KVR Audio

lex_strooder · Post by **lex_strooder** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 5:58 pm

what is missing is the stable 4.3 version release...
i guess i have to wait couple of months before any upgrade

djwglpuppy · Post by **djwglpuppy** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:01 pm

bduffy wrote: So, Audio Quantizing, then.

Basically... But for someone like me who has relied on Quantizing my Keyboards (I have been doing it since Mastertracks for the Atari)... Quantizing my Guitars now is a must now that I see what can be done (i.e. Ableton Live)

The rhythm in my Head is perfect but doesn't translate well when I record it... Having a DAW tighten up my bad actual rhythm really makes a difference.

bduffy · Post by **bduffy** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:04 pm

djwglpuppy wrote:
bduffy wrote: So, Audio Quantizing, then.

Basically... But for someone like me who has relied on Quantizing my Keyboards (I have been doing it since Mastertracks for the Atari)... Quantizing my Guitars now is a must now that I see what can be done (i.e. Ableton Live)

The rhythm in my Head is perfect but doesn't translate well when I record it... Having a DAW tighten up my bad actual rhythm really makes a difference.

So you're saying the Audio Snap in Sonar is better than the Audio Quantize/Warp in Cubase? (not being a fanboy, just curious) I thought tightening performances was pretty easy to do in Cubase.

J.C.R. · Post by **J.C.R.** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:11 pm

Sometimes I ask myself if Steinberg is doing some kind of user research or not.For example, I wait since SX1 for a useable generic remote or a not totally horrible window handling. I really

like Cubase, but imho there are some so painful faults in the concept.

stag · Post by **stag** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:11 pm

bduffy wrote:
djwglpuppy wrote:
bduffy wrote: So, Audio Quantizing, then.

Basically... But for someone like me who has relied on Quantizing my Keyboards (I have been doing it since Mastertracks for the Atari)... Quantizing my Guitars now is a must now that I see what can be done (i.e. Ableton Live)

The rhythm in my Head is perfect but doesn't translate well when I record it... Having a DAW tighten up my bad actual rhythm really makes a difference.
So you're saying the Audio Snap in Sonar is better than the Audio Quantize/Warp in Cubase? (not being a fanboy, just curious) I thought tightening performances was pretty easy to do in Cubase.

non destrutive editing, in other apps once done it's done.

djwglpuppy · Post by **djwglpuppy** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:12 pm

bduffy wrote:
djwglpuppy wrote:
bduffy wrote: So, Audio Quantizing, then.

Basically... But for someone like me who has relied on Quantizing my Keyboards (I have been doing it since Mastertracks for the Atari)... Quantizing my Guitars now is a must now that I see what can be done (i.e. Ableton Live)

The rhythm in my Head is perfect but doesn't translate well when I record it... Having a DAW tighten up my bad actual rhythm really makes a difference.
So you're saying the Audio Snap in Sonar is better than the Audio Quantize/Warp in Cubase? (not being a fanboy, just curious) I thought tightening performances was pretty easy to do in Cubase.

Why I think it is better is that Cubase uses Destructive Editing... i.e. Changes the Actual wavewform... whereas Applications like Live and Sonar alter it using there own algorithms and then play the processed audio (leaving the orginal file intact)... What if you accidentally screw up on let's say a snare hit... It is a pain in the ass to Reedit it in Cubase since the actual Waveform is all wacky but with "Non-desctructive Editing", making changes are really easy to do. A good example is download Ableton Live's demo (if you don't have it)... and click and drag any loop you have in there... Change the Tempo of the Track... notice how it plays perfect every time.... With Cubase... To get that same level with tempo would really hurt the original Wav (or .AIFF) file if you are not careful.

GThat is what works best for me... Maybe hardcore cubasers have perfected audiowarping better than I did, but Live just felt right to me for that feature:)

djwglpuppy · Post by **djwglpuppy** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:14 pm

Stag... Glad to see we are on the same page about this

stag · Post by **stag** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:18 pm

okay then the loop plays in sync but you asve to edit the groove or apply some quantize.
It's as easy as SX. Cubase has a bigger window to do that doe.
Cubase has offline processing before Ableton 1 was even released.

rSphere · Post by **rSphere** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:21 pm

missing: flexible audio routing like other daws...being able to route any track to any other in essence... group channels are limiting.

topaz · Post by **topaz** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:21 pm

as a (very old school) user of cubase and SX for me it's not a case of whats missing it's a case of what it adds that logic doesnt already have, steinberg just seem to always be behind logic then by the time they add the logic features..logic runs ahead one more time.

it reminds me of italian vs english fasion in the late 70's

bduffy · Post by **bduffy** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:21 pm

djwglpuppy wrote:
bduffy wrote:
djwglpuppy wrote:
bduffy wrote: So, Audio Quantizing, then.

