for those who think you need highly sophisticated soft/gear
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- KVRAF
- 2973 posts since 10 Sep, 2003 from Karlskoga, Stockholm, Sweden
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- KVRAF
- 3964 posts since 31 Aug, 2003 from In a foreign town, in a foreign land
Oh, I meant "you" [general], not "you" [you in particular].headquest wrote:You what? lost you there!tetraplan wrote:If they signed you, you would be fux0red.headquest wrote:If they signed you, I guess you'd caretetraplan wrote:Yes, but why would anyone care about EMI anyway?
EMI.
There is no reason why.
Groet, Erik
*cough*Mute*cough*
Groet, Erik
Don't do much pro performing these days though - I'm a writer (mostly educational music tutors - thousands sold accross UK, etc)
So gave up any pop star pretensions years ago, mate!
What I meant to say is: it is generally a bad thing for an independant artist to get signed by a major, especially a major major.
EMI bought Mute records last year, probably to get hold of Depeche Mode's back catalog. I wonder what will happen to Laibach, Ritchie Hawtin, Boyd Rice, Speedy J et al.
Groet, Erik
Pop music delenda est.
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- KVRAF
- 3964 posts since 31 Aug, 2003 from In a foreign town, in a foreign land
You did what in Kathmandu?spaceman wrote:tetraplan wrote:Sorry, you were saying?AndreasE wrote:That´s typical of those newbies like Sonar55 and EJo. They write a heap of craaaaaaaaaaaiiiiiiiiiiiiixxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxrrrrrrrrrrooooooeeeeeeeeekgkgkgkg
I'm slightly deaf after yesterday evening, Donna Summer's (1) set tortured my ears.
(1) no, that Donna Summer.
Groet, Erik
does this help
That´s typical of those newbies like Sonar55 and EJo. They write a heap of craaaaaaaaaaaiiiiiiiiiiiiixxxxxxxxx
xxxxxxxxrrrrrrrrrrooooooeeeeeeeeekgkgkgkg
Groet, Erik
Pop music delenda est.
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- KVRAF
- 13444 posts since 14 Nov, 2000 from Hannover / Germany
Let's just see what you need these days, to produce "chart compatible" music (even if I don't think there's a general rule, but hopefully you'll all know what I'm talking about, something boy/girl band a-like or whatever...).
And yes, I'm talking about he typically polished stuff for now (for anything experimental of whatever sorts you can get away with quite *something* else).
I'll try to follow the signal path here:
- A recording booth. Sometimes a properly isolated room (that usually serves for other purposes) could work as well, at least if we're not recording drums.
- A set of proper mics. A matched pair of Studioprojects C1s (or C3) should be fine, along with, say, an SM58 or 57.
- A proper input console. Again, if we're not recording drums, a pair of those dedicated channel strips should just be fine to match *any* quality (the SPL Channel One's for instance sound brilliant without costing a fortune, you can get top professional sounding vocal recordings out of them and they also make up for a pumping bass or a shimmering acoustic guitar).
- A fast computer being able to handle 24bit files, probably a lot of them (24bit recording makes things in the digital realm WAY more easy, defenitely worth the extra hit on performance and disk space in case you want "professional" results).
- A proper soundcard. Again, if we're not recording drums, a Stereo I/O one with digital ins (to feed the pre's straight into it) is sufficient.
Eventually one featuring some more outputs (in case you want to do surround stuff or feed external devices while mixing).
- A sequencer. Almost anything handling 24bit files with appropriate internal processing and VST support would be fine (so that's close to *any* sequencer out there).
- A good assortment of plugins. I doubt that you could get away completely using freeware here. There's still some difference in quality when you compare plugins such as Absynth or the likes to freebies (yes, flame on, but hopefully you'll know what I mean). A software sampler is a must IMO.
Same with some reverbs (remember, we're talking about "polished" here, not about what *we* may like).
A good general idea would be to either get a G5 and Logic Pro or some sequencer for PC and N.I.'s Komplete 2 package. Add to this something like PSPs MixPack and one or the other proper sample library (such as GPO, which seems to be just fine for the occasional string backing, if not more).
Eventually one might thing about some of those acceleration cards, such as the UAD or Powercore. There's some pretty good FX running exclusively on those.
- A pair of speakers. Most likely M-Audio's Studiophiles are fine (btw., best bang for the buck IMO) if you don't master yourself (but as you are producing "chat music", you won't!). If you got some more money, think Mackie or Genelec.
Obviously, the speakers should be placed in an acoustically uncritical environment (which might require to invest in some computer noise reduction).
- Some pairs of good headphones. HD25 might be nice for guitarists and such, singers often prefer half-closed ones so they still can listen to a bit of their voice outside the headphones.
Did I forget anything?
I don't see too much hardware in here... total cost of hardware used so far (without computer related stuff) might be around 5000 Euros (that's a rather high estimation, assuming you really want great quality in all parts of the signal chain).
