March Contest: Gossip

[duncanparsons]

duncanparsons: Nice work on the overall sound but that panning effect is making me dizzy! It sounds very programmed. No one back then could have panned like that. Interesting composition, but the keyboards are far too quantized. They sound sequenced. The snares are too bright, too high up in the mix and the cymbals are too widely dispersed in the sound field. Live drums didn't get that kind of stereo separation back then...so you're close but not quite "there."

The panning organ is a leslie.. a leslie mic'ed properly for stereo was fairly close to this - listen to 'Ann Of Cleaves' in Six Wives, and it's in there; also I seem to recall some sections of Close To The Edge have the organ leslie recorded in stereo..

I agree about the keyboards perhaps sounding rather quantised, but having said that, have you heard Eddie Jobson play? Listen to some of the stuff on UK and that's played live in the studio, equally Kerry Minear with Gentle Giant plays steady as a rock when he needs to as well - listen to the opening section of Freehand - the piano/organ part then the clavinet are astonishing, both in the studio and live... So whilst I agree, Retropolis is too far out

However, I do agree more about the cymbals; but there are still caveats - Gordon Giltrap did 3 albums from 1976-79 [Visionary, Perilous Journey and Fear of the Dark] of which Perilous Journey is probably te best example. Simon Phillips is playing, and they mic'ed the cymals very close and there is a very wide separation on the whole of the kit since the production team (Triumvirate) were able to position everything just wherever the heck it seemed best. Also if you give 'Gazeuse' from Gong, and 'Moroccan Roll' by BrandX a spin, Dennis Mackay produced both of those, and his mic'ing of kits allowed for very wide separation in the stereo field. BUT, if I were to remix my entry, I would back off with the drums abit

anyway, ta for listening!

DSP

[duncanparsons]

Oh, and anyone wanting to try my springline reverb models, the thread is here



DSP

[Legion Hush]

Legion Hush: Um . . . okay. 70s maybe. Prog? Nein.

My submission is a joke, i meant it as a joke and yes, i do realize it is not prog

I'm just going to be flat out blunt here, you have got to be a real moron to assume a musician participating in these Music Cafe contests does not understand the difference between Disco and Prog Rock.


.....or shall i say get a sense of humour??

[duncanparsons]

hmmm... having said that, Camel's 'Breathless' LP from 1978 has alot of Disco on it, but remains a prog album.. Rick Wakeman's Rhapsodies album has a disco version of 'Rhapsody in Blue', but is still definately prog...

Prog is about the acceptance of all types of music into a melee, and seeing what can be done with it all...

Still...

DSP

[adj]

...I knew there were more of us out there!

[Echo Voodoo]

Echo Voodoo: Okay, so I had to jump over to the actual submission page to see your justification for this one. Kraftwerk. Thought so, but had to make sure. I don't count them as prog at all. I know they were contemporary, and some people put them in prog (Krautrock being a subset of prog) but . . . I never considered them Krautrock either The vocal pads are really nice. They're about as close as this gets to Kraftwerk. Nice little song, but too crunchy even for Kraftwerk's sound. They tended to be very clean and precise. Amazing how much of their early work was minimoogs because not many people make minis sound like they did. Anyway . . . there you are!

I'm not overly familiar with prog rock, and the examples that I found before making my entry (Rush, Gentle Giant) were uniformly not my cup of tea. I made some attempts at the style, but I just couldn't get into it at all.

Since Kraftwerk is listed on a few sites as a prog rock band (1, 2, 3), I figured I'd give their style a try. I hadn't listened to them before either, which may explain my ineffectiveness at matching their style.

I know that nobody in this forum considers them prog rock (one of those sites I cited lists them as 'progressive electronica, for what that's worth), and I don't expect any votes for it either, but that's perfectly fine. I enjoyed making the track, which is all I was hoping for this month. The alternative was skipping it altogether, but I figured it would be more fun to see if I could get even fewer votes than L.Hush's disco entry.

Thanks for the comments, I always appreciate feedback.

[Patrick9]

Patrick9: shades of Sensations Fix in that guitar lead. Once again the snare's too bright and too high in the mix. Very interesting change up about 40 sec. Not sure about the one at 59 seconds. The keyboard lead kind of loses its steam there for a bit but when the guitar comes back in you start Rokken . . . he he. Not bad.

I had to look up Sensations Fix - Hmm, Italian proggers eh! I would like to hear that. Cheers.

[emdot_ambient]

offthewall: Ah, you've captured the lower-fi sound fairly well. Nice change-ups. Sounds like too much verb on the drums and the guitar playing is a bit . . . well, if you're playing that live, you're doing better than I could (which isn't really saying much for you) What was that at the end, an ocarina or pan flute or something? Nice addition. That put you up a few points.

Thanks for the comments, also.
Yes, all played live, I'm afraid....the arthritis is in the fingers now (poor old soul)....and it's a penny whistle at the end (live too)

Penny whistle, don't know why I didn't pick that up. Well, you're way ahead of me. I'd never be able to play any of that live.

[emdot_ambient]

Legion Hush: Um . . . okay. 70s maybe. Prog? Nein.

My submission is a joke, i meant it as a joke...

Oh, I understood that completely. But I had my review hat on and was simply stating my review criteria. Nothing wrong w/a joke. No harm done, no offense intended or taken by me.

Cheers!

[emdot_ambient]

hmmm... having said that, Camel's 'Breathless' LP from 1978 has alot of Disco on it...

Did it? Must be why I lost track of them with that album

[emdot_ambient]

duncanparsons: Nice work on the overall sound but that panning effect is making me dizzy! It sounds very programmed. No one back then could have panned like that. Interesting composition, but the keyboards are far too quantized. They sound sequenced. The snares are too bright, too high up in the mix and the cymbals are too widely dispersed in the sound field. Live drums didn't get that kind of stereo separation back then...so you're close but not quite "there."

The panning organ is a leslie

A real one or an emulation? I don't remember ever hearing one quite so drastic in its panning. Is it time sync'd to host? Maybe that's it.

I did all those reviews by headphone, so the stereo aspect of it was even further enhanced in them.

[emdot_ambient]

Which reminds me . . . here's another tip in getting a '70s sound:

Turn off sync to MIDI on any delay or other time-based FX and adjust them by ear. I don't know of any FX gear from the 70s that had accurate time settings. The '80s brought in digital equipment that could be adjusted precisely to the Nth millisecond. In the prog days, it was usually just a knob that you'd adjust by ear.

[Legion Hush]

hmmm... having said that, Camel's 'Breathless' LP from 1978 has alot of Disco on it, but remains a prog album.. Rick Wakeman's Rhapsodies album has a disco version of 'Rhapsody in Blue', but is still definately prog...

Yeah, it's called record companies telling their artists to go with the times and write disco-esque tunes to attract disco listeners and make some $$$$$$$ since disco at the time was *THE* shizznit.

[Jonny Quest]

Freewayjam - Jonny Quest:
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Great stuff. I love the drumming though the drum sound could have maybe been a bit more powerful, it seems to lack punch. The guitars are very nice. Brilliant!

Thanks Marc

[Jonny Quest]

Jonny Quest: Snare and HH way too loud and processed sounding. Where did that melody come from? That sounds like a Camel song . . . but none of the rest of it does. It's got a 70s flavor, but a bit too buzzy and hard edged. Interesting take on things, though.

Thanks for the review emdot. It's a Jeff Beck tune written by Max Middleton...in the hands of a working man

Peace,

Jonny