Basically... But for someone like me who has relied on Quantizing my Keyboards (I have been doing it since Mastertracks for the Atari)... Quantizing my Guitars now is a must now that I see what can be done (i.e. Ableton Live)

The rhythm in my Head is perfect but doesn't translate well when I record it... Having a DAW tighten up my bad actual rhythm really makes a difference.
So you're saying the Audio Snap in Sonar is better than the Audio Quantize/Warp in Cubase? (not being a fanboy, just curious) I thought tightening performances was pretty easy to do in Cubase.
Why I think it is better is that Cubase uses Destructive Editing... i.e. Changes the Actual wavewform... whereas Applications like Live and Sonar alter it using there own algorithms and then play the processed audio (leaving the orginal file intact)... What if you accidentally screw up on let's say a snare hit... It is a pain in the ass to Reedit it in Cubase since the actual Waveform is all wacky but with "Non-desctructive Editing", making changes are really easy to do. A good example is download Ableton Live's demo (if you don't have it)... and click and drag any loop you have in there... Change the Tempo of the Track... notice how it plays perfect every time.... With Cubase... To get that same level with tempo would really hurt the original Wav (or .AIFF) file if you are not careful.

GThat is what works best for me... Maybe hardcore cubasers have perfected audiowarping better than I did, but Live just felt right to me for that feature:)

Hmmm..."destructive" editing? You sure about that? Audio editing is not destructive in Cubase unless you apply effects directly to a clip, and even then, you can undo that indefinitely into the future; each wave file has its own history.

So are we talking about, say, you got your guitar part; it's off time; you add hitpoints and move/quantize the starting points of the wave file to sync up with the downbeats? I usually just fix stray guitar parts manually, which is still non-destructive - but the audio quantize should be good for this, and is totally non-destructive.

djwglpuppy · Post by **djwglpuppy** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:25 pm

Interesting... I thought it altered the clip when You warped the file in SX3.... I might be wrong then... (it just feels so cumbersome and the way it prints the waveform on the screen looks like it is edited)

K-Slash · Post by **K-Slash** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:27 pm

stag wrote:I could careless about Radius or Sonar.
K-lash you sound like Izotope comissioner, what's wrong with MPEX and other functions no one here has tested??? hu?

Hey, no I don't work for iZotope, but I tried Radius, and I must say that it's a very high quality tool. Awesome sound !

The MPEX2 I tested in Cubase SX 3 was just making the processed audio sound like something "lo-fi". Maybe in MPEX3 they have optimized the algorithm, but you know, MPEX3 was released on spring 2004 ! Radius is the results of recent research, and has been released this summer.

But no matter about the release date, it's the sound quality I'm judging.

And the fact that MPEX4 has been announced on april 2006, and not being licensed in Cubase 4 which is coming in autumn, you know that's weird because there is 2 more years of research an optimization between MPEX3 and MPEX4...

K-Slash · Post by **K-Slash** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:30 pm

So, I'll be testing Cubase 4 through my retailer when it will be out in the store, and I'll do a post about it later on this forum.

I'll come with a USB-key full of plenty waves files (solo instruments, mixes...) to time-stretch and pitch-shift and I'll make a comparaison between Cubase 4's MPEX3/AudioWarp, and Sonar 6's Radius/AudioSnap.

Are you okay about this ?

You can send me .wav files for being pitched or stretched if you want...

djwglpuppy · Post by **djwglpuppy** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:32 pm

K-Slash wrote:So, I'll be testing Cubase 4 through my retailer when it will be out in the store, and I'll do a post about it later on this forum.

I'll come with a USB-key of plenty waves files (solo instruments, mixes...) to time-strech and pitch-shift and I'll make a comparaison between Cubase 4's MPEX3/AudioWarp, and Sonar 6's Radius/AudioSnap.

Are you okay about this ?

You can send me .wav files for being pitched or stretched if you want...

More than Okay... Would love that.

What is missing from Cubase 4