I am in the middle of emulating a 303 with zebra, trying to stick as much to the original specs as possible with just a couple of additions if it creates a more authentic sound. I am having some success with it and will post up the results when I am done of course.
Thing is I want to map the main performance controls to XY pads, specifically as I want designate upper and lower limits where zebras capabilities outmatch the original 303, to make it easy to go wild on it and not lose the 303 sound. This is fine with cut off, res, decay and even overdive for the non purists, but I can't find a way of assigning env mod depth.
Does anyone have a workaround for this or can anyone point out the obvious thing I am missing as it would be nice to have all the controls in one place to perform.
Many thanks IAYF
Assign env mod depth to XY pad ? or workaround ?
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- KVRist
- 208 posts since 8 Aug, 2010 from London, UK
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- Banned
- 6129 posts since 9 Oct, 2007 from an inharmonious society
There is no envelope mod depth in the XY assignments.
There is frequency mod depth for the xmf filter.
All the assignments are in the dropdown menus.
If your trying to assign an envelope parameter, then you can just choose them from the menu. There is no env mod depth there though.
Just in case you want to hear a Zebra 303 emulation.
I did one in my free4u set here...
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 34&start=0
It's called LOL that has all xy's assigned, and I think it sounds spot on imo.
Maybe moving the xy3 filter up for more resonance helps.
Can't wait to see what you come up with.
Good luck.
edit: Okay, I get what your saying, but how you get it is to have something assigned to a filters knob. The first one with then be selected as "Mod Depth1" or Mod Depth2 within the xy drop down menu, if you use both modulation targets in the filter.
There is frequency mod depth for the xmf filter.
All the assignments are in the dropdown menus.
If your trying to assign an envelope parameter, then you can just choose them from the menu. There is no env mod depth there though.
Just in case you want to hear a Zebra 303 emulation.
I did one in my free4u set here...
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 34&start=0
It's called LOL that has all xy's assigned, and I think it sounds spot on imo.
Maybe moving the xy3 filter up for more resonance helps.
Can't wait to see what you come up with.
Good luck.
edit: Okay, I get what your saying, but how you get it is to have something assigned to a filters knob. The first one with then be selected as "Mod Depth1" or Mod Depth2 within the xy drop down menu, if you use both modulation targets in the filter.
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 208 posts since 8 Aug, 2010 from London, UK
aha... I tried right clicking the mod depth button from the synth page to assign to XY which you can't do... didn't think to look in the drop downs in the XY page where you can get to it. Seems a slightly odd discrepancy but I suppose it's the fact that in the synth page the right click is needed to mod assignments over performance controls.
Thanks a lot for pointing this out to me
I've never really got grips with the XY pads yet as I am more of a modulation programmer than performer, but in this case the XY pads seem to be essential to make sure the 303 sound stays within authentic boundaries ... that and the 303 is just begging for manual tweaking
Hopefully it won't take me too long to get it sorted and post it
Thanks a lot for pointing this out to me
I've never really got grips with the XY pads yet as I am more of a modulation programmer than performer, but in this case the XY pads seem to be essential to make sure the 303 sound stays within authentic boundaries ... that and the 303 is just begging for manual tweaking
Hopefully it won't take me too long to get it sorted and post it
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 208 posts since 8 Aug, 2010 from London, UK
Is it just me or does it seem a bit odd that the upper and lower limit arrows read right to left for lower and upper respectively (makes sense) but the bar set by the main source is backwards ie. lower values move it to the left and higher to the right. It is making it quite hard to get my head around.
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- Banned
- 6129 posts since 9 Oct, 2007 from an inharmonious society
Just double click on the line graphic of the arrows, and they will change to left-right, and also centered.iamyourfather wrote:Is it just me or does it seem a bit odd that the upper and lower limit arrows read right to left for lower and upper respectively (makes sense) but the bar set by the main source is backwards ie. lower values move it to the left and higher to the right. It is making it quite hard to get my head around.
Then just grab an arrow and move it to where you need it.
