MUX Vst : What do you need?

[hcv242]

hello,

Mux is becoming great. i have some sugestions and some issues to report.


- (for now) i dont want to use mux for building custom uis and synths. i just want to use it to wrap vsts\vstis that dont suport midi learn and do some audio routing. as it is the process is bit complicated though. if i load a mux preset with some vsts inside with all my mappings and i want to view the vsti ui i have to do a lot of steps. when i open the mux ui, the play editor windows is displayed. then i have to click in the deep editor button. and then i have to choose among the loaded vsts which one is the one i want to view and finally i have to double click in it. besides involving a lot of steps just to view a plugin ui; 3 windows are open in the process. that's a lof clutter and confusion. so my suggestion would be the possibility to dock selected vst uis in the play editor window. like that, when you load a patch you see the vst uis immediately and are ready to start tweaking.

- some people spend most of the time using presets and some other people spend most of the time creating presets. so it would be cool if you could set an option to start in the deep view , instead of starting in the play view.

- currently, to make a midi mapping in a vsti with its own ui, you have to click in the options and select map midi controler. i find myself searching for the words "map midi controller" a lot in those lits of options. a shortcut button for midi map, next to the options button would be great. this would save a mouse click.

- suggestion for the lfo: the ability to sync to song position and an extra knob for setting the lfo phase at the bar start.


- crash: if i load mux vsti in renoise and then try to load another mux vsti inside the first mux, renoise will crash.


-in renoise, with the latest version of mux, the vsti windows hide behind renoise. two versions ago it was working fine (i think...i dont have that version anymore so i cant test) (edit : ive checked. two versions ago the problem was the same)

[MuTools]

Alright, with this new version the parameters on Maschine's LCD (and in the software) gets updated on both save and changing parameter name! Now if it only happened when loading a patch.. Is it possible to do that?

I'm so sorry it's not yet in there, i overlooked something
It's in the next MUX Vst 1.0.17 which will be available soon.

[MuTools]

I tried the parameter thingie in Live and it shows the same behavior as Maschine - the automation names (parameter) updates when saved and when a parameter is renamed (though only that renamed parameter, not the others).

I can't control what names are actually updated by the VST host.
There is only a single simple way to tell the host that 'some name' has changed (updateDisplay)

From time to time i've had my host crash when removing an instance of Mux. Is this something you've noticed? It's been too random for me to figure out the cause. It has happened maybe 3-4 times so far.

No i did not yet notice something like that, you're the first one reporting this. I'll give it some specific tests. If you would find a repeatable pattern or more details, please let me know.

[MuTools]

- (for now) i dont want to use mux for building custom uis and synths. i just want to use it to wrap vsts\vstis that dont suport midi learn and do some audio routing. as it is the process is bit complicated though. if i load a mux preset with some vsts inside with all my mappings and i want to view the vsti ui i have to do a lot of steps. when i open the mux ui, the play editor windows is displayed. then i have to click in the deep editor button. and then i have to choose among the loaded vsts which one is the one i want to view and finally i have to double click in it. besides involving a lot of steps just to view a plugin ui; 3 windows are open in the process. that's a lof clutter and confusion. so my suggestion would be the possibility to dock selected vst uis in the play editor window. like that, when you load a patch you see the vst uis immediately and are ready to start tweaking.

You can do that already: You can drag the VST plugin box from the MUX Deep Editor into the MUX Play Editor.

some people spend most of the time using presets and some other people spend most of the time creating presets. so it would be cool if you could set an option to start in the deep view , instead of starting in the play view.

I've added this to the MUX Vst wishlist, as you're not the first one making a request about this.

currently, to make a midi mapping in a vsti with its own ui, you have to click in the options and select map midi controler. i find myself searching for the words "map midi controller" a lot in those lits of options. a shortcut button for midi map, next to the options button would be great. this would save a mouse click.

