sidechain compression and racks

Discussion about: tracktion.com
Post Reply New Topic
RELATED
PRODUCTS

Post

I've had a love/hate relationship with racks since forever. Today is no different. After working through a tutorial on setting up the new side chain compression, I had good results and felt like I understood what was going on. That was with one 'performance' track receiving a key from 1 trigger (kick drum in this case) track.

All's well and good until I decide that it would be nice for the compression to affect more than 1 track. Simply copying another instance of the rack already in use seemed like a place to start, but that doesn't work because (insert explanation from someone who actually understands racks here).

My next attempt involved bussing multiple tracks to one output track and then putting the output rack there.

(insert ear-shredding feedback here as I fumble to kill Tracktion as quickly as humanly possible to make it stop)

This leads to 2 requests/suggestions:

1. Almost every time I try to 'go deep' with racks and understand them and do potentially useful things with them, I get a wire crossed somewhere and get feedback. Thankfully I'm on headphones most of the time, so I haven't damaged a nice pair of speakers yet, but it's a real annoyance. Is there some way you can detect this before it happens and have Tracktion put up a red flag instead of a piercing wail?

2. The sidechain compressor would be really sweet if we didn't have to use racks. You could do that magic behind the scenes and just give it a little drop down menu where we choose the track to trigger from. We could put the compressor on whatever tracks we want and key from the same source or different ones, without having to 'think in 4 dimensions' and stitch it all together somehow using racks.

I'm going through the original rack tutorial that is hosted on the tracktion site right now and it's enlightening, but I can't shake the feeling that it's never going to be something I'm going to be comfortable with. Maybe there's some way in which you can dumb it down a bit for people like me, but still leave all the options available under the hood for those who get it. Maybe some sort of 'rack wizard' that starts with some ball park options of what I'm trying to do and then guides me accordingly with a template. Or maybe start with some different assumptions. Almost everyone who creates a rack for the first time thinks that they've created a standalone entity which can then be instantiated as many times as desired with each one acting as a self-contained filter/instrument unto itself. Why not have that be the default state, and let the 'every instance is actually the same rack' weirdness be an advanced option for those who want to go further. Rack Lite(TM) or something. ;)

If nothing else, please give the fumblers like me the option to trap and flag the feedback!

Clearly a lot of folks work wonders with these things. Even with the tutorials, I almost always get zapped the moment I try to 'leave the reservation'. It's never clear to me why it happens and the result is the habit of pretending that racks don't exist and that I will never need them. Am I the only one who still doesn't get it?

Thanks for letting me vent a bit. :help: :)
Music is something you DO. Spend time, not money.
http://www.myspace.com/skipkent
http://soundcloud.com/skipkent

Post

skipkent wrote: ... The sidechain compressor would be really sweet if we didn't have to use racks. You could do that magic behind the scenes and just give it a little drop down menu where we choose the track to trigger from. We could put the compressor on whatever tracks we want and key from the same source or different ones, without having to 'think in 4 dimensions' and stitch it all together somehow using racks.
This is an excellent idea.

I agree that racks can be tricky. I produced an entire series on them for Groove 3 and I still get unexpected results without a lot of experimentation.

Post

It is actually not that difficult at all. First watch Bill's excellent video on the sidechain compressor.

Then when you have a sidechain comp rack set up do the following. Select the tracks you want to apply the compression on and choose 'create submix containing'. Then place the rack on the submix output. So you only need one rack and there is not supposed to be any feedback this way. Works absolutely fine here.

Another thing to remember about racks! When you double the instance (without changing the outputs) then you have simply doubled your signal which could easily lead to distortion.

Post

I seemed to get this working without using submixes. I just copied the rack to other tracks like you said. Did you know that the ducker and the duckee racks are different? You need to copy the one that is fully wet and is not going to the sidechain input. The one that is going to the sidechain input (the dry one) should have the other input at 'none' in my opinion, which the auto sidechain setup doesn't do.

One weird thing I just noticed is that I don't have access to the sidechain input manually anymore in the properties menu. I can only set it up with the new auto sidechain feature, I wonder if I'm crazy or if that's new to 6.1

Hope that makes sense, I can explain how I set it up in more detail if not.

Post

Thanks for the tips. @frankvg: the process you outline is exactly what I *thought* I did, but clearly I went astray somewhere.

If they could block the feedback alone, I'd be a lot happier to experiment with racks. As it is, I'll go over the existing tutorials a lot more closely. I did get excellent results breaking out an instance of EZDrummer to it's various components for submixing. I learned about the 'solo isolate' option which solved a problem I had with doing this in the past which is great.

I did run into a problem when I put the whole thing into a sub mix, as I was then no longer able to solo the individual channels. Weirdness ensued and there's definitely a bug there that I will try to write up a procedure for in another post. I was able to mute tracks, however, to get the same result.
Music is something you DO. Spend time, not money.
http://www.myspace.com/skipkent
http://soundcloud.com/skipkent

Post

skipkent wrote: I did run into a problem when I put the whole thing into a sub mix, as I was then no longer able to solo the individual channels. Weirdness ensued and there's definitely a bug there that I will try to write up a procedure for in another post. I was able to mute tracks, however, to get the same result.
Strangely enough I was about to start a new thread about this exact thing. I recently tried setting up submixes on a huge mix, but was disappointed to find out that I couldn't solo tracks, so I had to do something else. I didn't really dive too deep into yet though to see if I'm missing something.

Post

Kang wrote:but was disappointed to find out that I couldn't solo tracks
Seems to work fine here. Can you describe what is going wrong?

Post

I think soloing tracks inside a submix was a bug that has now been fixed. It will be in the next public release (6.1.4)

Post

THREE THUMBS UP FOR BUG FIXES!

:tu: :) :tu:
Music is something you DO. Spend time, not money.
http://www.myspace.com/skipkent
http://soundcloud.com/skipkent

Post

As an aside one Reaper feature that I have always liked is that if the master channel receives audio greater than a certain db figure (I cant remember exactly), it automatically mutes the master.

You can experiment with wacky routings knowing that you wont fry your speakers and ears

Cheers
Jed

Post Reply

Return to “Tracktion”