Muse Research

dsamwell · Post by **dsamwell** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 10:06 pm

Hi,

First post, although I have lurked on this forum for some time. I have a VERY urgent problem I need to fix.

I am the FoH engineer for a well known indie band in the UK and we use the receptor for all of our keyboard sounds.

We have two receptor 2s, a A system and a B system.

Our B systems hard drive has failed. I know it to be the hard drive, as when I switch the unit on, it doesn't get past the "initializing" stage, and when I put the hard drive in from our A machine it works fine.

Now we are currently on essentially a world tour and are doing tones of european festivals, including V this weekend...

As a result I need to clone my A machines drive onto a new drive so I can get the B system up and running again. I have 48 hours to do this before our next show so I am in dire straits here!

I have tried cloning the drive with a piece of software called Macrium Reflect, which sees the receptor drive as having 3 partitions, all of which I have made an image of and put onto a brand new hard drive. This however did not work! In the receptor again it didn't get past the initializing stage.

I am a pretty clued up windows and os x user, but know next to nothing about linux, which seems to be the only way to get the drive cloned from my internet research.

Is there anyone on this forum who can talk me through cloning the A machine's drive in the next 48 hours??

I hope you appreciate this is incredibly urgent. We simply cannot do the shows we have coming up without a working backup in place.

I am in Liverpool for the next 2 days trying to do this. If someone can either talk me through doing it step by step on the phone, or even travel to Liverpool to help me do this, we will not only be eternally grateful and offer you whatever we can to say thanks (guestlist to various shows or whatever), but also pay you well for your time.

Please post any advice on how to do this, but really I would like to be able to speak to someone on the phone or in person. I could even come to you if its not too far from Liverpool. Please message me or email me. My address is my username @gmail.com

Thanks in advance!

David Samwell

gary@museresearch · Post by **gary@museresearch** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 10:52 pm

Hey David,

This sounds like something we can troubleshoot over the help desk at plugorama.com (These are free) First thing you will want to do is plug in a monitor directly to the back of the Receptor. On the ticket that you post please let me know what comes up on the screen when it is booting up.

If you dont want to trouble shoot and just want to clone.... You should ONLY use a hardware cloner. This is a true bit by bit copy. We use this brand in house:
https://www.kanguru.com/index.php/dupli ... uplicators

Thanks,
Gary
Muse QA and Support

dsamwell · Post by **dsamwell** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:09 pm

Thanks for your reply Gary,

I am 100% sure it is a hard drive failure, so Im not sure I would gain anything by going through the troubleshooting procedure? I am happy to do it though if you think I could gain anything or potentially fix the drive by doing it?

Thanks for the suggestion of the cloning device. Im sure this is a long shot, but you don't know who I might be able to get that kanguru unit in the UK from do you?

I have done a quick search for them in general, and there seem to be a lot of options out there, varying in price greatly. If I were to buy one from another manufacturer is there anything to look out for that would make cloning the receptor drive not work? My understanding is it is just a dumb bit for bit copy, so Im guessing they any unit would do the job?

johnrule · Post by **johnrule** » Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:49 pm

dsamwell wrote:I am a pretty clued up windows and os x user, but know next to nothing about linux, which seems to be the only way to get the drive cloned from my internet research.

Is there anyone on this forum who can talk me through cloning the A machine's drive in the next 48 hours??

- image the Receptor drive as a "whole" (not each partition)
- re-image to another drive

That's about it...

dsamwell · Post by **dsamwell** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 12:14 am

Hmm well I've kind of given up on the software cloning idea, the hardware duplicators look much better and easier. Also to do it with software means mounting both drives through USB docks with is painfully slow. Took about 9 hours to clone the drive on my failed attempt.... It's obviously the more expensive option, but money isn't an issue at the moment, I just HAVE to get this working!

Unfortunately the kanguru duplicator seems near impossible to find in the UK, but I've found this:

http://www.startech.com/HDD/Duplicators ... UNIDUPDOCK

Which looks good to me. Can you advise Gary? It has an option to copy the HPA on the drive as well, which I think may be why my simple clone of each partition didn't work i.e. the HPA wasn't copied across.

Hope this works. There is a shop with one in stock in Liverpool, and if it works, it'll be fast easy, and a great addition to my toolbox!

johnrule · Post by **johnrule** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 12:26 am

dsamwell wrote:Also to do it with software means mounting both drives through USB docks with is painfully slow. Took about 9 hours to clone the drive on my failed attempt....

You have to take the drive out of the Receptor and install it in a desktop PC...takes about 20 minutes to clone, and then a bit faster to re-image (from what I remember). Who told you to do it this way (i.e. USB)?

johnrule · Post by **johnrule** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 12:29 am

I hope other Receptor owners are at least reading this thread...do you have a back up image of your Receptor drive if something happens? Do you know what to do?

dsamwell · Post by **dsamwell** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 12:47 am

johnrule wrote:
dsamwell wrote:Also to do it with software means mounting both drives through USB docks with is painfully slow. Took about 9 hours to clone the drive on my failed attempt....
You have to take the drive out of the Receptor and install it in a desktop PC...takes about 20 minutes to clone, and then a bit faster to re-image (from what I remember). Who told you to do it this way (i.e. USB)?

