Zen Plus??

[nielsdolieslager]

Lol, I don't have any plugins that use that format I think. Is there a way Zen could create files with the same names that when openened by Zen, tell the plugin to load the preset it refers to?

What I meant previously would be something like that. I understand that Zen can't tell if a ksd must be opened by GR4, Absynth5, FM8, Massive or Kore. But if Zen knows which plugin they belong to, it could make its own files for the presets.

It takes a lot of work to import presets that are not in koresound format; open a plugin, save a preset to a koresound, open the next preset, save it to a koresound. It's the most annoying thing about Kore.

[Big Tick]

It's worse than that - even if Zen knew that SuperPiano.ksd is to be opened with FM8, it would not know how to send the preset to the plugin. What Zen (or any other non-NI host, for that matter) needs is SuperPiano.fxp, and as far as I know there is no way to convert a ksd to fxp.

Having said that, importing presets in Zen is usually easy. You can either:
- drop a bunch of fxp into Zen (you can convert all the plugin presets to fxp using MiniHost).
- or use Zen autoimport, where you just need to go through all the presets in the plugin, and they are automatically imported.

Both options, although a little tedious, don't sound nowhere near annoying as the one you describe with Kore.

Also, FM8 and Absynth are managed in Zen, and have a lot of presets in the online database already.

[Big Tick]

It might be worth asking NI if they'd let you in on .ksd via some sort of license ?

Can't hurt to ask, but I can't think of any reason why they would let me.

[nielsdolieslager]

It's worse than that - even if Zen knew that SuperPiano.ksd is to be opened with FM8, it would not know how to send the preset to the plugin. What Zen (or any other non-NI host, for that matter) needs is SuperPiano.fxp, and as far as I know there is no way to convert a ksd to fxp.

Having said that, importing presets in Zen is usually easy. You can either:
- drop a bunch of fxp into Zen (you can convert all the plugin presets to fxp using MiniHost).
- or use Zen autoimport, where you just need to go through all the presets in the plugin, and they are automatically imported.

Both options, although a little tedious, don't sound nowhere near annoying as the one you describe with Kore.

Also, FM8 and Absynth are managed in Zen, and have a lot of presets in the online database already.

Oi. Could NI have used fxp for all presets instead of ksds?

I need to look more into Zen. I only use it next to Kore for the Crystal sounds. Need to find out how to use minihost and autoimport. They do sound good. But I can't even use Absynth, FM8 and Massive in Zen. It will load the synth and it will load the preset but midi doesn't go through... oh well, not the place for this.

[plopseaw]

Big Tick,

Thanks, looks interesting. NI should give the community the KSD format the the API for the controller so that every ones invest can be unlocked someday. I don't think they will be we can ask for it.

[fb_]

Big Tick,

Thanks, looks interesting. NI should give the community the KSD format the the API for the controller so that every ones invest can be unlocked someday. I don't think they will be we can ask for it.

I'll second this notion. Maybe if a developer asked to license the KSD format and controller API there would be more of a chance than just us users asking.

[mckenic]

Watching with great interest - need to make the 10.6 jump...

[Big Tick]

NI should give the community the KSD format the the API for the controller so that every ones invest can be unlocked someday. I don't think they will be we can ask for it.

I just sent an official request to NI for this.

[Big Tick]

...assumptions about how Kore as an application (or even a sound format like KSD) could presumably simply be "stripped down", or converted, or open-sourced in whole or in parts, or licensed to somebody else to work with, are not realistic. It could probably be done with a simple tool like a MP3 tagging app or an FTP client, but not with an application of the scope, diversity and complexity of Kore, because this is basically the heavy-weight class of software development.

I guess this says it all.

[nielsdolieslager]

I guess this says it all.

Isn't it up to "somebody else" to decide it's not realistic ? xD

[Big Tick]

Well... the upcoming Zen version is fully open (non-commercial presets are now stored as fxp, and the metadata is freely accessible through the sqlite database, whose schema is easily readable). So, fast-forwarding a few months, add 64 bits, fx support and meta-presets (combinations / chains of presets)... and I think Zen will be a viable alternative.

[nielsdolieslager]

Yes, sounds so

I'm just angry at NI. They made that library in an impossible format so that library is no use, must be done all over again, unless they offer a tool for that. Or are you saying there is a way to read all the tags and ratings?

[Big Tick]

No - there isn't any. That's what I understand from NI's statement.

What I'm saying is that Zen, by design, won't get you in the same situation because the preset data, tags and ratings are not hidden inside a proprietary format.

[woodster]

I suppose you're right Big Tick.
I just thought it worth a mention, but thinking about it, why would they even bother spending more time by opening it up to others(even via a license)?.

Seeing as it's approaching being a dead format and the end user would only need a one time conversion, maybe NI wouldn't see the license generating enough.

Is the main issue that once converted, the previously protected sounds tied to the .KSD format will then be free to use in the new Zen format that NI has no Kontrol over.

But then again on the other side of the coin, at least NI could generate additional funds via a license for sounds that they no longer peddle ?

I dunno, I'm just chundering on, and blatantly I'm not in business.

[nielsdolieslager]

I get it now, thank you Big Tick