Features/tweaks I'd like to see in EVE

[pw]

cabinfever wrote

*stop!!!!*

think for a minute

let's not just add all the standard features from all the other synths you own.
.....
*please* think deeply on this issue before de-evolving eve

Hey, no features are being added, just users talking about things . Its up to Liqih what happens with EVE. Here we just have a bunch different opinions about evolution/de-evolution, all very subjective of course....

[Cabinfever]

thats true. and my scribblings are just another opinion.

all i am trying to say is lets just think beyond the obvious "add more knobs" mentality.

more knobs does not automatically make something better !

clever soundsets are the key to eve imho

[SuitcaseOfLizards]

I'm going to chime in here and say, as a relatively new EVE owner, I love it just the way it is! I can stack a couple of instances and get a monster sound, it's wonderful!

Sometimes less is more, but I'm weird, I prefer to have "specialist" synths and stack/split 'em to get the sound I'm looking for.

[Jeremy_NSL]

Many of the options I suggested could be implemented with a very minimal change in the GUI. For instance, when the filter button is clicked on, then the adsr and velo settings effect the filter. When its clicked off, they effect the amp. The same as now, except both settings are 'remembered' and used simultaneously.

Basically I disagree with everything you said, Cabinfever. I have programmed many sounds for EVE and am struck by very simple limitations that, if fixed, would 'open up' sound design possibilities. Adding these would make EVE no harder to program - no one would force you to use them.

[ugo]

let's not just add all the standard features from all the other synths you own.

in my case, i believe the features i spoke in favor of are standards for a good reason...they are not only useful, but necessary for any serious level of sound design beyond just stacking samples.

what makes eve so good ? eve is simple. it has a good functional gui. you can create excellent new sounds very fast.

again, this is just my opinion, but i feel that without proper filter control, you are limited in what you can create. therefore, the "excellent new sounds" will eventually become the "same old sounds" because you cant do anything to alter the sound of the samples. this is a classic rompler problem but its greatly exacerbated by not providing enough control over the filters.

let's have some deep thought on soundsets. that is where the strength of eve really is. soundsets are the key to making eve better and different to all the other instruments.

soundsets are great...i've got all 4 right now and im pleased that i do. im sure i will buy others as they become available. but we'd get much more out of the new samples we are paying for if we could do more with them.

thankfully each new soundset adds a ton of new presets to eve...but thats just it...right now i see eve as little more than a preset synth. its got lots of sounds to pick from and i can mix and match samples and do some basic tweaking, but i still cant create many the pads and basses im looking for because i dont have enough control over the filters. the raw material is there, but i just cant sculpt it the way i want to.

no other instrument has the soundset concept so beautfully worked out.

how does eve's soundset concept differ from that of hypersonic's? im not being sarcastic here, its an honest question. i've never used hypersonic before but the concept looks pretty much the same to me.

how about three layers of the same sound, but each sound is filtered differently ?

that filtering can only be so different when you cant properly adjust the cutoff and the resonance and the filter has to use the amp's velocity and envelope.

*please* think deeply on this issue before de-evolving eve

i have thought a lot about this. i really like eve...enough so that i feel strongly about improving it because i'd like to do more with it and i'd like to see it be more successfull in the market.

you have a very valid point about keeping the synth from becomming too bloated in controls. however, by adding more control over the filters, eve will be much more useful...both now and in the long run.

-ugo

[Cabinfever]

i have programmed many sounds for eve too. but that's because it's a beautifully streamlined device. simple is good.

turn eve into a five-legged camel with two heads and tentacles and that 'ease of programming' factor will disappear.

a filter envelope activated by a button ? eh ? would it pop-up ? what is it's default setting ? can you see the setting or do you have to hit the button to view ? or maybe there's another page of controls ? and once you adjust the filter envelope is it then active forever ? if you switch it off what happens - what setting does it return to ?and this is just one 'simple' new feature ?!

you see this sort of simplistic synth-bloating wishlist stuff all the time.

this is **exactly** how good, focussed products are destroyed and turned into hopeless bloatware.

eve needs clever soundsets, not more knobs.

edit: ugo, this is not a reply to your very considered post ! i must come back to you soon with ore thoughts...

