Polyphonic Guitar to MIDI VST/AU "MIDI Guitar"- BETA TEST

[JamOrigin]

... So, I tried the stand alone MIDI Guitar & the mic input just picking up the acoustic sound of my electric guitar.

That wont work. You need a decent interface.

[ariajazz]

I've been playing extensively with version 4 today. Things are getting better, tracking is very good, not perfect but completely playable. Tried it with ELEKTROSTUDIO JUNE which is a vst version of the old ROLAND JUNO 6. It's a joy, it sounds smooth and clear (monophonic mode) with almost none ghost notes that I would describe as "artifacts" rather than real fake notes. In poly mode I get a few more artifacts but that's comprehensible due to sensitivity settings and contact with other strings.

I could only trigger up to the 17th fret in both 1st and 2nd strings, above that I get the played note but down an octave.

Some latency is present even at low buffer settings but it is not a big issue since is almost unnoticeable when you play within a musical context. Pitch Recognition set to 2 gives the best tracking results.

Pitch sensitivity is a nice feature comparable to Roland GR's string sensitivity adjustment, it does the job but obviously not strictly per string. This is not an hexaphonic system. I have not had the need to used it yet. This indicates me that my pickups are properly and evenly adjusted in terms of output balance

By the way, I'm insisting with my hollow body with flatwound strings since it is right now my main axe. I do play various styles and this guitar fits them all. Probably my Fender Strat and the Ibanez one can track a bit better. I will try with them tomorrow. I wont bother with my custom made GK2a equiped guitar since it already has the hex pickup.

I have to say that MIDI GUITAR is tracking and behaving almost as good as my ROLAND GR system. Great job Ole... We're all in this beta testing project pursuing to develop an incredible piece of software.

[AdmiralQuality]

AdmiralQuality, I'm under the impression that a tuning in a tun file is simply a mapping from a MIDI pitch to a MIDI pitch plus a fraction of 1 MIDI pitch shift, for 127 notes. It seems that there is quite some interest in tunings, and since its easy to send pitch bends with note-on events on different channels, its just one more way MIDI Guitar can offer value over a keyboard controller. This is really just a small generalization of the current pitch shift functionality. But naturally, we will focus on the essential features first (i.e bends, velocity and sustain).

Ah, I see what you're getting at. Fudging the MIDI output through pitch bend messages to match a particular alternate tuning.

But I think when you get to this you're going to realize you've opened a horrible can of worms, as you're also going to be using those same pitch bend messages to track source bends. And when subsequent semitones are no longer (necessarily) evenly spaced in pitch ratio, how can that bend be appropriately interpreted?

So yes, what you describe there is possible, within certain constraints -- obviously the destination instrument and MIDI-Guitar need to agree on the pitch bend range, but that's normal for multichannel MIDI guitar controllers. There will also be many possible cases where the .tun file can't be interpreted by adding pitch bend to the standard MIDI note frequency, because the bend range of the instrument isn't enough. (Say we mapped all 128 keys to 1 cent intervals so they only spread across a couple of semitones.) And if the pitch ratios at every "semitone" aren't equal, it will void the whole point of string bend tracking. (Maybe that will be a mode you can turn off when using .tun files.) Very messy, but within a lot of constraints, I suppose it's possible.

I understand what you're getting at now. Carry on!

[chrisby]

I just tried v.04 today and this is actually my first post... before anything though a big thanks to JamOrigin for undertaking this daunting task. It is something I know a lot of people have been after for a long time. Way back in the day I owned a GI-10, then tried a piece of software by Lateral Solutions called Guitar Synth which conceptually was very similar to Midi Guitar, then went to an EZ-EG, then a YouRock usb device. So if this pans out I'm sure it will be huge for a lot of people. Up until this last version though I personally wasn't having a lot of luck. I know from previous experience that you usually have to do a good deal of tweaking to get things just right (i.e. signal levels, picking techniques, signal eq, etc). So quite possibly I just wasn't doing something right (V.01 and V.02). V.04 for me was a vast improvement right out of the gate. A lot better polyphonic performance (monophonic for me was very good already with the previous versions) and a bit better latency without a lot of tweaking required.


So for JamOrigins here are my observations so far and a few suggestions -

Monophonic recognition is great... some moderate latency but overall really few glitches at all.

Polyphonic recognition is good though it might be better if I knew what the best playing config/techniques were. A simple guide to best achieving a good signal would be great.

For polyphonic I noticed that finger picking a few strings at exactly the same time doesn't seem to usually get more than one note. Just the slightest time it takes to strum a chord seems to alleviate the problem. Easy to work around so not a big deal.

It seems like there is some kind of signal auto-compensation going on possibly? I notice that the longer I have the stand alone open the signal being drawn seems to get weaker. Especially if I start with an extra hot signal. Maybe a simple color scheme that indicates when the signal is generally to low or high would be better.

Lastly, for polyphonic tracking I'm right on the edge of the usable zone. Still just a little high on my system (Q9450 / 6GB).

All up though, a great effort and I look forward to the eventual commercial release. I'm sure it will be a success. Thanks for all your work so far...

[shanecgriffo]

Trying beta.4 and no issues to report yet
Played for a while tonight with minor adjustments to the default settings with few tracking problems.. Look forward to playing some more..

[jdt]

The newest beta is by far the cleanest tracking version so far. Again I believe much of the results you'll get are greatly proportional to the selection of instrument and preset chosen.