As said, things will become quite different in case you're planning to record drums. Not that much of a problem to find some place you can hire temporarily (I'd have like 3-4 places instantly over here), but getting pretty much problematic once you need to record, say, a rockband which would record most of their basic tracks live.
In that case the hardware side of things is really getting expensive, no matter whether you hire things or do it by your own.
But then, most stuff you listen to in the radio doesn't feature live recorded rock bands, so for your "average smash hit" you may just get away fine with the "small recording booth, proper mics, good converters, stereo I/O" solution.
Whatever - as for the "hardware" dudes allways coming up with some rather heated, unbalanced and whatever comments: Yes, I do believe a lot is based on jealousy. As someone allready pointed out: Imagine you spent like 200.000 Euros (and that's not even a high mark) around 10 years ago, just to see that you can do the same today (at least from a producing/mixing point of view) for a fraction of the cost, without being paid enough yet to justify what you bought back then...
And yes, I'm talking about he typically polished stuff for now (for anything experimental of whatever sorts you can get away with quite *something* else).
I'll try to follow the signal path here:
- A recording booth. Sometimes a properly isolated room (that usually serves for other purposes) could work as well, at least if we're not recording drums.
- A set of proper mics. A matched pair of Studioprojects C1s (or C3) should be fine, along with, say, an SM58 or 57.
- A proper input console. Again, if we're not recording drums, a pair of those dedicated channel strips should just be fine to match *any* quality (the SPL Channel One's for instance sound brilliant without costing a fortune, you can get top professional sounding vocal recordings out of them and they also make up for a pumping bass or a shimmering acoustic guitar).
- A fast computer being able to handle 24bit files, probably a lot of them (24bit recording makes things in the digital realm WAY more easy, defenitely worth the extra hit on performance and disk space in case you want "professional" results).
- A proper soundcard. Again, if we're not recording drums, a Stereo I/O one with digital ins (to feed the pre's straight into it) is sufficient.
Eventually one featuring some more outputs (in case you want to do surround stuff or feed external devices while mixing).
- A sequencer. Almost anything handling 24bit files with appropriate internal processing and VST support would be fine (so that's close to *any* sequencer out there).
- A good assortment of plugins. I doubt that you could get away completely using freeware here. There's still some difference in quality when you compare plugins such as Absynth or the likes to freebies (yes, flame on, but hopefully you'll know what I mean). A software sampler is a must IMO.
Same with some reverbs (remember, we're talking about "polished" here, not about what *we* may like).
A good general idea would be to either get a G5 and Logic Pro or some sequencer for PC and N.I.'s Komplete 2 package. Add to this something like PSPs MixPack and one or the other proper sample library (such as GPO, which seems to be just fine for the occasional string backing, if not more).
Eventually one might thing about some of those acceleration cards, such as the UAD or Powercore. There's some pretty good FX running exclusively on those.
- A pair of speakers. Most likely M-Audio's Studiophiles are fine (btw., best bang for the buck IMO) if you don't master yourself (but as you are producing "chat music", you won't!). If you got some more money, think Mackie or Genelec.
Obviously, the speakers should be placed in an acoustically uncritical environment (which might require to invest in some computer noise reduction).
- Some pairs of good headphones. HD25 might be nice for guitarists and such, singers often prefer half-closed ones so they still can listen to a bit of their voice outside the headphones.
Did I forget anything?
I don't see too much hardware in here... total cost of hardware used so far (without computer related stuff) might be around 5000 Euros (that's a rather high estimation, assuming you really want great quality in all parts of the signal chain).
As said, things will become quite different in case you're planning to record drums. Not that much of a problem to find some place you can hire temporarily (I'd have like 3-4 places instantly over here), but getting pretty much problematic once you need to record, say, a rockband which would record most of their basic tracks live.
In that case the hardware side of things is really getting expensive, no matter whether you hire things or do it by your own.
But then, most stuff you listen to in the radio doesn't feature live recorded rock bands, so for your "average smash hit" you may just get away fine with the "small recording booth, proper mics, good converters, stereo I/O" solution.
Whatever - as for the "hardware" dudes allways coming up with some rather heated, unbalanced and whatever comments: Yes, I do believe a lot is based on jealousy. As someone allready pointed out: Imagine you spent like 200.000 Euros (and that's not even a high mark) around 10 years ago, just to see that you can do the same today (at least from a producing/mixing point of view) for a fraction of the cost, without being paid enough yet to justify what you bought back then...
Last edited by Sascha Franck on Fri Jul 23, 2004 10:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
There are 3 kinds of people:
Those who can do maths and those who can't.
Those who can do maths and those who can't.
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- KVRAF
- 3364 posts since 16 Feb, 2004 from atop a katamari
well i haven't spend millions on my equipment, but i think that i do have access to the things that would enable me to make a perfect record. i think it would be handy to have a better reverb and compressor and EQ... and obviously my mixing wouldn't be spot on without a better monitoring setup...
