2CAudio Kaleidoscope | It's A Trip | Latest Update 1.1

[ThomasHelzle]

I really wanted to like it - but I don't.

- CPU was not a problem here, 6 core i7 @4.1 GHz, 32 GB RAM, in Bitwig Studio, DSP at ~5 %... Buffer at 128.

- Am I missing something or is there no way to do anything worthwhile to the images _inside_ of KS? Am I really supposed to create images in another software, check how they sound, rinse and repeat?

- Many of the GUI elements are extremely tiny/unclear while the image area is very large. But since I seem unable to do anything with the image I'm unsure why that is?

- I really liked about 5 of the sounds in the demo library, but overall it sounded extremely same-same to me. I didn't feel as if I could do much with the plugin (and I'm normally a sucker for physical modelling and resonators etc.).

- What I really missed is something like Harmor where a sound can become an image, the image can be treated, then become a sound again...

And yes, I scanned over the docs to see if I miss anything major (which is still totally possible of course ).
It seems the devs fascination with his own work took over there...

BTW. Some of the graphics in the docs are are total eyesore and gave me a severe headache (Page 31 - you can't be serious...).

I'm sure it's amazing tech but the plugin left my inner artist angry and annoyed after some hours.
The demo limitation didn't help, like somebody else before, the "losing everything you may have done after 30 minutes" is pretty much killing it IMO.

And, well, the price doesn't really help it either.

Sorry for the non-positive feedback.

Cheers,

Tom

[Andrew Souter]

please god don't make us make KS for iOS! I really don't want to be able to do sound-design and iFart from the same place....

that said iOS could have its uses.

[synzh]

Thanks for the info! Wholeheartedly agree, it's not really a science to create sounds exactly to specification with this sort of thing. I realize it's not easy coming up with those sorts of images, however, there is some sort of "sweet spot" that you can kind of look at an image and get an impression of whether it might have value musically or not; in any case, all I'm looking for is a tool that would help create such types of images. With more and more image-based VSTs in the field (not that many yet but KS adds 1!), it would seem that ideally there should also be another app *somewhere* to assist in making these at least somewhat "musical-themed images". As mentioned I've looked into moire images and such, even 3d mathematical curve modelling tools with iso-lines, converted to 2D might be one avenue to explore (there are several nice such free progs apparently by the likes of graduate students as projects such as K3DSurf, Xaos (fractal images), 3D-XplorMath-J).
All I'm really asking, is for some effort into helping put graphical creation tools into the hands of the end-users of these plugins.
Could even be a simple graphic editor maybe even part of the product, with curves and brightness controls, you know something like that.
To put the power in the hands of the user to explore and experience the magic of their discoveries, like you did in creating the preset images.

[Gribs]

I am up and running with the demo in Cubase 7.5 (have not yet upgraded). I did not change any buffer sizes and I am not having any problems with dropouts or anything. I use an RME Fireface 800 and normally have the buffer set at 256 samples. I run Windows 7 on a couple-years old home-built PC and my Firewire port is tied straight to one of the 1394 pinouts on my ASUS MB so maybe that is one of the pluses. Doing that with USB also seems to help with USB devices (eg Virus TI2).

So, wow I just dropped an old recording of my modular synth burbling away rhythmically onto a track and and I am pleased and impressed by all the weird sounds that come out the other side of the factory presets. A drone recording also produced some... well just incredibly cool sounds. I have been turning the white noise down to zero and also turning up the input sound a bit to compare. My initial thinking is that I would use this as an effect to take modular stuff down new paths. Kaleidoscope is eating about 25% to 37% of my CPU depending on the preset, again with no alteration of the buffer sizes (yet).

I saw someone else posting that they thought all the sounds were samey, but I noticed that the sounds I am getting sound nothing like any of the sounds on the web site or the sounds that Simon posted. This is a good thing.

Are there any plans for other resonator models like plates or bars?

I really do hope that profit sharing check comes before March 1

[aMUSEd]

If I buy Architecture too will it also work in Metasynth?

AV01 KS will NOT work with Metasynth.

The original AV1 will of course.

I can make some kind of small "add another format" charge, like I have for Architecture Waveforms. Let's say $25 for AV1 if you want both AV1 for KS and AV1 for MS. You can do that after the fact. Does not need to be in the same purchase if you like.

OK I'm just trying to work out how to do this.

[selvmarcus]

Ok. Still, it's only one half of a tool. The other part is Iris or the Spectral image editing in Alchemy. I would prefer to have the basic technology as part of a modular system. This calls for algorithmic exploration to tame the beast.

[rustman]

I'll admit to not having read a word of the manual ...yet, but I noticed that it appears to restart from the left of the picture if your DAW transport is set to loop playback and the loop section restarts. I'm thinking it prudent to turn looping off so that the sound can evolve over long periods. Just riffing off the top of my head...

