Zebra2 and filter/amplitude envelopes order

[mabian]

Hello,

I am trying to learn Zebra2 as much deeply as I can because I want to try making my own sounds with it.

I noticed something in the default signal flow that differentiates it from most other synths I am using:

in the default initialize patch, by adding a VCF module after OSC1, the VCF comes actually before amplitude envelope (which is, if I understand well, defined at the bottom of lane 1, tied to env1).

As far as most (if not all) other plugins I have seen, amplitude envelope usually comes before filter envelope. I know I can easily make the amplitude envelope come first, for example by modulating oscillator volume with envX in OSC1, so I'm not asking for the way to achieve this.

I can envision that the most differences in this different order can be heard when some kind of distortion is involved in the filter, but I was just was wondering why this choice, and if there are many other synths around, both virtual and physical, that have VCF before amplitude envelope in their default signal flow.

Thanks,
Mario

[bmrzycki]

Hi Mario,
From my experience in most classic subtracive synths the setup is:
[OSC1] + [OSC2] + [Noise] -> [Mixer] -> [Filter] -> [Amp]

In all those cases the amp envelope comes after the filter. This setup is also per-voice, meaning if you hit 3 notes (C-E-G) then 3 instances of this structure are created and are independent of each other.

I do know of synths that have FX filters, Zebra is one of them (VCF5, VCF6 in the FX section below) where the filter is global over all voices played and is the format you're speaking of. Another is Reason's Thor, Filter 3 (and many other synths).

Can you give an example of a synth where you found the per-voice structure has the Amp envelope applied to the pre filter stage by default?

[mabian]

Hello bmrzycki,

many thanks for you reply.

Big - huge - d'oh from me, you're totally right, I rechecked the signal flow on many synths I'm using and I also found this thread.

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=263700

I was probably misled by the fact that many synth interfaces have the amplitude before the filter envelope, but this doesn't reflect the real signal flow.

Sorry for the noise and thanks again for your clarification.

- Mario

[bmrzycki]

I was probably misled by the fact that many synth interfaces have the amplitude before the filter envelope, but this doesn't reflect the real signal flow.

Glad everything worked out. As far as amp env controls before filter env, yes I agree a lot of synths put that "closer" to the oscillators. My guess (and it's purely a guess) is because people tend to adjust it before touching filter envelope settings. And you're correct, that layout doesn't reflect what's really happening.

Which is one of the biggest reasons I love Zebra! The signal flow is drawn out for you and you know exactly the order of things. It's spoiled me to be able to glance at the center panel to see what's interacting with what. Other synths you have to pull out the manual and figure out the routing which often pulls me out of sound experimental mode.