MuTools

Taron · Post by **Taron** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 5:47 pm

I think, it's the Gate in the Effects MUX!

MuTools · Post by **MuTools** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 8:39 pm

Taron wrote:Hmmmm...that brings up a different point, in case interfaces could get a little heavy. I wonder, if there could be a tab system ...ok, that was too much, sorry about that.

Yep had the same idea, it's on the wishlist for a next evolution in the front panel sys. It should be possible by building upon the new M6.5 front panel architecture, so we're ok future-wise. I'm confident that the M6.5 front panel sys is a nice step forward. Soon (after the M6.5 release) it's time to also work on other mu aspects.

dakkra · Post by **dakkra** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:03 pm

Nah nah. It's fine. The gate has rounded corners et al.. so it's clean! It's just my computer maxing out its' resources by running both the video capture software and a complex patch (plus my master limiter). The video software was capturing two screens (in 4 different parts) and my webcam so it's doing some heavy work.

It's my machine, not MUX

Sorry for the confusion,

Dakkra

MuTools · Post by **MuTools** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:48 pm

New MuLab 6.5.18 test version in http://www.mutools.com/forsythia

Latest changes:

Fixed a potential crash bug when opening the multi-sample editor for the first time or when deleting multi-sample zones.
Fixed a bug when deleting tracks with sub-tracks.
Added protection against loading projects that contain invalid ghost parts as a result of the previously mentioned fixed bug.
Tracks can now have different heights. Resize tracks by dragging their bottom border.
The relative individual track heights are preserved while zooming in and out or calling vertical overview.
Collapsed tracks are always shown, be it very minimal. This avoids confusing situations that could occur with the previous behaviour of fully hidden sub-tracks.
Further finetuned layout of the sample player module and multisample editor.
Single click in sample display did not clear selection. Fixed.

How to upgrade from MuLab 6.5.x:
OSX: Simply replace the MuLab.app by the new version.
Windows: Simply replace the MuLab.exe + MuLab.ID files by the new versions.

How to upgrade from earlier versions eg M6.4: Make a full new install from the M6.5.7 package cfr the info on
http://www.mutools.com/info/docs/mulab/ ... ation.html
Then apply the new M6.5.8 app patch.

Taron · Post by **Taron** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:49 pm

Eh...I've been trying your patch on my machine, which is pretty powerful, and I noticed some clicking if you kept holding the note until the sound is gone. Then I isolated everything to have just one oscillator, one filter and one amplifier in the polysynth. The clicks were still present after I took the lowpass filter to its lowest value. Then I went into the effects section and immediately saw the gate. I deactivated it and all clicks were gone.

So...I could well be totally wrong, but I can assure, I'm most certainly silly!

Attached is the simplified example!

Taron · Post by **Taron** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:51 pm

WAAAHHHH! I LOVE THE TRACK HEIGHT THING!

runaudio · Post by **runaudio** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 10:01 pm

yeah great job jo

MuTools · Post by **MuTools** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 10:08 pm

Thx. It was not planned to do the individual track heights feature now, although it was on the wishlist for a long time. But it was triggered now by researching that bug bibz1st reported, and the solution for it brought me to do this now. Pls continue testing all the new goodies! That surely helps in keeping a good r&d pace. Thx!

Taron, thx a lot for the isolated click patch. I'll research it.

AndreasD · Post by **AndreasD** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 10:10 pm

Taron wrote: So...I could well be totally wrong, but I can assure, I'm most certainly silly!

That might well be, but you are certainly right about the subject

. You don't do attack times of 0! You can do that with sine waves to get a nice organ key click, but nowhere else.

So, use e.g. exponential curves with high intensity setting, like 15 or 20, instead.
Edit: Example the factory multipoint envelopes like 1 bar 16th (Amp)

Taron · Post by **Taron** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 10:20 pm

I would never dream of doing that!

This is a copy of the gate in dakkra's patch up there.

The polysynth didn't need any envelope and it wasn't about any click it would produce during start or stop. It just provides a constant signal to show clicks from the gate.

AndreasD · Post by **AndreasD** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 10:59 pm

OK, my bad looking at the wrong envelope.
But check the attached further reduced patch.
No input is necessary there is a test sine generator running. The envelope is still yours. Just look at the oscilloscope and you see that the slopes are still too fast. You still get frequencies that are higher than the source and those are clicks.

My 2c.

Edit: I just loaded the patch into a fresh system. You need to send a note to get things going. And the oscilloscope does not remember Display Update Factor. Please set this in the 30s.

Taron · Post by **Taron** » Sat Jun 27, 2015 11:33 pm

Just to clarify, none of this is my thing, you know, it's Jo, who noticed clicks in dakkra's patch and wondered where they might come from. I just felt like helping out to isolate what those were. I had and have no intention of fixing them, hehe... at least that wasn't the plan. Thanks for going at it, though. I'm sure it'll be appreciated!

sl23 · Post by **sl23** » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:30 pm

AndreasD wrote:You don't do attack times of 0! You can do that with sine waves to get a nice organ key click, but nowhere else.

Why is that? is it a software thing? I've never had a piece of hardware that says don't do that!

dakkra · Post by **dakkra** » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:53 pm

Because analog hardware actually can't do attack times of 0 and the digital stuff, knowing that extremely low attack times cause pops and crackles (due to changing a waveform before cycle completion) made it so you could have low attack, but not low enough to cause an interruption of the cycle. (This is why pulse waves aren't "actually" pulse waves... they're just really tight saw waves... ish...

)

MUX though, she don't care. You want 0 attack time? You get it (or close to it...) along with the cycle interruption that comes with that quick of an attack time. It's great for sound design, especially for things like a bass drum where you retrigger the oscillator via midi so the cycle never gets interrupted. But when you do things where you don't have total control over where the envelop hits the waveform (e.g free running oscillators) you are more than likely to have pops and clicks due to cycle interruption.

However on my patch my gate has rounded corners to intentionally avoid that. I don't get pops or clicks on my system while running it on its' own so i don't know why it's having trouble on other systems.

Dakkra

P.S I'm not saying the others are wrong, i'm just saying I do not believe it's the gate.

dakkra · Post by **dakkra** » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:02 pm

Actually now that i play with the patch again I do hear "a" clicking. But i think it's the filter LFO (because it's not round).

I'm putting this one out as a sound design flaw and not a MUX flaw. Somewhere in there I have a sharp envelope or lfo not playing nice.

Dakkra

MuTools

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MuLab 6.5.29 released