Zebra 2: Is there some way to modulate an OSC with another OSC?
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- KVRAF
- 4197 posts since 23 May, 2004 from Bad Vilbel, Germany
Not sure I understand that, 3*s, but the FMOs can take anything as input (everything above them in the grid).
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- u-he
- 30245 posts since 8 Aug, 2002 from Berlin
Yeah, sorry, analogue-style crossmod/FM wasn't possible at decent quality with with Zebra's socillators. Hence the inclusion of dedicated FM Oscillators (which of course do dx-style phase modulation)
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- KVRian
- Topic Starter
- 1243 posts since 24 Oct, 2003 from Maine
The input to the FMO is the modulator and the waveform selected on the FMO panel is the carrier correct? I want to use an input source as a carrier. Or at least a selection of basic waveforms like saw and square. You can get some great textures by modulating a square with a triangle.
♫♪♫♫♪♫
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- KVRAF
- 5223 posts since 20 Jul, 2010
You can get similar stuff with the Osc FX.
http://sendy.bandcamp.com/releases < My new album at Bandcamp! Now pay what you like!
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- KVRist
- 431 posts since 27 Sep, 2005
While many OscFX indeed are able to achieve similar to analogue-style FM sound characteristics, they can't imitate the case when carrier frequency not equal to modulator frequency (I mean slight detuning, not octaves detune).
There is also one workaround, another way to bring some FM to oscillators. LFOs can operate at very high frequencies, so it is able to set it at quite high frequency which is enough for FM effect. You can even set keytracking to it.
If I remember correctly, Urs said that modulations in Zebra are very fast - it renew it's values in something like 4 samples.
But I often want higher frequency for modulator (for noise-like modulator, i. e. But if you use random LFO waveforms or your custom waveform, LFO frequency falls drastically because of it's interface (frequency sets speed of one segment of these LFOs, not overall period)). I tried to set it higher in matrix, but it seems that it cant go higher. So it is harder to use your own LFO shapes or random shapes for FM.
There is also one workaround, another way to bring some FM to oscillators. LFOs can operate at very high frequencies, so it is able to set it at quite high frequency which is enough for FM effect. You can even set keytracking to it.
If I remember correctly, Urs said that modulations in Zebra are very fast - it renew it's values in something like 4 samples.
But I often want higher frequency for modulator (for noise-like modulator, i. e. But if you use random LFO waveforms or your custom waveform, LFO frequency falls drastically because of it's interface (frequency sets speed of one segment of these LFOs, not overall period)). I tried to set it higher in matrix, but it seems that it cant go higher. So it is harder to use your own LFO shapes or random shapes for FM.
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- KVRAF
- 3817 posts since 8 Mar, 2006
As I remember, Zebra's LFOs aren't practical when key tracked FM is in mind.
The best way is to use MSEGs as they are loopable and fast enought to be key tracked.
https://app.box.com/s/1bgopk0mjfvpyxwtj5br
MSEG4 in this case.
So, basically you can "FM" any parameter.
have fun!
The best way is to use MSEGs as they are loopable and fast enought to be key tracked.
https://app.box.com/s/1bgopk0mjfvpyxwtj5br
MSEG4 in this case.
So, basically you can "FM" any parameter.
have fun!
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- KVRist
- 431 posts since 27 Sep, 2005
Wow, thanks! I haven't thought about using MSEGs. It is more handy than LFO, indeed. But, unfortunately, is Global, and not so convenient if true polyphony is needed. But awesome, nonetheless.3ee wrote:As I remember, Zebra's LFOs aren't practical when key tracked FM is in mind.
The best way is to use MSEGs as they are loopable and fast enought to be key tracked. So, basically you can "FM" any parameter.
have fun!
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- KVRAF
- 3817 posts since 8 Mar, 2006
not sure I understand... global as in GLFOs ?trance_lucent wrote:But, unfortunately, is Global, and not so convenient if true polyphony is needed. But awesome, nonetheless.
MSEGs are polyphonic if trigger mode is set to poly.
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- KVRist
- 431 posts since 27 Sep, 2005
Oh, sorry. MSEGs are my weakest spot in Zebra. For some foolish reasons I thought MSEGs are monophonic as GLFO.3ee wrote:not sure I understand... global as in GLFOs ?trance_lucent wrote:But, unfortunately, is Global, and not so convenient if true polyphony is needed. But awesome, nonetheless.
MSEGs are polyphonic if trigger mode is set to poly.
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- KVRist
- 431 posts since 27 Sep, 2005
I am currently experimenting with FM (and PM using phase control of oscillators) using Oscillator as carrier and LFO as the modulator.
If I set LFO period to .1 sec and max rate control, its frequency is not enough for me. Trying to raise rate control in the matrix (Zebra usually allows to add values to already-maximized controls in matrix), but it don't want to raise. Why? It isn't theoretical max frequency of LFO, because I can raise it further by maximizing RateMod with Gate control (but it isn't enough as well).
How can I set LFO rate to it's theoretical limit (samplerate / 4 / 2 AFAIK)?
It is great if Zebra3 will do analogue FM using arbitrary waveforms oscillators as carriers. But I also noticed (experimenting with LFO->Osc PM) that I want PM more than FM, it is great for add some grit (these nice spikes and instabilities in wafeform due to negative phase increments!), so I am dreaming about PM for arbitrary waveforms too.
If I set LFO period to .1 sec and max rate control, its frequency is not enough for me. Trying to raise rate control in the matrix (Zebra usually allows to add values to already-maximized controls in matrix), but it don't want to raise. Why? It isn't theoretical max frequency of LFO, because I can raise it further by maximizing RateMod with Gate control (but it isn't enough as well).
How can I set LFO rate to it's theoretical limit (samplerate / 4 / 2 AFAIK)?
It is great if Zebra3 will do analogue FM using arbitrary waveforms oscillators as carriers. But I also noticed (experimenting with LFO->Osc PM) that I want PM more than FM, it is great for add some grit (these nice spikes and instabilities in wafeform due to negative phase increments!), so I am dreaming about PM for arbitrary waveforms too.
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- KVRAF
- 3817 posts since 8 Mar, 2006
You can't atm AFAIK.trance_lucent wrote:How can I set LFO rate to it's theoretical limit (samplerate / 4 / 2 AFAIK)?
Some parameters simply have a limit that you can't defy with the mod matrix. ... like osc detune
anyway.... tip: instead of the gate mod, use an empty mod mixer with max constant to offset values... why? more range where applicable and it keeps value within the release stage of the envelopes.
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- KVRist
- 431 posts since 27 Sep, 2005
Yes, I know, usually I use modmixers as constants. But I can't find modmixers in the FreqMod Dpt menu.3ee wrote: anyway.... tip: instead of the gate mod, use an empty mod mixer with max constant to offset values... why? more range where applicable and it keeps value within the release stage of the envelopes.
Edit: And, yes, it would be handy to have unit "Const" modifier in the modulators menu in Zebra 3. As well as "Random 1", "Random 2" and so on, may be unipolar and bipolar versions.