Waldorf Pulse 2: officially released (OS updated to v1.18)

[Goldenage2012]

No, the step increments from 0-127 are not linear at all, they are mapped differently (meaning that there is no fixed step difference between each increment of parameter value, things increase really fast in speed above value 64 or so). And this still has nothing to do with the resulting modulation of the LFO ("they don't sound as good in audio range" has absolutely nothing with the parameter range being 0-127, and increasing this range to 14-bit won't change that, you would only get finer increments - but the way LFO modulation is carried out wouldn't change at all).


Also I didn't say LFOs go to 1000 Hz, I said that parameter UPDATE RATE is 1000 Hz. That's different. If LFOs are done digitally, that would mean they go to up around 500 Hz. If they are pushed above that limit, then you get aliasing (Nyquist theorem). If LFOs are analog, though, there's no aliasing and they can go faster than that.

Ok great, thanks for clarifying but i still think that lower increments that even could be done hert by hert would be way better then as it stands now and the aliasing would be smother and more analog sounding.


I already stated that i like this synth a lot and would not be posting if i didn't care to see it doing great, but there are some things that need to be addressed and improvised for it to make it in such a competitive market.

Is it not suppose to be and sound analog? So if there are things that sound digital and can be improvised those things should be done.

Ingo already said they were talking about implementing 14 bit for some parameters, would be great to know how long is that going to take?
I guess a lot of people would like to know details on that, as everyone seems to really like the synth but we do want 14 bit midi!!


Best regards

[EvilDragon]

and the aliasing would be smother and more analog sounding.

Sorry, but this statement makes zero sense. Tells me you don't quite have an idea about what you're talking about.


Aliasing does NOT HAPPEN in an analog synth. It's a purely digital phenomenon.


Also, lower increments are already happening for low LFO frequency parameter values - they are under a Hertz for the lowest range of the control. The spacings in the increments are increased as the parameter value is increased - you don't need sub-Hertz precision when you go over 10 or 20 Hz, generally.

[Ingonator]

Edited

[Goldenage2012]

and the aliasing would be smother and more analog sounding.

Sorry, but this statement makes zero sense. Tells me you don't quite have an idea about what you're talking about.


Aliasing does NOT HAPPEN in an analog synth. It's a purely digital phenomenon.


Also, lower increments are already happening for low LFO frequency parameter values - they are under a Hertz for the lowest range of the control. The spacings in the increments are increased as the parameter value is increased - you don't need sub-Hertz precision when you go over 10 or 20 Hz, generally.

Quite a strong statement there my friend, you have no idea of what i know or even of what you think you may know i can guaranty you that

Ii meant FM modulated sounds, i thought i ve heard that expression for analog before but in a good way, sorry if i lost of my points of credibility with you.

But why we getting off topic? Whats your agenda? You think its bad to have 14 bit resolution?

First you start saying that they wont do it, then you just going against people who would like to see the 14 bit implementation.

All i know is what hear and what i feel, and for me this low resolution midi controls makes it sound less analog, there is stepping, the fm sucks, can't play the filter... sorry it that hurts your feelings.

Best regards

[Goldenage2012]

Ingo already said they were talking about implementing 14 bit for some parameters, would be great to know how long is that going to take?
I guess a lot of people would like to know details on that, as everyone seems to really like the synth but we do want 14 bit midi!!

They just started with the idea to implement it so how should anyone know how long it would take? It could be anywhere between a few days and some weeks...


Ingo

Thank you my friend, thats great to know.

Best regards

[Ingonator]

Edited

[chk071]

But why we getting off topic? Whats your agenda? You think its bad to have 14 bit resolution?

First you start saying that they wont do it, then you just going against people who would like to see the 14 bit implementation.

All i know is what hear and what i feel, and for me this low resolution midi controls makes it sound less analog, there is stepping, the fm sucks, can't play the filter... sorry it that hurts your feelings.

I guess the point was that the term "aliasing" is already being used in another way. That said, calling the filter stepping aliasing actually isn't wrong either i believe: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aliasing It's just that it can cause quite a confusion, when the term is already reserved for something else.

[Goldenage2012]

Ingo already said they were talking about implementing 14 bit for some parameters, would be great to know how long is that going to take?
I guess a lot of people would like to know details on that, as everyone seems to really like the synth but we do want 14 bit midi!!

They just started with the idea to implement it so how should anyone know how long it would take? It could be anywhere between a few days and some weeks...


Ingo

Thank you my friend, thats great to know.

Best regards

14-bit data also has to be stored with the patches somehow. There are multiple ways to implement this which is currently discussed.

Those discussions are hypothetical until the first beta OS with the implementation is published for testing. Theoretically it is possible that the whole OS could ge totally unstable. Let's wait and see.


Ingo

Sounds great, lets keep our fingers crossed

[Ingonator]

i need MIDI patch dump to work via USB, as it did in v1.11 !!!

Could you explain this further? Sending Sysex files seems to work nicely here with OS 1.13 (including sending a full dump with a Sysex Software like e.g. SendSX).

About a Problem with USB and the Editor from Synnys you could check my last post.

Would be nice to know more about that problem concerning MIDI patch dump via USB.

Could anyone confirm such problem with OS 1.13?

