The new "Banks" mode for multiparameters

[farfadetfarfelu]

This mode can be found in the multiparameters, mode > banks

So this looks like the multiparameter sequencer that was discussed a while back.
Thank you so much, it opens up some interesting things that i can probably not even start to imagine. I would have never thought it could be used to modulate the steps in a sequencer. A sequencer modulating another sequencer, uh.

I wanted to use it to replicate the Moog Murf inside MXXX by using 8 filters, each tuned to a specific frequency.
So here are the parameters inside the Bank sequencer :
- Volume Filter 1
- Volume Filter 2
- Volume Filter 3
- Volume Filter 4
- Volume Filter 5
- Volume Filter 6
- Volume Filter 7
- Volume Filter 8

The problem i am facing : it is not very practical to use because there is no visual feedback of the values stored in the banks.
Basically i have to go set up each filter, and save a snapshot of all the settings for each step of the sequencer.
Building a pattern for a sequencer is a very visual thing.
It would be way more powerfull to see and be able to enter/modify all the values directly in the Multiparameter - banks window !
Am i missing something ?

[farfadetfarfelu]

Something like that, one line per parameter.

[MeldaProduction]

Hmmm, well, something like that could be possible I guess. The trouble is just that the number of parameters is not limited, so this can quickly get out of control...

Btw. check MWobbler, basically all active presets there are using this method .

[farfadetfarfelu]

Hmmm, well, something like that could be possible I guess. The trouble is just that the number of parameters is not limited, so this can quickly get out of control...

Btw. check MWobbler, basically all active presets there are using this method .

Yep i was refering to the wobbler when saying "the sequencer modulating another sequencer". I would never have imagined this could give such an interesting result !

I really think it's worth it to limit the number of parameters (16 ?) and make the values visible, i'm pretty sure it will help people to understand the concept, and it will make it MUCH more intuitive to use.

Also it would be cool to have a global preset system for the patterns of the banks sequencer ? in addition to saving the values per step.

If you are interested, I can offer to help and do a few presets for 4 parameter sequencer, and try to replicate presets similar to the moog murf patterns for 8 parameter sequencer. It will be fun.

[MeldaProduction]

It will probably end like that . But no presets - it would make no sense as you can have any combination of parameters controlled by the multiparameter. There are actually quite simple and quick ways to edit these, I'll try to make some video tutorial about that.

[farfadetfarfelu]

It will probably end like that . But no presets - it would make no sense as you can have any combination of parameters controlled by the multiparameter. There are actually quite simple and quick ways to edit these, I'll try to make some video tutorial about that.

Cool !

I'm sorry to report that i have another idea for the Multiparameter modes : it could be called "Link" or "Mapping" mode.
Currently i believe all the parameters inside a multiparameter are independant one from another. The idea of this mode is to link several parameters together according to a set of rules or a mathematical curve.

For example : MULTITAP (10 tap) DELAY using several delay processors in MXXX.

Parameters in the multiparameter :
Delay Time 1
Delay Time 2
Delay Time 3
... etc
Delay Time 10

In the link mode, We could have those parameters
Min value from 0 to 100
Max value from 0 to 100
"Skew" from -100 to +100 or a curve

So basically if i set min value to 0 and max value to 100 in LINK multiparameter mode, then :
Delay time 1 = 0
DT2 = 10
DT3 = 20
DT4 = 40
...
DT10 = 100
That's a basic ten tap multitap delay with the taps equally distributed between a min and max value.

The skew parameter could be used to distribute the taps more towards the beginning or more towards the end between the min and max range. A user adjustable curve could also do the job more precisely instead of a skew knob.

A Random parameter could be added to randomize the value of each parameter easily instead of linking all the parameters to a different random oscilator.

What do you think ?
I believe there is a grm tools VST that does this with filters instead of delays so maybe this can be useful for several things.

[MeldaProduction]

Hmmm, I either don't understand, or you can already do that using the parameter transformation curve. Or can't you???

