Targeting different layers in one sequence?

[robenestobenz]

As I'd independently written something out step by step I'll post it anyway. This is if DSK layers by channel and not note range though:

- If there isn't one free above it, drag the DSK music plugin down a rack slot.

- Click the slot above that, select Effects>Mutools>Devices>Mux

- Open up the MUX

- Hit Tab to open up the modular workspace

- Right click on the workspace and select "Add module..." from the menu.

- Add your MIDI channeliser plugin ("Browse for plugin..." menu option, if you haven't got it in Mulab's plugin library already)

- Configure the midi channel to force to in the channeliser and then connect the event input to the input of the channeliser, and then wire up the channeliser output to the event output module.

And you're done! Now every note that comes through should be passed through as is, as well as copied onto a different channel. It looks like a lot of steps, but it's actually very quick to do.

There's a bunch of MIDI channelisers on the excellent page liquid linked to.

[pljones]

Using a VST module with multiple layers, I would like to program (not record!) two different layers in one sequence, targeting a single module.

What do you mean by "a VST module with multiple layers"?

At http://rekkerd.org/dsk-releases-strings/ you can read about
the feature "2 Layers", which means two different instruments can be selected and separately configured (ADSR, Flanger etc.). Automation is also possible separately for each layer, because I can see different parameters for both layers in the event editor.

"2 layers" can mean that when an instrument receives a MIDI Note On, it plays two sounds. When you have a MIDI keyboard and "layer" sounds, it means you press one note and two or more sounds are triggered. The documentation isn't very good, so I can't really tell with this. I would guess that's the intent: one note triggers two sounds. You set the two sounds up as you like -- maybe a violin with a fast attack and a cello with a slow attack.

[liquidsound]

DSK can not use multi-MIDI in.
All the solution with Midi are unfortunately useless....

The best solution is to run 2 instances of DSK for your purpose.
With a Note filter you are stuck with the same interval for every note...

I don't think this is what you want.
See my previous post. I think that's the only solution, unless Jo makes it possible to program every note to have its own target...
I doubt it very much

[janamdo]

It seems that there is no separated Midi out for the two sounds of this vsti
I installed it and there is no midi out selection possible
It is one audio out with two sounds layered and it looks like a keyboard feature were you can play also with two sounds together for the melody

Nice sound combinations are possible

For a while ago i was investigating my VSTI multi( fruity loops and emu : proteus x2 and succeed in making a mux for this )

The mulab tutorial for a vsti multi ( drums ) is limited , because it is not the same as a vst multi with 16 midichannels or less.
It seems that that at least one of the free DSK vsti( see website) work with 4 midichannels, so..
Stupid connecting things it ..it is better to deal with the actual music

[pljones]

unless Jo makes it possible to program every note to have its own target...

Target != Channel, remember. One target player may respond on up to 16 channels. Muzys supported Channel as part of the event, as well as target player. And, similarly to Part Target vs Track Target, you could override the Channel if you wanted. After some debate, it was decided that MU.LAB didn't need this much flexibility, as you'd just write a separate part with the same target player but a different Part Channel.

[Reincke]

Thank you all for theese hints. I've learned at least two things due to my problem:
1. I have to load two instances of "DSK Strings" (e.g. into two different racks).
2. I have to create two separate sequences targeting the VSTs, in separate tracks (avoiding overlapping parts).

And generally: Inside a sequence, the midi channel cannot be switched between notes, e.g. by an event, right?

[MuTools]

the midi channel cannot be switched between notes, e.g. by an event, right?

Yes, that's correct.

[MuTools]

Here you'll find a collection of plugins by ndcMIDI Pack...
Open a MUX and connect to the "Event input" 1 "DSK" and 1 "MIDI Note Trans" plugin...

Note that MU.LAB also has an integrated Note Modifier module that can do a transpose.

[MuTools]

Reincke, about your question:

You can't do it within one sequence, unless you can make separate keyzones, as suggested. Otherwise you'll have to use two different sequence parts.

In the latter case:

If DSK Strings is multitimbral, then you can do it with 1 DSKS instance using 2 midi channels. Each track/part is targetting that single DSKS instance but on a different midi channel.

If DSK Strings is not multitimbral, then you need 2 DSKS instances. Each track/part is targetting another DSKS instance.

I'm just trying to summarize things. Hope this helps.

[liquidsound]

After some debate, it was decided that MU.LAB didn't need this much flexibility

Note that MU.LAB also has an integrated Note Modifier module that can do a transpose.

Never used and look for it... busy playing and connecting cables.

[pljones]

After some debate, it was decided that MU.LAB didn't need this much flexibility

When writing for a three manual organ, the part you play with your feet is... a Part, with a channel for that part, etc. It's pretty rare that you need to specify the channel for every event in a sequence discretely. You can have any number of parts targeting the same player, so it's not limiting. The only time I've seen a good argument for it is with scenarios like lighting control. But even here, you can still do everything if you think "event -> part -> channel -> player" rather than "event -> channel -> player". (I tried hard to convince Jo to keep channel with event as I'm a MIDI die hard . But it really isn't much of a problem.)

[liquidsound]

For me Target and Parts are sufficient. Imagine for every time you want to change your "Single" notes you need to deal with Midi for each one.
Unless you drag, re size etc....

I hate when there is one exception and the whole thing pays for it.
It happens to me when I write databases and for just one particular instance, the whole structure HAS to bend.

BTW I can see you and Midi....

[janamdo]

If DSK Strings is not multitimbral, then you need 2 DSKS instances. Each track/part is targetting another DSKS instance.

I'm just trying to summarize things. Hope this helps.

DSK is not multitimbrale and has only one audio outputchannel and produce a 2 layered sound output
So it make no sense ( i think ) to use two 2 DSKS instances

It is one audiochannel with two sounds mixed and multitimbrale without assignable midichannels ( what is the definition of multitimbrale..a minor question here )

Some of the DSK are multitimbrale with assignable midi channels as i read it

[pljones]

DSK is not multitimbrale and has only one audio outputchannel and produce a 2 layered sound output
So it make no sense ( i think ) to use two 2 DSKS instances

Of course it makes sense. It's the only way to have complete separation between "two sounds" - one sound from each instance, where that sound is the two sources mixed together within the instance. The number of audio outputs is of no relevance as the two instances would not share an audio output. With two instances, you can have a part targeting each, so they play different notes. With one instance, you can't do this. In fact, you don't have to stop at two. (Limitations within the various versions of MU.LAB permitting.)

[Reincke]

I'm just trying to summarize things. Hope this helps.

Yes, that was exactly what I was asking for, although I don't like the answer ...
Again - thanks to all of you.

DSK is not multitimbrale and has only one audio outputchannel and produce a 2 layered sound output
...
It is one audiochannel with two sounds mixed and multitimbrale without assignable midichannels ( what is the definition of multitimbrale..a minor question here )

How can I analyze a VST for a multitimbral feature ("layers" in terms of DSK)?

So it make no sense ( i think ) to use two 2 DSKS instances

In my case it certainly does, because I need two different instruments of that VST - regrettably in separate Sequences

Some of the DSK are multitimbrale with assignable midi channels as i read it

Interesting! Haven't found that on DSK site or elsewhere. Do you have any sources?