If there is a problem concerning the Synnys Pulse 2 editor plugin i already posted a solution at my long post at the previous page (the Standalone editor for me worked without problems anyway). As already mentioned also sending bulk dumps or single dumps to a Sysex software like e.g. SendSX works here.


Ingo

[EvilDragon]

Quite a strong statement there my friend, you have no idea of what i know or even of what you think you may know i can guaranty you that

Your statements gave me enough info to deduce that you don't quite know how to use the correct terminology to describe what you want to describe.

First you start saying that they wont do it, then you just going against people who would like to see the 14 bit implementation.

I "don't go against people wanting 14-bit MIDI". 14-bit MIDI is cool, I have nothing against that. What I have against is nonsensical statements like "smoother and more analog sounding aliasing", which seriously hurts my brain.

All i know is what hear and what i feel, and for me this low resolution midi controls makes it sound less analog, there is stepping, the fm sucks, can't play the filter... sorry it that hurts your feelings.

Even early digitally controlled analog synths had stepping. Did they sound "less analog"? No, they didn't. They just had stepping.

The way FM sounds has absolutely nothing with the resolution of parameters, and the resolution of parameters doesn't make things sound "less analog". Hell, I remember even Prophet 5 had stepping on the cutoff knob when you bump up the resonance, and that's one of holy grail analog synths!


So, you can tell what you feel, but don't use wrong terminology or nonsensical statements to do so. It doesn't hurt my feelings, it hurts my brain.

That said, calling the filter stepping aliasing actually isn't wrong either i believe: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aliasing It's just that it can cause quite a confusion, when the term is already reserved for something else.

Stepping is stepping, aliasing is aliasing. One is not the other, at all. Why? Because aliasing happens when you sample something from continuous plane (real world) into discrete plane (zeroes and ones), and Nyquist theorem applies. A certain parameter having limited range (say, 0-127) doesn't have anything to sample from real world into zeroes and ones (it's already zeroes and ones, things being digitally controlled), Nyquist theorem doesn't apply, it JUST has a limited range that's mapped out to a number of real-world values. That is not aliasing.

[Kriminal]

Stepping sounds bad, aliasing sounds bad. Nobody wants that....

[EvilDragon]

Hehe, that's true. Well, aliasing can be used in creative purposes. Stepping... perhaps, but it's not as "sexy"?

[Kriminal]

Hehe, that's true. Well, aliasing can be used in creative purposes. Stepping... perhaps, but it's not as "sexy"?

Hot steppin maybe....

[Goldenage2012]

Whatever makes u happy,

I know i have put my point across for who is interested and so have other people,.

Don't assume that people are just asking for things they don't understand, if you want you can keep your 7 bit pulse after they updated if they ever do it.

Your the one who mention aliasing in the first place, when i was talking about an lfo and fm synthesis on the pulse.
I said would be nice to get the rate in hertz, not like a priority just as a nice touch to add, because you see no use of that, don't assume everyone is the same way.
You know what i meant but prefers to discredit and make it seem nonsense, take the awards my friend, i have no ego issues.

If u have to make arguments of everything and prove people wrong with your 100 years of chat room experience, I am glad i can make someone happy while here who seems lonely and in need for a girlfriend.
and yes some modulation, especially slow modulations on this synth makes it sound a bit digital but again, that has nothing to do with the low resolution midi you say!

Dude, just be a man and stay with 7 bit forever since your so happy and loving the stepping!

[namnibor]

Hehe, that's true. Well, aliasing can be used in creative purposes. Stepping... perhaps, but it's not as "sexy"?

Yes! Take the PPG through to the Waldorf XT for example; aliasing can be quite a cool and desirable 'artifact' that contributes to the sound design. The higher octaves of the Virus on the other hand, can have some unwanted aliasing but that also can be highly dependent on various mod routing factors and whether using the 'Spectral Waves' or normal osc waveforms and how many one is using that may be contributing to 'phase issues'.

Yes, stepping can be crap-tastic. Some synths only DO NOT do not step when one is performing say a filter sweep with an LFO or even an envelope such as Roland SH-32 as an example stuck in brain.

Seems more important to look at ALL sound producing tools/instruments as a potter treats a lump of quality clay--all of the universe's creative potential lay in that formless lump of clay, and like the potter, we have to craft and sculpt that sound source into something special, even remembering/learning to exploit some of the inherent imperfections to our advantage in making that sound our own rather than yet another preset someone else made.

Hopefully, the holiday am taking in few weeks, will drive a bit further North to Sweetwater and spend some quality time with this Pulse 2 and I fully plan to bring my Classic Pulse+ WITH ME because want to have a studio test set-up of exploiting the cv/gate out of Pulse 2. Not sure if I will bother bringing video camera this time around as this is more cerebral than informative for the masses.
Waldorf is back and can also say with a vengeance...you HAVE to try iOS App Waldorf Nave! An iPad 2 and cost of App is still well less than 1/2 cost of new pulse 2 and am treating it just like another hardware synth...and note that I am NOT a VSTi or softsynth anything person--all hardware. Nave is out of this world and has an ingenious GUI...I know someone on the Waldorfian List that actually sold their Wave and replaced it with Nave...THAT says everything!