u-he

worldboy · Post by **worldboy** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 8:01 pm

hi i'm demo-ing zebra2 right now and i'm trying to play one of the bass patches so that the sound is triggered when i push a key on my midi controller and retriggered when i release the key. is this possible within zebra2 or do i need another midi application?

xh3rv · Post by **xh3rv** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 8:37 pm

Something would have to be in between the MIDI controller and Zebra to add more MIDI notes. An arpeggiator patch or occasionally other patches can do some interesting sequencing, but wouldn't quite match what you've described. What host are you using? I think some handle this pretty cleanly.

Howard · Post by **Howard** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 9:14 pm

You can make similar effects by applying negative modulation from an envelope (with a fast release) to lowpass filter cutoff. Or similar with an MSEG...

Bronto Scorpio · Post by **Bronto Scorpio** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 9:37 pm

I don't think it's possible to trigger Zebra on note off events at the moment but your host should have an option for that somewhere (As xh3rv already pointed out).

Howard wrote:You can make similar effects by applying negative modulation from an envelope (with a fast release) to lowpass filter cutoff. Or similar with an MSEG...

It can sound pretty awesome to add some release noise to sounds

Just set an MSEG up like this for example and make sure that the release of your amp env is long enough:

I used this technique in this sound for example:
Dust Keys

I've been waiting for a bad excuse to post that sound for quite some time now

Sorry for the off topic stuff

Cheers
Dennis

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Sat Jun 23, 2012 9:16 am

The normal envelopes can have a "Release 100" parameter which controls the time of a phase reaching max level between key lift and actual Release. This forms a simple AD envelope after Note Off and should just do the trick (provided one doesn't mind having anything happen on Key Down, which of course can be worked around)

Bronto Scorpio · Post by **Bronto Scorpio** » Sat Jun 23, 2012 9:26 am

Urs wrote:The normal envelopes can have a "Release 100" parameter which controls the time of a phase reaching max level between key lift and actual Release. This forms a simple AD envelope after Note Off and should just do the trick (provided one doesn't mind having anything happen on Key Down, which of course can be worked around)

The Rel25, Rel50....parameters are the only ones I honestly never used in Zebra

I really should check them out.
Still so much to discover after years

Cheers
Dennis

Howard · Post by **Howard** » Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:16 pm

Urs wrote:The normal envelopes can have a "Release 100" parameter...

I'm currently programming sounds for a very different synth - my weak excuse for forgetting about the extra Release stage!

kmonkey · Post by **kmonkey** » Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:57 pm

Howard wrote: I'm currently programming sounds for a very different synth

And that would be

xh3rv · Post by **xh3rv** » Sat Jun 23, 2012 7:39 pm

Bronto Scorpio wrote:The Rel25, Rel50....parameters are the only ones I honestly never used in Zebra

Same here

(There's goofy stuff I always wanted to do with envelopes that stay constant instead of hitting the release stage after note off, just can't remember what they were now

)

worldboy · Post by **worldboy** » Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:41 pm

hi again, thanks for the replies. i tried both the Rel100 and MSEG but couldn't get what i was looking for in either one. basically i want envelope 1 (the amp envelope) to retrigger/restart every time there is a midi note off signal. in other words, i want the note-on and note-off triggers to create identical results. the Rel100 approach creates a reverse-effect type sound from the note-off, but i couldn't get it to duplicate the the regular note-on sound. the MSEG looks like it might be able to achieve what i'm looking for somehow, but i wasn't able to find anything to link it with.

on a side note, i think having a "note-off" envelope would be great for plucked instruments to differentiate the alternating downward-pluck and upward-pluck motions. it would also feel quite natural playing on a midi keyboard as a note-off (lifting your finger from a key) is a very similar motion to an upward-pluck on a guitar for example.

xh3rv · Post by **xh3rv** » Sun Jun 24, 2012 12:29 am

worldboy wrote: ... the Rel100 approach creates a reverse-effect type sound from the note-off, but i couldn't get it to duplicate the the regular note-on sound. the MSEG looks like it might be able to achieve what i'm looking for somehow, but i wasn't able to find anything to link it with.

on a side note, i think having a "note-off" envelope would be great for plucked instruments to differentiate the alternating downward-pluck and upward-pluck motions ...

The temptation to get on Zebra and try this was pretty overwhelming, I got this: https://www.box.com/s/513607eb20ece1820ea7 - I think you're right about the plucking motion, this is fun

The Rel100 is a lot like the attack phase, so A & D are down-stroke, Rel100 & Release are up-stroke. MSEG1 is also used for a subtle tonal variation between up and down strokes - it's not visible but there's a 0-length, 0-value between the two segments.

Howard · Post by **Howard** » Sun Jun 24, 2012 8:34 am

worldboy wrote:The Rel100 approach creates a reverse-effect type sound from the note-off...

Not if you set the time to short.

...but i couldn't get it to duplicate the the regular note-on sound.

Try again

worldboy · Post by **worldboy** » Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:31 pm

ah i figured out what was wrong. i had to turn the sustain down for the note-on. this is close enough to what i was looking for but is there any way to get a duplicate note-off of the note-on without changing the envelope characteristics of the note-on (such as the sustain)? also, is there a way to make the filters restart at the note-off? i know i'm being overly picky here but this is a learning process for me as well

xh3rv · Post by **xh3rv** » Mon Jun 25, 2012 2:03 am

worldboy wrote:ah i figured out what was wrong. i had to turn the sustain down for the note-on. this is close enough to what i was looking for but is there any way to get a duplicate note-off of the note-on without changing the envelope characteristics of the note-on (such as the sustain)? also, is there a way to make the filters restart at the note-off? i know i'm being overly picky here but this is a learning process for me as well

Partially, yes. There are a few steps to it but you could use an envelope with rel100 to essentially be like the 'gate' mod source, but with an additional duration. Then with a bit of reconfiguration MSEGs can start to shape what the envelope had been shaping. Since there's an arbitrary number of stages to the MSEG, there's quite a bit that can be done to at least statically imitate an ASDR. Then, with some finesse and mod matrix voodoo there are a lot of ways to make this static MSEG more mutable.

But, this isn't like mirroring the incoming MIDI note, however. It would be plausible to make durations mutable with regard to velocity or keyfollow or something, but there's no mod source that's going to report the length of note-on to note-off as it's value.

This is fairly in-depth with Zebra so hope that makes any sense

scherbakov.al · Post by **scherbakov.al** » Fri Mar 03, 2017 12:47 pm

Kawai VPC-1 has a note-off event. I would use it to zebra 2-3..

u-he

KVR Audio

zebra2: how to trigger a sound on a note release (midi note off)?