That should already be possible, see the main MUX window -> options menu -> Manage Shortcuts. But then it's a matter of making sure keyboard messages reach the VST editor. I checked it in Renoise, and even when checking "Enable Keyboard" i don't see any key messages coming in
Also in other hosts receiving key messages seems to be problematic. I rememeber from earlier readings that this is not an easy thing in VST land.

crash: if i load mux vsti in renoise and then try to load another mux vsti inside the first mux, renoise will crash.

I tried this in Renoise but couldn't repeat this. Is this repeatable? How often does it happen? Are you on Win 32 or 64 bit?

in renoise, with the latest version of mux, the vsti windows hide behind renoise. two versions ago it was working fine (i think...i dont have that version anymore so i cant test) (edit : ive checked. two versions ago the problem was the same)

Ok, this should already work fine in MUX Vst 1.0.16. I think we have crossed posts here.

FYI: On things i don't reply, i have no public comments atm.

[hcv242]

You can do that already: You can drag the VST plugin box from the MUX Deep Editor into the MUX Play Editor.

by doing that i get another box in the play editor. everytime i open mux vsti i have to double click in the vst boxes to open its ui. i have a chain of audio plugs and i want to see all their uis as i open the mux vsti window. the idea is that the play editor could work like a "desktop" where you place vst uis in an organized way. like in energyxt. dunno if im explaining myself in the right way.
i cant make a new interface for my plugins with mux macro knobs since the vst uis that im using are too complex to be reproduced accurately. i would lose lots of cool functions.


regarding the crash. yes, it happens every time i do it. i'm using win7 64 with renoise 32bit and mux 32. take notice that im talking about placing a MUX (Vst Synth) inside and nother MUX (Vst Synth) and not using mux from the "others" category. that one works nice and doesnt crash.


edit : can i have 16 stereo outputs? 4 its just not enough.

[Crackbaby]

I made a new patch. This time it's Ace by U-he focused on FM drumsounds. All 16 knobs controls common parameters like tuning (partial, sub etc) on LFO 2 and Osc 1. Waveform, sub osc, osc2 with ring, sync, cross mod, envelopes going from snappy to longer notes with release ........ lot's of stuff to tweak!
So instead of looking like a scientist using Ace's UI, i just tweak away on maschine without knowing exactly what im doing Though i have named the parameters, but with FM that doesn't really matter as you enter chaos pretty fast
Mux is a revolution (to me!)

Edit: It actually works for melodic sounds as well, not just FM




I keep hearing him saying this as i tweak (at 20 sec)

"There's no end to the possibilities!"

[MuTools]

by doing that i get another box in the play editor. everytime i open mux vsti i have to double click in the vst boxes to open its ui. i have a chain of audio plugs and i want to see all their uis as i open the mux vsti window. the idea is that the play editor could work like a "desktop" where you place vst uis in an organized way. like in energyxt. dunno if im explaining myself in the right way.
i cant make a new interface for my plugins with mux macro knobs since the vst uis that im using are too complex to be reproduced accurately. i would lose lots of cool functions.

That feature is not (yet?) in there.

crash: if i load mux vsti in renoise and then try to load another mux vsti inside the first mux, renoise will crash.

and

regarding the crash. yes, it happens every time i do it. i'm using win7 64 with renoise 32bit and mux 32. take notice that im talking about placing a MUX (Vst Synth) inside and nother MUX (Vst Synth) and not using mux from the "others" category. that one works nice and doesnt crash.

I installed Renoise 32 bit on Win 7 64 bit and plugged in MUX Synth 1.0.16 32 bit in track 1 and then i inserted another Basic Synth inside that first Basic Synth but i don't get a crash.

Can you please provide me with as many details as possible so i can further search for what's going on. Can you please describe what i have to do, step by step, click by click, in order to repeat that crash. Thanks!

edit : can i have 16 stereo outputs? 4 its just not enough.

In MUX 1.0 it will be 2 stereo inputs and 4 stereo outputs.
Please don't forget that not everyone wants that many outputs as you want.
It also takes more CPU power. I think a solution could be to make the number of ins/outs customizable, or provide a couple of different MUX versions eg 2/4, 4/8, 8/16. But that's all future talk, we'll see what users want most.

[sl23]

edit : can i have 16 stereo outputs? 4 its just not enough.

