Satin goes V1.1

[Urs]

Regarding presets saved with locked parameters... open in text editor, remove any line starting with "#lock=" - this brings those broken presets back. I'm quite sure I found the bug though, it'll be fixed shortly!

[jensa]

Ok guys. I have found two critical bugs, based on your feedback.

1 Preset don't always load properly when saved with locked parameters. The presets are okay, but the loading doesn't work proeprly.

2. The Group Controller can be confused if projects are loaded while there's still another project open, or possibly even when loading presets in a Grouped instance. This can lead to a crash.

I'll try to fix those two bugs within an hour, or we need to postpone release by a few days.

I found a non-critical yesterday when I was trying out Satin in bigger GUI sizes than Normal. Any size above Normal has a strange behavior where the input knobs "stutters graphically" when I move it. No such problems when size is set to Normal or lower. Tested in latest Reaper version. I can send you an animated GIF when I get home from work if You want/need/crave/insist.

[Dip200]

Why does the reference level knob not change the threshold/headroom? It makes no sense to me. My sessions are calibrated to around -18db, that's the sweet spot so to speak. So when I turn the reference level down to -18 that's where my audio should be hitting the tape machine at around zero. But all it does is changing the display. What's the benefit of it if I still need to change the Input knob to drive the tape harder ? Confused

[sascha]

Why does the reference level knob not change the threshold/headroom?

There's no threshold. No 'compression' going on here.

It's the VU monitoring reference. Straightforward and pretty common among visualizing tools. The aim is to outweigh steady state against transients. Therefore, it only applies to the VU instrument, not the peak meters.

Satin has a headroom control in the service panel which changes the available dynamic range for the circuits surrounding the tape. Using that in conjunction with the tape part - along with interaction of the entire system - is a more complex thing than just setting up a reference level.

[momalle3]

LOL

Here's another Satin vs VTM comparison. As mentioned, you can't really do it "scientifically" because the two plugs are very different in function. But it might be useful.

It's a reefer song from the 1930's, Killin' Jive. just a living room recording of my band, done on a Zoom R8. The Vocals and guitars are on the same mics, primitive

I mixed it using VTM and then again using Satin, getting both to where I thought they sounded good in the same way. For what it's worth.

To my ears they sound virtually identical in terms of the quality of the "tape effect," even if I tweaked them differently, and I'm confident I could get them to be indistinguishable.

http://chnm.gmu.edu/courses/magic/satin.mp3

http://chnm.gmu.edu/courses/magic/vtm.mp3

[penguinfromdeep]

Cool track. From those files I would say VTM has somehow fatter and smoother bottom end, also there is a bit more bass. Satin has more pronounced highs/high-mids. Both sound quite good in the end but there are obvious differences.

[momalle3]

Yes, there are, and that's what I hear as well. You could easily adjust Satin, though, to sound just like VTM--it's a matter of EQ/head bump/tape choice. I haven't sat down to try to do that, so maybe I'm wrong, but one of the things I like about Satin as opposed to Slate is the ability to vary the character a little more

[Ch00rD]

[...] Concerning this - and probably more demand for LoFi delays and such -, I'll try and see what the model is capable of at lower speed. Chances are it gets sort of out-of-specs. Satin is a pure text-book approach to magnetic recording, we implement things like they were on paper (using a few corrective factors nontheless). That said, I've never tested for 3.75 or even lower speeds. Pre-emphasis might be problematic, at least experimental. The typical 'studio' speeds are fine with the 18k shelving filter I was using, but the lower you go, the more you'll be off the ideal response. With the current implementation, my goal was to serve with equal freq. response at all speeds, at least at nominal input gain (-18 (vintage) and -12 (modern)).

I know there's a certain discrepancy between Lofi-tape afficionados and the higher-level studio unit I wanted initially. I felt I needed to nail the 'perfect' studio tape sound first, as this was a long-term dream still unfulfilled by me for almost 10 years after I started my first tape project with next to non-knowledge.

Conversely, chances are that "sort of out-of-specs", "problematic, at least experimental", and "off the ideal response" are exactly the sort of things that some of us would be aiming for with this 'tape machine construction kit'. If you experiment with how Satin behaves at e.g. lower tape speed, please don't dismiss 'poor results' too easily.

I'm more interested in adding such functionality into the main product than adding a lo-fi-only version, but I'd figure it could make a lot of sense. I imagine you could (relatively!) easily create a cheaper (or perhaps magware, cf. Tyrell N6 or ZebraCM) spin-off product such as a Space Echo / CopyCat / EchoPlex -ish lo-fi tape delay. I'm sure such a thing would appeal to lots of people.

But of course, you'd build the hi-fi version to ideal specs first, as you have done so brilliantly. That's 'versioning digital goods 101' (good article here). Much like you already do with the excellent demo versions.

[Ch00rD]

I have a FR (...you've probably already thought of this, but... ) :

It would be nice in the Delay mode if (a) modifier key(s) could be used to move all the same controls proportionately within the same group (ie.: delay sliders, Mod Rates, Mod Amts, Balance and Level).

Thanks for considering!

+1 for this excellent suggestion.

[Vectorman]

Don't have much to contribute, since unlike many other posters, I have almost no experience tracking with a good tape machine (I jumped right from 4-track cassette to computer-based recording in the early '90s). But I definitely like what Satin does, even just putting it on the master out, how it sort of thickens and solidifies the bottom end and makes it more satisfying. Definitely not a "snake oil" plugin - you bypass it and you can pretty readily tell that it was doing something positive for the overall sound.

[Urs]

The latest:

http://www.u-he.com/downloads/Satin/Satin1832Mac.zip
http://www.u-he.com/downloads/Satin/Satin1832Win.zip

Please check if crashes in Group Controller are gone, i.e. loading songs or templates with grouped Satins should work

Presets saved with locked Parameters should also be resurrected now and load just fine

With enough feedback we can still release today

Thanks,

- Urs

[Agility]

One other question, what is classed as a vintage tape machine date wise Are we talking 30s? 50s? 80s?

Thanks.

Bump, anyone?

Also, question about the Compander and Hiss.. I have the Uhx type 1 compander on mixed to about 40% and the hiss and asperity noise set to 0 but I'm getting noise that is pumping with my drums, ie when the kick/snare hit for example, the noise dips... but where is this noise coming from, is it part of the design?

Thanks.

LOVING IT!

[samplemania]

With enough feedback we can still release today

Thanks,

- Urs

Minor problem: Satin shows up as "instrument" in Vienna Ensemble Pro" on OSX.

[MyOpe]

I have a big problem with feedback in Delay mode :

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6VJG8H ... sp=sharing

It seems like the buffer gets all messed up. I am experiencing this in Reaper and FLStudio on DS/ASIO drivers and on any sample rate/buffer size.

[Urs]

I have a big problem with feedback in Delay mode :

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6VJG8H ... sp=sharing

It seems like the buffer gets all messed up. I am experiencing this in Reaper and FLStudio on DS/ASIO drivers and on any sample rate/buffer size.

What revision number is dispayed on the top right?