amplifier which is passed off as an effect.

there are some good quality saturation effects out there, but they are rare. if software doesnt do it for you, just dont use software. it isnt like a stompbox will run you the $1500 most synthesizers were going for in 01. stompboxes can be found at the local pawn for $20. get real.

[Spe3D]

Boogex - I'm shocked at all the happiness it's created in here. I just don't see it. Pretty lame to me.

You did twiddle with it yes? Not just use the presets

Best regards,

Spe3d

:O)

[Empty Uranus]

Boogex - I'm shocked at all the happiness it's created in here. I just don't see it. Pretty lame to me.

You did twiddle with it yes? Not just use the presets

Best regards,

Spe3d

:O)

Ya - maybe I just need to noodle with it a little more....

Aciddose - I don't use "stomp pedal distortion". Yuck. I've got a few of them around - I'd reckon the only one I might use just to add a TINY big more would be a late 70's MXR Distortion +, but I NEVER use them while recording.

[aciddose]

i was talking about some of the general feeling of the thread and especially the original post

"I have tried Guitar Rig, Line 6 Vox, Boss, just about everything I know of, and I have never found a single distortion vst even that comes close to a $29 Digitech stomp from Guitar Center."

i mean, if he really believes that he should go spend twenty bucks on one of those peices of shit.

[jplanet]

This thread inspired me to try plugging my vintage MXR distortion into my DAW. This is what I came up with using my Rocktron Wha, Simulanalog and some Voxengo delay:

http://www.websiteandsound.com/wss/mixes/wah-solo.mp3

Noisy, but fun!

[The Chase]

"Tube Amp" - sucked.

By voxengo?

if so, learn how to use your tools. You're slagging a lot of great tools in this thread.

[aciddose]

air sucks! breathing is for losers! vaccumms are used by a lot of professionals without lungs...

stfu chase, you're probably breathing right now, so why should anyone listen to your opinion?

[Empty Uranus]

i was talking about some of the general feeling of the thread and especially the original post

"I have tried Guitar Rig, Line 6 Vox, Boss, just about everything I know of, and I have never found a single distortion vst even that comes close to a $29 Digitech stomp from Guitar Center."

i mean, if he really believes that he should go spend twenty bucks on one of those peices of shit.

Hey man - I agree with that. I've been trying all of this stuff out - tweaking, etc.. I'm pretty good in the tweak department (not meth), as I've been playing for about 26 years now. I know what to give/takeaway as far as settings. Plus - I try to listen to as many of the presets as I can find.

And as I've said - I've found a few out there that aren't too bad. They are getting these things better - I'll admit it!

However - I've yet to hear any that can touch the real thing - certainly a GOOD amp. And it's SOooooooooo much easier to find a good sound. If you've got a good amp and are getting a good sound right off the bat - you don't have to tweak shit!

Plus - what are you going to do if you have to play live? You gonna go out there with a solid state Peavy and recreate a decent sound? BWAAAAAAAAAHAHAHA!

Again - I'm still sticking by my "If it don't make heat, it ain't worth a sheet" theory.

PS: I'm still having fun playing with all this shit.

[aciddose]

i think the reason it is easy to get good tone out of hardware is that the designers of hardware spent lots of time pre-tweaking it to sound good on almost every setting. that is what seperates (well, second to engineering merits) good hardware from bad hardware, the effort put into it. i think software isnt tweaked quite as much and i think a lot of the time coders dont know where to begin with that kind of modification to the design. in hardware you design a circuit, add some modifications and start switching components to find the perfect sound.. with code, it is a little more complex because there are no components, and the numbers that you do have generally are entirely unrelated in effect to the components of a circuit with a simmilar goal.

i know what you mean, with a lot of hardware it is simply difficult to make it sound bad. but then you have to realize a lot of hardware doesnt give you much range, the hardware actually is often very limited only into that narrow range where things do always sound good. simmilar software could be made, its just a matter of more cpu power and more of the software telling you want you can/cant do.

personally, i prefer to use both the software and hardware where i can adjust it in any way i like, even if it becomes very difficult to get it to sound good without knowing that 'magic' range of each control. compare any hardware effect pedal to the equivalent software. the range of control on the software is always much greater than on the hardware, and generally you can if you try hard enough get the same settings in the software, and the same sounds as a result.

