Hanging notes with loopbackdriver in composers

[janamdo]

When i connect the composingprogram with Mulab and stop the composer..Mulabs still keep on playing
I must use panic in MUlab to stop the sound
The same occurs in a another composingprogram so it is not a coincidence
How to stop the ongoing sound in MUlab after quitting the composer(s)?

[pljones]

Every "note" in MIDI comprises two MIDI events: a "Note On" that specifies when the note starts playing, it's channel, pitch and velocity; and a "Note Off" that specifies when the note stops playing. Any MIDI sound generator is required to play until either (a) the sound triggered by a Note On expires naturally or (b) the effect of a Note Off causes it to stop playing.

If the sound triggered by a Note On has no reason to stop playing and you never send a Note Off, the sound will continue playing.

You need to see if you can configure your composer programs to tidy up when you stop play back in them. It's considered "good manners" to be able to send Note Off for any currently playing notes - rather than hit Panic in the sound source (or, as you have done, exit).

[janamdo]

As i understand it has nothing to do with MUlab..so i must try the composer te be calm

[pljones]

I've used some programs that simply won't do this and it is very annoying. You have to edit what you're working on to put in spaces where you can pause playback without hanging notes.

[AndreasD]

Can you try the following:

In the Mulab/user/settings folder edit the Mulab.Txt.
Add (or edit if it's there) the line:
FilterIncomingAllNotesOffEvents=0

This sets Mulab to react to an All Notes Off midi message that the composer might send on Stop.
I don't know what is the default.
So, it might not work!

[MuTools]

Very good suggestion Andreas, forgot about that myself.
Indeed the default for FilterIncomingAllNotesOffEvents is ON, cfr http://www.mutools.com/mulab/docs/preferences.html
Chance is high that changing this will make the difference.

[pljones]

Ah... Why is the default to ignore an All Notes Off? If I hit panic on an external keyboard controlling MULAB, I'm going to expect it to shut up. Having that happen for the first time during a gig might be a little embarrassing... I think the default should be to respect all incoming MIDI messages.

[MuTools]

Because i don't want to record any All Notes Off as that is complicating composition.

Another reason: Imagine you're sequencing a sound and you want to play live on top of the sequence, then the incoming All Notes Off would shut up all notes, also the sequenced ones, which is not intended.

All Notes Off is a kind of MIDI panic function. I don't think it's a good way for a sequencer to send an All Notes Off on stop. A sequencer should make sure it sends discrete note offs for any pending note ons. Well, that's how i see it.

[pljones]

I would say any MIDI CC 120 to 127 would be eligible for special treatment (right now I can't find a good reference to support that). I agree you wouldn't generally record them if received. That should be separate decision from whether to act on them, though.

The All Notes Off CC, as it is a CC, is channel specific. If you're playing over an audio loop, you'll likely either not have triggered it from MIDI (so it should not have a MIDI channel associated) or could have triggered it on a different channel from the one you're playing on. "Panic" usually has two levels: current channel or all; all sends out 16 messages. Of course, in the latter case, you should stop anything triggered by MIDI. Again, live, if I hit panic, it's better for everything to stop than to have some things to carry on.

[MuTools]

If you're playing over an audio loop, you'll likely either not have triggered it from MIDI (so it should not have a MIDI channel associated) or could have triggered it on a different channel from the one you're playing on.

I mean when you're sequencing a piano sound, and at the same time you're playing that same piano sound on top of the sequence.

"Panic" usually has two levels: current channel or all; all sends out 16 messages. Of course, in the latter case, you should stop anything triggered by MIDI. Again, live, if I hit panic, it's better for everything to stop than to have some things to carry on.

I agree that an All Notes Off is a kind of panic that should turn off all pending notes. But unfortunately there are quite some keyboards and sequencers that send All Notes Off whenever the last note is released. That's a pita imho.

Anyway it's good that you have the choice <-> it's a preference.

[pljones]

If you're playing over an audio loop, you'll likely either not have triggered it from MIDI (so it should not have a MIDI channel associated) or could have triggered it on a different channel from the one you're playing on.

I mean when you're sequencing a piano sound, and at the same time you're playing that same piano sound on top of the sequence.

Both triggering the same sound source on the same MIDI channel? Then All Notes Off must apply to all notes sounding on that sound source at the time it arrives on that channel. It's up to whatever is panicking to also tell the sequencer to stop. (Are the System Common / System Realtime messages for MIDI Stop etc implemented or still wishlist, I forget?)

"Panic" usually has two levels: current channel or all; all sends out 16 messages. Of course, in the latter case, you should stop anything triggered by MIDI. Again, live, if I hit panic, it's better for everything to stop than to have some things to carry on.

Which panic you mean? I mean from which app/device?

Received from outside MULAB via MIDI CC message. If I know I'm only triggering a single channel, I'd only want to send All Notes Off on that channel. Say I had a split keyboard set up, though, with three channels in use: I'd want hitting panic to kill everything. (In general, I've only seen "single channel" and "all channel": the ideal clearly is "those channels I've triggered"...)

Essence is: I agree that a All Notes Off is a kind of panic that should turn off all pending notes. But unfortunately there are quite some keyboards and sequencers that send All Notes Off whenever the last note is released. That's a pita imho.

Ah yes - I'd forgotten about that one. Now that is a good point. The "just in case" All Notes Off - I completely agree: pita. As such, personally, I think it's a "fault" in the sender and would expect it to be honoured by the receiver.

Anyway it's good that you have the choice <-> it's a preference.

Indeed but I still feel the default should be the to honour the request.

[MuTools]

Are the System Common / System Realtime messages for MIDI Stop etc implemented or still wishlist, I forget?

MuLab can send MIDI clock events. Right-click the tempo field to set things up.

[janamdo]

Thanks Andreas for this !