[Andrew Souter]

Are there any plans for other resonator models like plates or bars?

maybe

[mandolarian]

please god don't make us make KS for iOS! I really don't want to be able to do sound-design and iFart from the same place....

that said iOS could have its uses.

Apple is buying you out!!!

[Andrew Souter]

I'll admit to not having read a word of the manual ...yet, but I noticed that it appears to restart from the left of the picture if your DAW transport is set to loop playback and the loop section restarts. I'm thinking it prudent to turn looping off so that the sound can evolve over long periods. Just riffing off the top of my head...

And I ausmme your loop locators are 1:1:000 and something else? so the loop restarts at 1:1:000 every time?


Then YES! Absolutely. This is perfectly desirable behavior. This is the Phase Lock "To Host" application. This keeps the phase of the modulation synched properly to musical time of the host project. This is HIGHLY desired for musical uses.

Consider you make a textural pattern that has some weird timing info. Let's say you have a "verse" that is 32 measures. Let's say it's for Bjork so you want something weird. So you set timings to be 32/15 and 32/7. But musically you have a chord progression that is 8 measures long (so it repeats 4 times within this 32 measure verse).

If you want the timing stuff to continue seamlessly, but you have to follow the chord changes, you need to export each different chord.

But if you were to render measures 7-8 without Phase-Lock to host, your timing would be reset every time you exported regardless of where in the timeline you exported from. If you are using "To Host" the timeline would be in the proper location regardless of where you exported from. so you could export different chords as sections and maybe include a little pre and post section like a beat or a bar for crossfades...


In other words, if you have drummer who plays perfectly in time at 128bpm, but is a 32nd note late all the time, he is not going to be very popular with the rest of the band. Tempo synch is only have the battle. Phase lock is the other.

So yes, if playback is in a loop and restarts at some point KS timeline will jump back to whatever point it should be at to maintain phase lock.

[Andrew Souter]

please god don't make us make KS for iOS! I really don't want to be able to do sound-design and iFart from the same place....

that said iOS could have its uses.

Apple is buying you out!!!

actually I thought I was replying to myself, but apparently I was editing...

maybe it is time for sleep.

I will only let Apple buy us if they promise to make a dual socket Mac Pro. I want a 36 core mac pro!! It should be possible today already.

And I want a large format 5K display. Like 40-50"... with dual inputs....

[mandolarian]

Careful what you wish for...

[rustman]

I'll admit to not having read a word of the manual ...yet, but I noticed that it appears to restart from the left of the picture if your DAW transport is set to loop playback and the loop section restarts. I'm thinking it prudent to turn looping off so that the sound can evolve over long periods. Just riffing off the top of my head...

And I ausmme your loop locators are 1:1:000 and something else? so the loop restarts at 1:1:000 every time?


Then YES! Absolutely. This is perfectly desirable behavior. This is the Phase Lock "To Host" application. This keeps the phase of the modulation synched properly to musical time of the host project. This is HIGHLY desired for musical uses.

Consider you make a textural pattern that has some weird timing info. Let's say you have a "verse" that is 32 measures. Let's say it's for Bjork so you want something weird. So you set timings to be 32/15 and 32/7. But musically you have a chord progression that is 8 measures long (so it repeats 4 times within this 32 measure verse).

If you want the timing stuff to continue seamlessly, but you have to follow the chord changes, you need to export each different chord.

But if you were to render measures 7-8 without Phase-Lock to host, your timing would be reset every time you exported regardless of where in the timeline you exported from. If you are using "To Host" the timeline would be in the proper location regardless of where you exported from. so you could export different chords as sections and maybe include a little pre and post section like a beat or a bar for crossfades...


In other words, if you have drummer who plays perfectly in time at 128bpm, but is a 32nd note late all the time, he is not going to be very popular with the rest of the band. Tempo synch is only have the battle. Phase lock is the other.

So yes, if playback is in a loop and restarts at some point KS timeline will jump back to whatever point it should be at to maintain phase lock.

Remarkably:
1. I understood that.
2. My observation was correct.

Thanks for taking time to clarify. I promise to read and absorb the manual...

[Andrew Souter]

Remarkably:
1. I understood that.

Does that mean I have a proclivity for being obtuse or excessively verbose or pedantic in my explanations?

2. My observation was correct.

Thanks for taking time to clarify. I promise to read and absorb the manual...

no prob.

[rustman]

You wax poetic Andrew, and I find that completely suitable among we creative/geek types. Seriously, any over-simplified, dumbed-down explanations would be less satisfying. I'd always rather you go over my head and make me think rather than the alternative. I doubt I'm alone in this crowd.