Bitwig

nbless · Post by **nbless** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:05 pm

ok here is the thing. I absolutely hate LIVE pdc ! I use LIVE since version 2 and was interested in bitwig.. but this is unbelievable:

I put:

1 sylenth playing one sustain
8 fabfilter pro-mb doing absolutely nothing with 4x oversampling (in order to add plugin latency)
1 volume shaper making a 1/4 sidechain effect

pdc1.jpg

then BOUNCE pre-fader

this is the result

pdc2.jpg

The PDC is completely wrong

then I just moved the volume shaper so I have

1 sylenth
1 volume shaper
8 fabfilter pro-mb

then BOUNCE pre-fader
here is the result

pdc3.jpg

this time, the PDC works.
Normally, both waveforms should be exactly the same : (

This is exactly the same problem as ABLETON LIVE. Logic doesn't have this bug.
I think bitwig is really good for a lot of reasons, but this PDC problem is horrible

virtualmark · Post by **virtualmark** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:10 pm

Are you sure it's the PDC? It could be a problem with volumeshaper, maybe you should try it with automation?

I too have found that the PDC isn't right, and have emailed them. For me, the audio stays in time, but the display goes way out of sync. Which is far from ideal!

This really is a deal breaker for me if they haven't sorted this shit out yet.

nbless · Post by **nbless** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:16 pm

VolumeShaper doesn't have this bug with Logic for example. Bitwig has a better pdc than Live, but it's not right all the time.

virtualmark · Post by **virtualmark** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:21 pm

FFS! You're right, it's no better. What a joke! I just tried it, it works fine when you add latency inducing plugins after the effect. But when you put them before, the automation goes out of time!

And the display is miles out of sync, the audio carries on when the display has stopped. FFS all this waiting, and this DAW doesn't have PDC. Not impressed.

Mushy Mushy · Post by **Mushy Mushy** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:57 pm

This was the thing most were waiting for too.
Apologies in advance while I let out a sadistic laugh.

Surely it's ok. It would have been mentioned previously.

ZenPunkHippy · Post by **ZenPunkHippy** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:59 pm

Try changing the PDC setting on the Options menu.

Re-run your tests.

Different, no?

PDC works, I think the problem is the option being ticked when it's disabled.

The Mantra · Post by **The Mantra** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:05 pm

ZenPunkHippy wrote:Try changing the PDC setting on the Options menu.

Re-run your tests.

Different, no?

PDC works, I think the problem is the option being ticked when it's disabled.

I eagerly await the OPs results.
I remember a beta tester conducting similar test and also posting picks showing good PDC so this is confusing.

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:14 pm

^That's true, kennyda did those tests but I don't remember if it was the exact same thing. I'm really hoping there is some explanation for this.

virtualmark · Post by **virtualmark** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:18 pm

ZenPunkHippy wrote:PDC works, I think the problem is the option being ticked when it's disabled.

So you recommend taking the tick out? I'll try it..

virtualmark · Post by **virtualmark** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:22 pm

No, it still goes miles out, the tick doesn't even seem to do anything.

ZenPunkHippy · Post by **ZenPunkHippy** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:24 pm

I found that with the tick on, animation of the song position did not match the automation curve. When the tick is off, the animation and automation line up OK.

Not sure about bounce. It does look like their might be a bug, but I can't tell without more testing.

If there is a problem, the big difference between this and Live is that you can report a bug and Bitwig will fix it.

Peace,
Andy.

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:25 pm

But isn't the assumption that Live is reluctant to fix their PDC because it would take a massive rewrite? Hope something like that isn't at play here.

virtualmark · Post by **virtualmark** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:26 pm

The audio is out of time on mine, with the tick on or off. I automated a filter over a drum loop, so that it only opens up on the snares. So it's easy to hear it go out of sync. I then put a high latency eq after the filter, no problem. I then moved it in front, and the audio goes out of time.

With the eq in front or behind, either way the display goes out of sync when the latency gets high.

3ee · Post by **3ee** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:29 pm

I did some PDC tests while in beta and worked like it should.
Tested with some Waves and Ozone5.

Maybe the problem might be with the plugin latency reporting to host?
Try with different plugins that don't have dynamic latency and see if it goes well.. if yes, I guess than we know where the problem is.

3ee · Post by **3ee** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 11:34 pm

another thing.... I tested "live" while playback with parallel tracks and it worked perfectly.
PDC may be working well in playback, but once exporting might not. ...

...or might be working but it will simply introduce some delay at the beginning only after bounce.

So, which is it?

Bitwig

KVR Audio

Bitwig PDC... exactly same problem as LIVE!!