[juha_p]

Couldn't see any commenting on GTPlayer, which I mentioned, yet .. did anyone checked it?

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... c&start=36

(NOTE: GTPlayer may be confusing to start first, just press the power ON, scroll the program (patch) you like to use (up/dn arrows or wheel) and press the load button to get it active).


Juha

[Jafo]

i mean, isnt the majority of the feel of a cube amp in the tone of the speaker/cabinet?

Yes. Absolutely.

You can simulate the static tone of a tube amp, but it's the dynamic feel that we're really after. Sure, we all like buzz and fizz, but it's the response that matters: physical objects resisting physical forces. Especially, physical forces that threaten to tear apart physical objects, which are themselves just trying to hold together!

Also, there is a lot of feedback involved: the speaker and strings interact with each other dynamically. I think you get the best results from an amp sim by playing in front of one with speakers cranked. Could you model feedback with a static, previously recorded file? I really doubt it! (Although it might be neat to apply a different amp sim to the uneffected recording...)

Anyway, I'd say that the best sims are partway there on this issue, and many are quite usable -- but there is an awful lot of room for improvement.

[stag]

"Amp Sims", i don't like the name, cause at this point in time they have matured into something else.
Okay some of then can model accuratelly A guitar amp, IMO AT2 and Guitar Suite do it.

But can you automate a Guitar Amp??? i think not, they usually are one trick poney.

What purists are looking for is the already beaten dead stinkin' horse that others have ride before.

I don't mind howning tube gear: 60'S Fender Twin, JCM 800, 30 anniversary, JCM 900, Carvin Quad, JMP-1 are things that i have lugged around studios on the 90's... do i miss them??? not much really... I usually think reverse i whish i had the gear i have now back then.
The degree of control, sound(s), ho and dynamic control too, just roll down the Volume pot on Guitar Suite or AT2 and listen to the sound cleaning well.

Of course if plug your guitar straigth on the SoundBlaster ins or any of those horrid things hanging on the back of some desktops, most probably software will sound shyte, it ain't the same as plugin on TLAudio pre, MiniMe or eve FireFace.
I agree the sound of M-Audio is very good but to my ears it sounds too digital e.g., RME's FireFace rules for guitars, in other hand Ozonic can handle 8 AT2 at 128 samples while the FF800 handles two alone on my system.

So if the combination Guitar, Amp, Speakers, Cords whatever have great influence (An amp can sound great with a guitar, not so good with another and vice versa).

This rule applies to software too, people can't ignore that the quality of their I\0 is going to affect hugely their tone and feel.

[warren]

Couldn't see any commenting on GTPlayer, which I mentioned, yet .. did anyone checked it?

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... c&start=36

(NOTE: GTPlayer may be confusing to start first, just press the power ON, scroll the program (patch) you like to use (up/dn arrows or wheel) and press the load button to get it active).


Juha

Wow, I'm in love with the monstrous high gain tones that thing produces! It's a beast! I've been sitting and playing with the demo for the last hour or so.

Anyways, thanks for the heads up on that. Apparently they include this with some M-audio hardware? I'm bummed it didn't come with my delta 192 audiophile. Oh well.

[MotorMind]

Others I've tried here in the last few hours:

"Tube Amp" - sucked.

"Free Amp" - not too bad.

Boogex - I'm shocked at all the happiness it's created in here. I just don't see it. Pretty lame to me.

Tube Baby - Now HERE was one that I've had a little fun with. Pretty simple, but I got to the "Fat Rock 2" setting, tweaked it just a tad, and that's pretty close to what Iommi was getting with his Laney around '72-'74. Has that cool low-mid "Grunt". I've always like that one.

I am using Guitar Rig 2 and some ol' cheap VST plugin called "StompnFX', with good results. I suspect that your capabilities are lacking, not the programs.