KVR Audio

brok landers · Post by **brok landers** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:52 am

i think the point that pipeline was trying to set here was, that, no matter what you use, if it can't be told apart in the end, it might be as well considered to be as good as the original ...
i can agree with that to a a very high degree, though not all in general ...
but i often made the experiance that users who only work analog asked me if the compression on a certain signal was "this and that" ... then i tell them it was a vst plugin, no specialized emulation or such and they jumped off their chair, not believing it ... "i could swear i heard the [whatever unit, place her whatever you like]" ...
fact is, if a compressorplugin is versatile, with a lot of useful parameters, and that compressor meets someone who really knows his stuff, you'd be constantly wondering what he achieves with traditional, nonhyped plugins ...

skill trumps gear (to a certain degree), that easy ...

championrabbit · Post by **championrabbit** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 8:03 am

Kingston wrote:and hence more mis-information is spread.

Exactly my point!

Yeah, Pipeline might be entirely harmless, and his 'Big I Am' act might not in itself cause planes to fall tumbling from the sky, but if people like him (bluffers) are allowed to get away with it then it serves only to spread misinformation.

What it the value of any 'technical' forum (even such a rudimentary one as this) if the 'facts' shared are nothing but bluff and bluster?

Not only is it not productive, it's counter-productive since a bunch of people will (having read a post such as Pipeline's) believe something that is simply wrong.

I'm not pretending to be an expert, but I have a good nose for bullshit.

rileyrooden · Post by **rileyrooden** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 8:29 am

well, what i got from all this- which i think could be a good point hiding in all the foulness - is that reacomp doesn't necessarily have to be a sterile sounding compressor. not only can it have "character", but it has a good deal of controls that will allow the user to shape it to his/her liking. if someone can tinker with it enough to make it sound like a setting on a piece of hardware they like... good for him/her! i'm mainly interested in being able to customize the "character" based on what i feel would be cool in my song!

so if this is how it works.. well i'll have to start digging in!

bduffy · Post by **bduffy** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 8:31 am

I just want to make my drums nice.

Marduchk · Post by **Marduchk** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 8:34 am

championrabbit wrote:
Kingston wrote:and hence more mis-information is spread.
Exactly my point!

Yeah, Pipeline might be entirely harmless, and his 'Big I Am' act might not in itself cause planes to fall tumbling from the sky, but if people like him (bluffers) are allowed to get away with it then it serves only to spread misinformation.

What it the value of any 'technical' forum (even such a rudimentary one as this) if the 'facts' shared are nothing but bluff and bluster?

Not only is it not productive, it's counter-productive since a bunch of people will (having read a post such as Pipeline's) believe something that is simply wrong.

I'm not pretending to be an expert, but I have a good nose for bullshit.

ahh, so it was bluffing then.. so you can tell the difference between pipline's explaination and kinston??? perhaps you share with us!!!

not to mention that another guy came in and proved kinston wrong...

how do you think?

Pipelineaudio · Post by **Pipelineaudio** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 8:38 am

championrabbit wrote:
Kingston wrote:and hence more mis-information is spread.
Exactly my point!

Yeah, Pipeline might be entirely harmless, and his 'Big I Am' act might not in itself cause planes to fall tumbling from the sky, but if people like him (bluffers) are allowed to get away with it then it serves only to spread misinformation.

What it the value of any 'technical' forum (even such a rudimentary one as this) if the 'facts' shared are nothing but bluff and bluster?

Not only is it not productive, it's counter-productive since a bunch of people will (having read a post such as Pipeline's) believe something that is simply wrong.

I'm not pretending to be an expert, but I have a good nose for bullshit.

Nice, yet again an ad-hominem attack against me but nothing against the points I was making. Oh well, if you cant fight the message, fight the messenger right?

Anyhow, just so we know Im familiar with the pieces we are speaking about

That is a pic from a few minues ago of my home mixing setup. Pardon the ugly face, my baby snake just barfed up a pinky, then ate it again.

Note behind me are A Manley Vari-Mu, a DVC, an Eventide and some other goodies. The Vari Mu has remained unplugged since Justin Started working on ReaComp, as it is no longer needed. I plugged it in to test ReaInsert the other day, thats it.

I dont show this to brag, but to show I DO know WTF Im talking about, Im INTIMATELY familiar with the gear, and I do this for a LIVING, not a hobby, and have for quite some time.

If the plugs didnt work, that gear would be LIT UP instead and in use. I dont say these things work because Im some sort of dark audio disinformation agent, or whatever whack conspiracy you might come up with.

But Im sure youll keep on with the character attacks insead of arguing against the content of my message. How was the SULA preset?

Pipelineaudio · Post by **Pipelineaudio** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 8:41 am

rileyrooden wrote:well, what i got from all this- which i think could be a good point hiding in all the foulness - is that reacomp doesn't necessarily have to be a sterile sounding compressor. not only can it have "character", but it has a good deal of controls that will allow the user to shape it to his/her liking. if someone can tinker with it enough to make it sound like a setting on a piece of hardware they like... good for him/her! i'm mainly interested in being able to customize the "character" based on what i feel would be cool in my song! so if this is how it works.. well i'll have to start digging in!