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 208 posts since 8 Aug, 2010 from London, UK
One other thing :/
I thinking that it would be nice to have the cutoff tied in reverse to the env mod depth somehow as low cutoff setting are virtually useless without the mod depth turned up. This was not a part of the original 303 (AFAIK) so maybe I should just turn the minimum cutoff higher than it is or get used to there being a massive redundant section of the XY cutofff pad when the the env mod depth is set low.
This is trickier than I first supposed it would be, but then .. what isn't.
I thinking that it would be nice to have the cutoff tied in reverse to the env mod depth somehow as low cutoff setting are virtually useless without the mod depth turned up. This was not a part of the original 303 (AFAIK) so maybe I should just turn the minimum cutoff higher than it is or get used to there being a massive redundant section of the XY cutofff pad when the the env mod depth is set low.
This is trickier than I first supposed it would be, but then .. what isn't.
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 208 posts since 8 Aug, 2010 from London, UK
Well here's where I am so far
https://www.box.com/files#/files/0/f/0/1/f_2347026932
It's a lot simpler than yours, I tried to keep as much to the original as possible, the only real deviation being the added BPres filter which gives more squidgeyness (is that a word ?). The env sustain should stay at zero, only the cutoff res envmoddepth and decay are modulated as per the original. I have tried to map these to XY pads to set useful limits but haven't really found it that iseful (I admit I am aving difficulty getting to grips with it.)
I've coaxed better sounds playing with the buttons on the main page than I have with the XY padsTBH but maybe I just need to give it a bit more time. If there's any obvious improvements can be made with the XY pads please let me know.
BTW, overdriving the xmf give fat acid techno sounds
https://www.box.com/files#/files/0/f/0/1/f_2347026932
It's a lot simpler than yours, I tried to keep as much to the original as possible, the only real deviation being the added BPres filter which gives more squidgeyness (is that a word ?). The env sustain should stay at zero, only the cutoff res envmoddepth and decay are modulated as per the original. I have tried to map these to XY pads to set useful limits but haven't really found it that iseful (I admit I am aving difficulty getting to grips with it.)
I've coaxed better sounds playing with the buttons on the main page than I have with the XY padsTBH but maybe I just need to give it a bit more time. If there's any obvious improvements can be made with the XY pads please let me know.
BTW, overdriving the xmf give fat acid techno sounds
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- KVRAF
- 1617 posts since 11 Dec, 2008 from Minneapolis
Maybe the other way around would feel more usable? Mod depth being scaled by the cutoff control, I mean.iamyourfather wrote:One other thing :/
I thinking that it would be nice to have the cutoff tied in reverse to the env mod depth somehow as low cutoff setting are virtually useless without the mod depth turned up. This was not a part of the original 303 (AFAIK) so maybe I should just turn the minimum cutoff higher than it is or get used to there being a massive redundant section of the XY cutofff pad when the the env mod depth is set low.
This is trickier than I first supposed it would be, but then .. what isn't.
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 208 posts since 8 Aug, 2010 from London, UK
TBH this simpler version where I only used 1 filter and no XY pads sound a lot truer to me, I think messing with the XY pads screwed the other one up a bit
https://www.box.com/files#/files/0/f/0/1/f_2347026932
https://www.box.com/files#/files/0/f/0/1/f_2347026932
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 208 posts since 8 Aug, 2010 from London, UK
My point is that at high cutoffs the envmod depth is inaudible and low cutoffs without high envmod depth are also quite inaudible, so they share kind of an inverse relationship as it were. I am torn between setting it up with toal control or just something that gives useable but less flexible sound... or not bothering with the XY pads at all as I seem to be able to get better results by just tweaking the main controls (but that may be my lack of experince with the XY pads)xh3rv wrote:Maybe the other way around would feel more usable? Mod depth being scaled by the cutoff control, I mean.iamyourfather wrote:One other thing :/
I thinking that it would be nice to have the cutoff tied in reverse to the env mod depth somehow as low cutoff setting are virtually useless without the mod depth turned up. This was not a part of the original 303 (AFAIK) so maybe I should just turn the minimum cutoff higher than it is or get used to there being a massive redundant section of the XY cutofff pad when the the env mod depth is set low.
This is trickier than I first supposed it would be, but then .. what isn't.