In MUX 1.0 it will be 2 stereo inputs and 4 stereo outputs.
Please don't forget that not everyone wants that many outputs as you want.
It also takes more CPU power. I think a solution could be to make the number of ins/outs customizable, or provide a couple of different MUX versions eg 2/4, 4/8, 8/16. But that's all future talk, we'll see what users want most.

I know little about the MUX but can't you add a set of module to the deep editor that allows for selecting the required number of outputs. Personally 4 is enough for me at present.

[hcv242]

I installed Renoise 32 bit on Win 7 64 bit and plugged in MUX Synth 1.0.16 32 bit in track 1 and then i inserted another Basic Synth inside that first Basic Synth but i don't get a crash.

Can you please provide me with as many details as possible so i can further search for what's going on. Can you please describe what i have to do, step by step, click by click, in order to repeat that crash. Thanks!

edit : can i have 16 stereo outputs? 4 its just not enough.

In MUX 1.0 it will be 2 stereo inputs and 4 stereo outputs.
Please don't forget that not everyone wants that many outputs as you want.
It also takes more CPU power. I think a solution could be to make the number of ins/outs customizable, or provide a couple of different MUX versions eg 2/4, 4/8, 8/16. But that's all future talk, we'll see what users want most.

im using the intrument version of mux....not the fx one. in renoise the instruments are not loaded in tracks. in renoise intruments are loaded in intrument slots.


if its going to be 4 tracks only, im sorry, but i cant use your sofware . 4 tracks makes it impossible to use any drum machine vsti inside mux. drum machines (like battery, or most others) have a different output for each soundpad so that you can mix the different drum hits in different tracks with your sequencer's mixer. a drum machine where i can load\mix only 4 sounds isnt useful to me . maybe you could do like kontakt does. in kontakt you have 3 different dlls. each one with different outputs: 4, 8 and 16 outputs.

[MuTools]

im using the intrument version of mux....not the fx one. in renoise the instruments are not loaded in tracks. in renoise intruments are loaded in intrument slots.

Yep that's what i did in order to repeat the crash you described, but no crash here yet. Please can you give me a step by step how to repeat that crash? Is it while playing only? At what exact point does the crash occur? There are so many possibilities, i'm trying to narrow it down.

if its going to be 4 tracks only, im sorry, but i cant use your sofware

Please note that the MUX has 4 stereo outputs, so these can also be used as 8 mono outputs.

drum machines (like battery, or most others) have a different output for each soundpad so that you can mix the different drum hits in different tracks with your sequencer's mixer.

I don't get it. When you plugin Battery in the MUX Vst, you'll see all outputs of Battery inside the MUX and so you can process them completely individually!

In the other case that you want to mix each & every output of Battery by the host, then you just plugin Battery directly into the host and you can process all outputs completely individually too, if the host supports that.

And in the case you have more than 8 sounds that you want to process by MUX-specific modules and then by host-specific modules, which is a very specific and rather rare situation i think, then you can still plugin Battery in the host and use multiple MUXes as inserts on the Battery channels.

So i think you do have all creative options. No?

maybe you could do like kontakt does. in kontakt you have 3 different dlls. each one with different outputs: 4, 8 and 16 outputs.

Yes that may be an option for a future version.

[> DiGiT <]

how about a way to run in standalone mode...

[MuTools]

The MUX you mean? Well i got this simple solution: Use MuLab.
MuLab is lightweight and has all the options of a standalone host

[> DiGiT <]

yes i know that would work. my point is you could simply pump midi into a standalone mux or play from a controller. ok whatever. dumb idea.

i must say that most of my suggestions wrt ease of use (ie less mouse mileage/less clicking about) and better organization of visual feedback seem to echo in this and other threads... im sorry but those things are what i want most for mux. the above suggestion is what my brain comes up with when what i truly think it needs is too involved to be approved atm

[bmrzycki]

how about a way to run in standalone mode...

You can also use SAVIHost as a very lightweight wrapper to MUX effectively making it standalone.

[> DiGiT <]

elegant solution! thank you very much.