THAT was the whole point! Thank you for summing up what all us long winded, puffballs couldnt say in 5 pages

Spot on

championrabbit · Post by **championrabbit** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:04 am

Marduchk wrote:ahh, so it was bluffing then.. so you can tell the difference between pipline's explaination and kinston??? perhaps you share with us!!!

not to mention that another guy came in and proved kinston wrong...

how do you think?

No, it wasn't bluffing. There's a significant distance between not having a clue, and being an expert. I'm no expert.

I'm not even vaguely interested in 'proving' anything, I just think it's worth pointing out bullshit when I see it.

I'll leave the bickering to those who enjoy a good bicker.

Roni · Post by **Roni** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:04 am

rileyrooden wrote:well, what i got from all this- which i think could be a good point hiding in all the foulness - is that reacomp doesn't necessarily have to be a sterile sounding compressor. not only can it have "character", but it has a good deal of controls that will allow the user to shape it to his/her liking. if someone can tinker with it enough to make it sound like a setting on a piece of hardware they like... good for him/her! i'm mainly interested in being able to customize the "character" based on what i feel would be cool in my song! so if this is how it works.. well i'll have to start digging in!

+1

BTW

GREAT popcorn

POINTLESS argument (to a highly SUBJECTIVE issue

)

koolkeys · Post by **koolkeys** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:12 am

Sir Swami predicts that nobody will ever prove their case here. He also believes that both Pipeline and Kingston know what they are talking about but don't know what the other is talking about, confusing the subject.

Me predicts that koolkeys rules the world, and refuses to make heads and tales of this useless argument.

koolkeys is smarter then you all. Have a nice day.

Brent

Kingston · Post by **Kingston** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:45 am

Pipelineaudio wrote:The Vari Mu has remained unplugged since Justin Started working on ReaComp, as it is no longer needed.

possible causes:

1. ear wax problems

2. severe tinnitus

3. recent audio interface upgrade with too little I/O for outboard usage.

4. you're just kidding, right?

5. not your studio

I mean, WTF. ReaComp is just another plugin compressor among many others and you're trying to convince people it fares well with 5k hardware.

What's your angle here? do you work for those reaper guys? (6.)

April 1st is still some time away and frankly I'm a bit baffled.

Pipelineaudio · Post by **Pipelineaudio** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:06 am

Kingston wrote: possible causes:

1. ear wax problems

That would be a long one! SHould be making candles by now

2. severe tinnitus

This would show up at the mastering lab

3. recent audio interface upgrade with too little I/O for outboard usage.

For the last 5 years Ive had 4 RME HDSP9652's, 4 RME DIGI 9652's among many others

4. you're just kidding, right?

Nope

5. not your studio

Note left monitor. And this is my setup for home. Where I don't have to deal with people if I dont want to, so I dont keep much around but a mess.

I mean, WTF. ReaComp is just another plugin compressor among many others

No, in fact its QUITE different. From the ground up this comp had input from people who have to use these tools for a living. Much of REAPER stands out this way because it was built by audio engineers instead of marketing engineers. Take a GOOD look at reacomp. Note the full complement of controls and the philosophy behind them. Note from the start it was meant to take advantage of reaper's real world, better than a patchbacy routing

quite different indeed

and you're trying to convince people it fares well with 5k hardware.

Not visually for sure. Also, the VariMu can heat my room in the winter.

What's your angle here? do you work for those reaper guys? (6.)

Im just extremely appreciative after all these years, of coders who have their shit straight.

koolkeys · Post by **koolkeys** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:27 am

Just a personal note, but I doubt seriously that Reacomp is an adequate replacement for all your gear. Maybe it's all you need, but that doesn't mean that the plugin can match all of them. Just like the picture of you in the studio with the console sitting there doing 'nothing' and Reaper on your laptop doing 'everything'. I mean, do pictures really prove anything except for the fact that you really like and support Reaper? And now, ReaComp gets the same kind of treatment?

I don't understand the things being talked about in a deep enough manner to actually participate, hence my kidding around. But if I did, I sure wouldn't take the approach of either participant. Doesn't make anyone look good. And nobody has proven anything still to this point.

I know arrogance isn't your intention Pipeline, but your last couple posts sure haven't shown that. ReaComp is a great plug, no doubt. But going through all this to prove absolutely nothing is just humorous.

Brent

Pipelineaudio · Post by **Pipelineaudio** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:33 am

koolkeys wrote:Just a personal note, but I doubt seriously that Reacomp is an adequate replacement for all your gear. Maybe it's all you need, but that doesn't mean that the plugin can match all of them.

I didnt make that claim

koolkeys · Post by **koolkeys** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:39 am

If the plugs didnt work, that gear would be LIT UP instead and in use.

This and other statements show to the contrary. Like I said, ReaComp may be all you need. And it may be great. But it isn't a replacement for all the gear. Just as that picture that I mentioned in my last post. You used to post that all the time to show people that Reaper is capable of replacing everything in that studio. You pointed out the outboard gear just sitting there, and the console not being used.

Whether you meant it or not, you sure do make it seem like ReaComp and Reaper are the be-all and end-all in audio production, when they are not.

Brent