[liqih]

you all got good points friends, keep them coming!

[krraqk]

The filter improvements asked are very basic, not some confusing esoteric function. But it will improve EVE without a doubt.

I see EVE as a great idea and I would like to see that idea evolve and not remain a static one.

I certainly purchased EVE hoping that it will grow an get better and better. No one promised me that, but I definitely would like it.

Also I think it will be good for the developer to make it better (not only with the sounds) it will guarantee more sales and keep it in the edge.

[Jeremy_NSL]

a filter envelope activated by a button ? eh ? would it pop-up ? what is it's default setting ? can you see the setting or do you have to hit the button to view ? or maybe there's another page of controls ? and once you adjust the filter envelope is it then active forever ? if you switch it off what happens - what setting does it return to ?and this is just one 'simple' new feature ?!

You've made this MUCH more complicated that it actually would be. Obviously the filter env would be active only if the LP button was pressed. If you want to edit the amp env, you click LP again and adjust the sliders. The other option is to have a seperate env-switch button instead of using the LP button as a toggle. Both implementations would be simple.

Where did you get another page of controls from? Pop up? huh? why would it be active forever? if you switch off the filter why would the filter env change? No offense, but I find much of your post nonsensical.

[Cabinfever]

your suggested implementation is astoundingly messy.

do you mean that one set of envelope sliders cover both functions ? and you have to see whether the little "lp" button is active to see which one you've got ?

this is terrible. worse than terrible - woeful. have you given this any thought at all ?

if you're going to have both an amp envelop and a filter envelope then both *must* be visible simultaneously.

perhaps you've never noticed, but every other synth in creation with two envelopes follows this "both visible" rule. and why is that ? its because its the subtle interaction of the envelopes which so changes the character of the sound.

you make a little adjustment on the vcf here, a little less on the vca there, a tiny bit more on the vcf decay etc. this would be a nightmare with your proposed layout.

so, where are the 12 extra sliders going ?

[Cabinfever]

the two main things i'd like to see:

- a way of directly opening the preset list from the front panel. navigating to the expanding menu is messy. such a used feature should have a direct link

- a way to create extra banks easily so that when twiddling with presets you can choose to save the modified result into your own new bank.

[Jeremy_NSL]

My suggestion is quite a bit less messy than an extra 12 sliders... However thats certainly not the only possible way to implement a filter env. Just the easiest without a gui redesign.

Regardless its all a moot point because liqih says that seperate envs aren't happening any time soon. Some really great other features are, however - such as a limiter, better tape degrade and hopefully seperate amp/filter velo sens knobs etc etc.

If you don't want EVE to improve its sound-design aspects, fine. I think this thread demonstrates the rest of us do, though.

[ugo]

if you're going to have both an amp envelop and a filter envelope then both *must* be visible simultaneously.

perhaps you've never noticed, but every other synth in creation with two envelopes follows this "both visible" rule.

sorry but this is not true at all...not even close. perhaps *you've* never noticed but nearly every hardware synth made over the last 15-20 years do not show both the amp and filter envelopes at the same time. not even all softsynths show both at once.

the method floyd suggested is a perfectly logical, efficient and effective solution that has been in practice for ages.

-ugo

[Cabinfever]

ugo from planet ugo. maybe you are talking about hardware synths that economised on buttons and sliders and made everything controlled by master knob ?

this was an invention of accountants.

but you're right, it's not every synth. it's every well-designed synth.

[Cabinfever]

another suggestion is an improvement of the phaser. it doesn't seem either rich or smooth to me. i pump it sounds more like a metallic flanger than a swirly phaser.