No one told me to do anything! I am away on tour and was improvising with what I had i.e. no desktop computer, but some sata docks.

Anyway, method aside, I created an image of each of the 3 partitions, put them on a brand new drive and no joy! For me the convenience and speed of the hardware solution is perfect. Also I have several other hard drives on our show doing various things (playback, and backups of things) so having a quick hardware copier would be a great addition to my toolbox on tour. Us roadies are always looking for the quickest, easiest most elegant solution, and hardware duplicator sounds like the one to me!

And good point about backups of your drives. I have backups of all of our plugin settings (singles, and multis) and all our install discs are on tour with us at all times.

In our main unit, I've actually modded it so that it has a extended SATA cables hanging out of it, and the hard drive is carried separately and plugged in each day so it doesnt get bashed about in transit. Its the backup unit which has gone. I carry this everywhere (gets put in the bus, not on the trailer, and I carry it as hand luggage in a soft case on all the flights we do) and it STILL has got broken with this level of paranoia!

Once I get this sorted, my next project will be to clone onto SSDs and keep the current drives for backups. But that's a thread for another day.....

johnrule · Post by **johnrule** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 1:04 am

dsamwell wrote:No one told me to do anything! I am away on tour and was improvising with what I had i.e. no desktop computer, but some sata docks

Sorry...I didn't mean to sound like I was criticizing you. Of course you were doing what you could.

dsamwell wrote:In our main unit, I've actually modded it so that it has a extended SATA cables hanging out of it

If you mean another Receptor, be careful you are not over-taxing the power supply.

dsamwell wrote:Once I get this sorted, my next project will be to clone onto SSDs and keep the current drives for backups. But that's a thread for another day.....

Yes, I am waiting for the price to come down so I can do this as well. If anything, others will learn that they need to do this right away on any drive available, so maybe it will serve a purpose for the good.

In terms of the length of time, it will vary...a large hard drive with lots of data will take a long time.

dsamwell · Post by **dsamwell** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 1:09 am

johnrule wrote:
dsamwell wrote:No one told me to do anything! I am away on tour and was improvising with what I had i.e. no desktop computer, but some sata docks
Sorry...I didn't mean to sound like I was criticizing you. Of course you were doing what you could.

No problem! I was just improvising, not ideal but you gota try anything in these situations!

dsamwell wrote:In our main unit, I've actually modded it so that it has a extended SATA cables hanging out of it
If you mean another Receptor, be careful you are not over-taxing the power supply.

Yes another receptor, we have 2, and A system and a B system. Im not sure what you mean about the power supply, it's just a longer cable for the data and power connectors for the drive, won't effect power consumption at all! It just means the hard drive lives outside of the receptor so it can be taken care of, not bashed around by local crew when loading in and out every day, and more-so idiot baggage handlers when flying! Its a simple mod, and makes hard drive failures much less likely.

johnrule · Post by **johnrule** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 1:13 am

I've decided to release the SATA upgrade notes for my Receptor, and to include a link in this thread if it will be of any service to anyone:

Receptor SATA Upgrade notes

johnrule · Post by **johnrule** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 1:17 am

dsamwell wrote:Im not sure what you mean about the power supply, it's just a longer cable for the data and power connectors for the drive, won't effect power consumption at all!

I thought you meant a second hard drive...

skitchy · Post by **skitchy** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 1:38 am

Assuming the disks are a named brand, the manufacturer (Seagate, Western Digital, Maxtor) provide free programs for cloning hard disks when you upgrade to a newer model - I cant vouch for them personally but I'd try them first.
Secondly, I'd try something like Clonezilla.
Thrirdly, I'd spend money on something like Norton Ghost (or whatever the 'Toms Hardware' crowd are recommending).

And as has been said, you'll need a PC to install the drives into for the cloning - dont mess about with USB in this sort of situation.

I'm sure you know this already, but you'll need a PC with a working Windows install to run the clone program. The working receptor drive and the new blank should be installed in the PC as if they are extra 'data' drives ie. if Windows is on C: then the working Receptor drive should be D: and the blank target drive should be E: . The actual lettering will obviously change depending on the partitions.

dsamwell · Post by **dsamwell** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 11:35 am

Success!

I have managed to clone the main units drive on a new hard drive. I used one of these

http://www.computerplus.uk.com/pgProduc ... Duplicator

and a 500gb seagate baracuda drive for the new one.

With that sandberg duplicator it is a stand alone piece of hardware, and cloning a drive just took 2 button presses. Incredibly simple and took about an hour.

Thanks everyone for the input, the hardware cloner was the best option for me. Quick, easy, and cheap.

johnrule · Post by **johnrule** » Tue Aug 16, 2011 2:14 pm

dsamwell wrote:With that sandberg duplicator it is a stand alone piece of hardware, and cloning a drive just took 2 button presses. Incredibly simple and took about an hour.

That Sandberg Duplicator looks pretty good actually...

Thanks for posting your results!

Muse Research

KVR Audio

URGENT - receptor hard drive broken, cloning my working receptors drive