[farfadetfarfelu]

Hmmm, I either don't understand, or you can already do that using the parameter transformation curve. Or can't you???

Yes it is possible to program a multitap delay, but you have to program each parameter (each delay tap) individually, they are not adjustable together at the same time on one window. This means you have to calculate each transformation curve and draw it for each delay tap And you have to reprogram everything if you add one delay tap for example.

Basically instead of having independant controls for each parameter, it would be necessary to have one global window that controls how the parameters (delay time 1, delay time 2 etc) are linked between each other.

Are you familiar with soundtoys echoboy and GRM tools delays ?
It is hard to explain but i think you will understand what i mean if you take a look to those plugins.

http://www.inagrm.com/delays

[MeldaProduction]

Well, sorry, but I don't really see a point in this. This is one of the most "specific" cases I have ever seen. I understand that for multitap delays it may be useful, but that's about it. And there is infinite ways to combine the multiple parameters - you came up with just one idea where the parameters are increasing (if I understand it correctly). That's useful for your case, but in general it's useless, so doing this for just this thing makes no sense to me, sorry. There could be random transformation generator or something like that, that would at least make a little sense, but doesn't seem very useful either.

Btw. what should I see on the GRM tools? (sorry, but there are so many things I have to do, that I simply don't have time to explore every single software on the market )

[farfadetfarfelu]

Well you seem to have perfectly understood so no need to check the other plugins.

Yeah i agree as of today it appears to be very specific to multitap delays and potentially filters so i understand if the idea gets rejected !

I'll see if i can try it with several flangers or shifters in parallel...

[farfadetfarfelu]

Okay so this is an MXXX 7.09 video with the updated multiparameter bank mode replicating a MOOG MURF. Thanks for the update, It works !



Things that could make it even better :

- more control over the interpolation, a slider instead of just on/of. Or something similar to the different waveforms of the sequencer, or the usual ADSR/envelope controls.

- 32 steps instead of 20

- A preset system for the sequencer patterns

Also i used 8 filters instead of using 4 wobblers because i think maybe there is a bug with the wobblers in MXXX : if i insert a wobbler on column 2 and a wobbler on column 3 and a mixer processor on column 4, then generally MXXX crashes if i insert another wobbler or mixer.

[MeldaProduction]

I don't really knog Moog murf, but from the video it looks pretty nice . Good job!

To the questions:

1) What do you mean? It interpolates or switches the parameter values. I don't really see a use for an ADSR for example. Anyway it would get out of creative control then .

2) Ok, increasing to 32, but note that it probably won't fit the GUI anymore.

3) Patterns don't make sense here so much - it stores parameter values and since every parameter is different, changing its value will have different consequences.

I'll check the MWobbler crash.

[farfadetfarfelu]

I don't really knog Moog murf, but from the video it looks pretty nice . Good job!

To the questions:

1) What do you mean? It interpolates or switches the parameter values. I don't really see a use for an ADSR for example. Anyway it would get out of creative control then .

I tried to explain with the graph below what i mean by smoothing / Attack / Release parameters :

View in bank mode (8 steps)


Same thing viewed in more traditionnal sequencer mode


Those parameters can be used to get rid of the clicking sound between each step change and control how each steps "morphs" into the other one, making the sound more even or more gated/tremoloed with higher attack and release for example. It makes a real difference in the result.
The LFOs and sequencer in the modulator already have a smoothing parameter, Attack and release could also be added to the sequencer in the modulator.

3) Patterns don't make sense here so much - it stores parameter values and since every parameter is different, changing its value will have different consequences.

You are right, the idea of patterns seems less useful because the sequencer tracks can be connected to various parameters of varius effetcs, but the Murf is a good counter-example because the eight parameters are all filters and they are connected to each other by a pattern.
The goal of the global bank preset would be to program this patterns for example (from moog manual) :

Instead of building them from zero each time.
Those patterns look very generic, so they should be useful for many things ?
I know it's probably a lot of work so...

I'm sure there's quite a vast field for experimentation with this multitrack sequencer now it has apparent values.