Two things I have noticed so far:

The VST scan/directory. It seems to only scan and verify the first level within any folder. Any plugin that resides in a folder within a folder isn't indentified and verified. For instance if you have your plugin directory set up like VST Plugins/Synths/Zebra2/Zebra2.dll, it won't be found. Even if you navigate to the plugin manually searching for an instrument, it doesn't always appear in the recently used instrument dropdown the next time you run MIDI Guitar. FL Studio and other DAWs will scan deeper into the directory.

On the Pitch Sensitivity Settings page I can trigger the individual note buttons, but am unable to adjust the sensitivity sliders underneath. I think the ability to customize each note's setting would be handy to facilitate setting up "guitar templates" to one's axe and playing style. Maybe I'm missing something?

I've found that in the majority of my testing, I have been able to bend notes and those notes will track about 1/2 step up and then cut out. For the most part that suits my needs and playing style. I wonder, has anyone had any luck trying any whammy bar stunts?

[sheldrakes]

I am using the test track I made from the tabs on the midi guitar website to try and get a decent setup. The first thing I noticed was that tuning is very critical. I had tuned my guitar pretty well, but when I played the test track through the vst it was tending to go for the next higher semitone. A few cents out, although probably not audible to "normal" ears is enough to confuse it. An integrated tuner would be nice, or an offset compensation parameter of a few cents +/-.

[Eleventh]

On the Pitch Sensitivity Settings page I can trigger the individual note buttons, but am unable to adjust the sensitivity sliders underneath.

I found this a little bit confusing too. First you need to click "copy" below the recognition presets selection, so it creates a new template. Then you can adjust the indivitual note settings.

[sheldrakes]

It seems that the setup indicator in vst mode is running ahead of the playback so it looks like it is playing a semitone higher than it is. Also confusing, but it wasn't the guitar out of tune after all.

[jdt]

On the Pitch Sensitivity Settings page I can trigger the individual note buttons, but am unable to adjust the sensitivity sliders underneath.

I found this a little bit confusing too. First you need to click "copy" below the recognition presets selection, so it creates a new template. Then you can adjust the indivitual note settings.

Thanks!! That was easy.

[FrettedSynth]

It seems like there is some kind of signal auto-compensation going on possibly? I notice that the longer I have the stand alone open the signal being drawn seems to get weaker.

I thought it was just me this was happening to, so I never mentioned it?

Although it does not seem like it has affected tracking? Possibly it has affected velocity sent to the synth?

[chrisby]

It seems like there is some kind of signal auto-compensation going on possibly? I notice that the longer I have the stand alone open the signal being drawn seems to get weaker.

I thought it was just me this was happening to, so I never mentioned it?

Although it does not seem like it has affected tracking? Possibly it has affected velocity sent to the synth?

Yeah, for me it seems to eventually actually overcompensate to the point where the signal is too low and I either have to boost it or restart the app. That's when I knew it wasn't just my imagination... I'd restart without touching anything and immediately the signal being drawn would be a good bit hotter. That said I'm on a new built system so it's entirely possible that it's something on my end that has nothing to do with the program. It sounds like what you are seeing is maybe less pronounced?

[aaron aardvark]

... So, I tried the stand alone MIDI Guitar & the mic input just picking up the acoustic sound of my electric guitar.

That wont work. You need a decent interface.

If having the INPUT DEVICE set at BUILT-IN MICROPHONE won't work, what is that setting good for then? I have a Tascam US-144 USB 2.0 Audio interface. If I plug my guitar to my interface, it seems no signal is reaching MIDI Guitar. I don't know if it can possibly work if I can't open MIDI Guitar as an effect within Cubase LE4. Or is there another way of making it work without a DAW?

[JamOrigin]

The VST scan/directory. It seems to only scan and verify the first level within any folder. Any plugin that resides in a folder within a folder isn't indentified and verified. For instance if you have your plugin directory set up like VST Plugins/Synths/Zebra2/Zebra2.dll, it won't be found. Even if you navigate to the plugin manually searching for an instrument, it doesn't always appear in the recently used instrument dropdown the next time you run MIDI Guitar. FL Studio and other DAWs will scan deeper into the directory.

This will be fixed in the next version so that directories are scanned recursively.

... So, I tried the stand alone MIDI Guitar & the mic input just picking up the acoustic sound of my electric guitar.

That wont work. You need a decent interface.

If having the INPUT DEVICE set at BUILT-IN MICROPHONE won't work, what is that setting good for then? I have a Tascam US-144 USB 2.0 Audio interface. If I plug my guitar to my interface, it seems no signal is reaching MIDI Guitar. I don't know if it can possibly work if I can't open MIDI Guitar as an effect within Cubase LE4. Or is there another way of making it work without a DAW?

We are not able to determine which input is the microphone, it might be called different things on different systems, so we just list all the possible inputs.

Have you tried selecting a different input channel in the standalone and also made sure that your guitar has the volume turn all the way up? Remember you need to plug in the audio interface before you start MIDI Guitar.

[aaron aardvark]

JamOrigin,
Yes, I should have mentioned I also tried the INPUT DEVICE: BUILT-IN INPUT and Guitar MIDI seems to receive no signal. My guitar is turned up all the way and my interface input shows it is receiving a signal. So, I have only gotten MIDI Guitar to react to my guitar with the INPUT DEVICE set at BUILT-IN MICROPHONE, but as I stated earlier the note detection is very dodgy. I definitely have my interface plugged in before I turn on my computer. I have never had a guitar input into my computer outside of using Cubase LE4 (not counting the mic input stated earlier), so I wouldn't be surprised if there is some computer setting to get that signal from the interface to MIDI Guitar somehow. Earlier someone mentioned a setting for a PC/Windows, but I have an iMac.