FR: Performance Snapshots of XY Pads + Morphing

[dln]

I mentioned this briefly in the Improvements thread, but I figured I'd flesh it out some more here and show a sketch to clarify a bit. It's really a pretty straight-forward idea, and shouldn't be too complex to do, but the usage possibilities for performance use are IMHO great.

I propose adding a number of slots on the performance page where current position of the XY "pucks" are stored.

All snapshots should be stored with the preset, effectively enabling "variations" of a patch in a simple and clear way.

Just like the OSC waves, you can rearrange, copy and interpolate between them.

As with OSC waveform editing, there should be no need to actively "save" a snapshot. Just select a slot and move the pucks.

The "Morph" knob should simply select different snapshots and interpolates between them, again just like the OSC waveforms. By binding this knob to a MIDI controller, we have effectively an incredibly expressive morphing feature like Discovery or the Ohmboyz synths - but in an even more flexible (but also simpler) way.

I think this would be pretty nifty for expressive playing.

Edit: I should add that the overall purpose is to add a one-dimensional parameter to control all eight dimensions presented by the four XY pads using. This makes for a very easy-to-control but extremely powerful performance feature for controlled articulation.

[pd]

Interesting idea. Let's take it a step further with a knob that scrolls through the XY presets which you can modulate (like with a graphic envelope). I don't know if the synth can handle quick morphing but even slower modulations would be interesting.

[dln]

Interesting idea. Let's take it a step further with a knob that scrolls through the XY presets which you can modulate (like with a graphic envelope).

The problem with allowing modulation of the morph/select knob would be that it can result in modulation feedback. e.g XY pad assigns to modulate an envelope, which in turn modulates morph, which causes the XY pad to move ... and so on until the universe implodes.

That's why I opted for a more straightforward request, since it doesn't introduce any new layers of complexity to the synth as it is.

[jupiter8]

Cool idea.I like it. Probably easily implemented (relativetly) and there's spare room on the GUI. Slick.

[beej]

Yes, this has been requested a few times, including by me...

[dln]

Yes, this has been requested a few times, including by me...

Hey, that makes a posse! Let me grab my coat, pitchfork and torch and we'll head over to U-He secret headquarters and do some proper rioting for this good cause.

[bmrzycki]

+1

I'd actually prefer 4 x 16 presets and 4 morph knobs. One for each XY. For example in transmission the first XY is always "Filter" and the second is almost always "Wavemod". It'd be neat to keep the last 3 XY's static while modding the first XY for filter changes.

Maybe even a 5th global mod knob that steps through all 4 at the same time. If Urs allows us to midimap the same CC to 4 knobs, it wouldn't be necessary though

I can wish right?

[pd]

Interesting idea. Let's take it a step further with a knob that scrolls through the XY presets which you can modulate (like with a graphic envelope).

The problem with allowing modulation of the morph/select knob would be that it can result in modulation feedback. e.g XY pad assigns to modulate an envelope, which in turn modulates morph, which causes the XY pad to move ... and so on until the universe implodes.

That's why I opted for a more straightforward request, since it doesn't introduce any new layers of complexity to the synth as it is.

Let the imploding begin!!
You could eliminate the feedback problem by creating an additional special-purpose MSEG for the knob. Maybe not practical but not impossible. A bigger problem may be deciding what triggers it on a polyphonic patch -- it shouldn't be per voice.
Actually, I should be able to do this from FLStudio and it's controllers. I need to find time to play.

[Urs]

"Dude!" (as Hurley would put it)

Please calm down a bit... more important than morphable snapshots is finding easier ways to firstly create snapshot settings.

Then... once there's indication that people actually use the XYs, I'd vote for a simple/viable way to store and retrieve snapshots.

I would not go with a "snapshot series" to dial through. I would go with snapshot retrieval buttons and an adjustable transition time. These buttons could be mapped to i.e. MPG-style drum pads, or a range of keys on the keyboard (much like OhmForce stuff)...

The major questions would be, how many buttons, buttons for each or for all XYs etc...

What do you think?

Cheers,

Urs

[dln]

Please calm down a bit... more important than morphable snapshots is finding easier ways to firstly create snapshot settings.

Hey now, there's no off-position on the genius switch.
(For heaven's sake don't) stop making such inspirational software!

Then... once there's indication that people actually use the XYs, I'd vote for a simple/viable way to store and retrieve snapshots.

My thought was sort of along the lines that if people see the usefulness of the pads for performance use and patch making, they will use them. And big "wow"s will be heard throughout zebraspace.

I would not go with a "snapshot series" to dial through. I would go with snapshot retrieval buttons and an adjustable transition time. These buttons could be mapped to i.e. MPG-style drum pads, or a range of keys on the keyboard (much like OhmForce stuff)...

What do you think?

Hmm, that would work too, but not having a midi-learnable dial will remove the main performance aspect of being able to easily control a multitude of parameters with a single controller (as for example the modwheel in Discovery). The implementation is obviously the same as for doing the transitions between buttons, so I don't see the value in not including such a (fundamentally) useful performance feature.

Hmm.. A thought: A better alternative might be to allow chosing two snapshots to transition between. E.g, the "morph" knob transitions between selected snapshots A and B. This would be even less complex to use, I suppose.

What do you think of that concept?

The major questions would be, how many buttons, buttons for each or for all XYs etc...

I firmly stand by that it's too complicated to have individual snapshots for each pad. Storing all 8 dimensions (all pads as one snapshot) means patch makers have a meaningful way to distribute multiple variations of a single patch with a real, non-trivial and most of all - intentional, difference. If there are different snapshots for different pads, this will not be the case. And any XY coordinate for a pad is already just a single mouseclick away at a given time.

But in any case, for now I shall calm down and go to bed.

[pdxindy]

button for all XY's at once... too complicated to have per XY yes?

[Urs]

button for all XY's at once... too complicated to have per XY yes?

I think so, too.

[jupiter8]

I would not go with a "snapshot series" to dial through. I would go with snapshot retrieval buttons and an adjustable transition time. These buttons could be mapped to i.e. MPG-style drum pads, or a range of keys on the keyboard (much like OhmForce stuff)...

Or to make this feature truly Ursworthy you could actually do both. The GRM plugins had a slider which morphed thru 16 presets but you could also click directly on them and it would morph (with a useradjustable transition time) directly to that preset.

This just dawned on me for some reason,don't ask me why. Must be a genious or something.