u-he

HiEnergy · Post by **HiEnergy** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 2:22 am

SJ_Digriz wrote:yeah, I'd ditch all those other formats and just stick with VST3 on Windows.

Bad idea!
How many DAWs support VST3? Perhaps 3 or 4...
Now compare that to VST2...

Urs, please keep developing for VST2.

SJ_Digriz · Post by **SJ_Digriz** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 3:30 am

HiEnergy wrote:
SJ_Digriz wrote:yeah, I'd ditch all those other formats and just stick with VST3 on Windows.
Bad idea!
How many DAWs support VST3? Perhaps 3 or 4...
Now compare that to VST2...

Urs, please keep developing for VST2.

It was sarcasm to point out that eliminating any option is going to piss off someone.

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:48 am

Well, we've supported multiple formats on Mac for years, without any problem. It's the specifics of the VST3 design that make it difficult to support for us.

DrGonzo · Post by **DrGonzo** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:01 am

Urs wrote:Well, we've supported multiple formats on Mac for years, without any problem. It's the specifics of the VST3 design that make it difficult to support for us.

Since its release I've watched most developers going bananas over VST3. One would have expected that Steinberg would have listened to the developers by now and implementation would go smoother. I really really know nothing about coding, but I get the impression that the new AAX format isn't equally problematic.

/C

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:14 am

DrGonzo wrote:Since its release I've watched most developers going bananas over VST3. One would have expected that Steinberg would have listened to the developers by now and implementation would go smoother.

Well, to their defense, they did. That "simplified VST3" thing they added just omitts the separation of UI and DSP. This should do, but I haven't yet tried it.

I really really know nothing about coding, but I get the impression that the new AAX format isn't equally problematic.

As far as we can tell, it's a bliss. There'll surely be a few issues that we're not aware of but nothing hints at a show stopper.

The only major downside is the PACE signing requirement.

geronimo · Post by **geronimo** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:52 pm

Sorry if I missed a step .

But ultimately, there will be one sequencer inside this new version of DIVA: because it was mentioned at the beginning ...?

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:59 pm

geronimo wrote:Sorry if I missed a step .

But ultimately, there will be one sequencer inside this new version of DIVA: because it was mentioned at the beginning ...?

Ooops yeah, you missed it, sorry

The sequencer was ultimately too complicated. Betatesters loved and hated it, many of them for different reasons - respectively. Some wanted it to move this way, some wanted it that way. Similar fights were fought among my otherwise well behaved employees.

After five or six months of arguments and nerve wrecking I simply had to pull the plug, for sake of mental sanity.

That doesn't mean it isn't going to happen, it just means that we need to go a step back and start with a little more realistic plan. The sequencer in Arturia's Microbrute for instance looks like an ideal concpet to start with and build upon.

geronimo · Post by **geronimo** » Sat Dec 07, 2013 11:36 pm

And I was looking for this menu sequence found in each new version !

It may well be better _

DrGonzo · Post by **DrGonzo** » Sun Dec 08, 2013 7:19 am

Urs wrote: Ooops yeah, you missed it, sorry

The sequencer was ultimately too complicated. Betatesters loved and hated it, many of them for different reasons - respectively. Some wanted it to move this way, some wanted it that way. Similar fights were fought among my otherwise well behaved employees.

After five or six months of arguments and nerve wrecking I simply had to pull the plug, for sake of mental sanity.

That doesn't mean it isn't going to happen, it just means that we need to go a step back and start with a little more realistic plan. The sequencer in Arturia's Microbrute for instance looks like an ideal concpet to start with and build upon.

Have you seen the step sequencer in Sylenth1? If not - do take a look at it. It might inspire you. It's very simple - but I'm always amazed on how useful it is. Another concept that is worth taking a look at is the way Elektron does it with their so called Parameter Locks - which is absolutely damn brilliant.

/C

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Sun Dec 08, 2013 7:57 am

Parameter locks are already implemented, both in Diva and Zeebs. Right click any knob

DrGonzo · Post by **DrGonzo** » Sun Dec 08, 2013 8:03 am

EvilDragon wrote:Parameter locks are already implemented, both in Diva and Zeebs. Right click any knob

I know that

I meant in conjunction with a step sequencer. Every step on the sequencer can control any number of parameters.

/C

pdxindy · Post by **pdxindy** » Sun Dec 08, 2013 10:02 am

DrGonzo wrote:
Urs wrote: Ooops yeah, you missed it, sorry

The sequencer was ultimately too complicated. Betatesters loved and hated it, many of them for different reasons - respectively. Some wanted it to move this way, some wanted it that way. Similar fights were fought among my otherwise well behaved employees.

After five or six months of arguments and nerve wrecking I simply had to pull the plug, for sake of mental sanity.

That doesn't mean it isn't going to happen, it just means that we need to go a step back and start with a little more realistic plan. The sequencer in Arturia's Microbrute for instance looks like an ideal concpet to start with and build upon.
Have you seen the step sequencer in Sylenth1? If not - do take a look at it. It might inspire you. It's very simple - but I'm always amazed on how useful it is. Another concept that is worth taking a look at is the way Elektron does it with their so called Parameter Locks - which is absolutely damn brilliant.

/C

The step sequencer in Sylenth is out of date... I mean it works well and makes interesting sequences with transpose, velocity and tie control. But it is still making users go in with a mouse and tweak 48 tiny individual step controls split into two pages. There is nothing hands-on or realtime or particularly fun about it.

The Elektron A4 on the other hand is brilliant. So playable and performance oriented. The parameter lock with the ability to even load a preset per step and be so instantaneous, fast and intuitive is where we should be heading.

I already have something like a dozen step sequencers similar to the one in Sylenth. I see little reason to be using them anymore. They are so clunky and tediously mouse driven. With the parameter lock function in my Push sequencer (which is still a far cry from the Elektron), I can make sequences with step automation of soft synth parameters faster and more intuitively than any of the sequencers in the soft synths themselves.

More and more people have Maschine, Push, iPads and so on. Hands-on, realtime, performance oriented, expressive and playable is the future. If you are going to put some sequencing in a synth, then try to capture some of the fun of the Elektron... do something fresh and fun...

my 2 cents

Urs · Post by **Urs** » Sun Dec 08, 2013 10:35 am

It's been a long debate here about sequencing concepts. We'll start over next year.

u-he

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