.. and i could do with a new mic if i ever wanted to record REAL vocals... and then a quality preamp...
but apart from that (and music CAN be made still with 'lesser' versions such as the ones that i have) the only step once i'd gotten to a full mix is to get it mastered, which can be done by a pro masterer and then it'd all be suh-weeet.
of course, that ain't gonna happen unless i'm 'the shizzle' and have some perfect ideas and get them to work. and that's what counts! it doesn't matter what you have really, if you are artistic enough to have the good ideas and clever enough to bring them to life then what more do you need (except maybe someone else to do the last few steps for you).
i really want to write some angry swear words at sonar's post, because he is a ___________.
.. and i could do with a new mic if i ever wanted to record REAL vocals... and then a quality preamp...
but apart from that (and music CAN be made still with 'lesser' versions such as the ones that i have) the only step once i'd gotten to a full mix is to get it mastered, which can be done by a pro masterer and then it'd all be suh-weeet.
of course, that ain't gonna happen unless i'm 'the shizzle' and have some perfect ideas and get them to work. and that's what counts! it doesn't matter what you have really, if you are artistic enough to have the good ideas and clever enough to bring them to life then what more do you need (except maybe someone else to do the last few steps for you).
i really want to write some angry swear words at sonar's post, because he is a ___________.
Kick, punch, it's all in the mind.
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- KVRAF
- 8700 posts since 9 Jan, 2004 from leroyaumeuni
Sascha Franck wrote:Let's just see what you need these days, to produce "chart compatible" music (even if I don't think there's a general rule, but hopefully you'll all know what I'm talking about, something boy/girl band a-like or whatever...).
And yes, I'm talking about he typically polished stuff for now (for anything experimental of whatever sorts you can get away with quite *something* else).
I'll try to follow the signal path here:
- A recording booth. Sometimes a properly isolated room (that usually serves for other purposes) could work as well, at least if we're not recording drums.
- A set of proper mics. A matched pair of Studioprojects C1s (or C3) should be fine, along with, say, an SM58 or 57.
- A proper input console. Again, if we're not recording drums, a pair of those dedicated channel strips should just be fine to match *any* quality (the SPL Channel One's for instance sound brilliant without costing a fortune, you can get top professional sounding vocal recordings out of them and they also make up for a pumping bass or a shimmering acoustic guitar).
- A fast computer being able to handle 24bit files, probably a lot of them (24bit recording makes things in the digital realm WAY more easy, defenitely worth the extra hit on performance and disk space in case you want "professional" results).
- A proper soundcard. Again, if we're not recording drums, a Stereo I/O one with digital ins (to feed the pre's straight into it) is sufficient.
Eventually one featuring some more outputs (in case you want to do surround stuff or feed external devices while mixing).
- A sequencer. Almost anything handling 24bit files with appropriate internal processing and VST support would be fine (so that's close to *any* sequencer out there).
- A good assortment of plugins. I doubt that you could get away completely using freeware here. There's still some difference in quality when you compare plugins such as Absynth or the likes to freebies (yes, flame on, but hopefully you'll know what I mean). A software sampler is a must IMO.
Same with some reverbs (remember, we're talking about "polished" here, not about what *we* may like).
A good general idea would be to either get a G5 and Logic Pro or some sequencer for PC and N.I.'s Komplete 2 package. Add to this something like PSPs MixPack and one or the other proper sample library (such as GPO, which seems to be just fine for the occasional string backing, if not more).
Eventually one might thing about some of those acceleration cards, such as the UAD or Powercore. There's some pretty good FX running exclusively on those.
- A pair of speakers. Most likely M-Audio's Studiophiles are fine (btw., best bang for the buck IMO) if you don't master yourself (but as you are producing "chat music", you won't!). If you got some more money, think Mackie or Genelec.
Obviously, the speakers should be placed in an acoustically uncritical environment (which might require to invest in some computer noise reduction).
- Some pairs or good headphones. HD25 might be nice for guitarists and such, singers often prefer half-closed ones so they still can listen to a bit of their voice outside the headphones.
Did I forget anything?
I don't see too much hardware in here... total cost of hardware used so far (without computer related stuff) might be around 5000 Euros (that's a rather high estimation, assuming you really want great quality in all parts of the signal chain).
As said, things will become quite different in case you're planning to record drums. Not that much of a problem to find some place you can hire temporarily (I'd have like 3-4 places instantly over here), but getting pretty much problematic once you need to record, say, a rockband which would record most of their basic tracks live.
In that case the hardware side of things is really getting expensive, no matter whether you hire things or do it by your own.
But then, most stuff you listen to in the radio doesn't feature live recorded rock bands, so for your "average smash hit" you may just get away fine with the "small recording booth, proper mics, good converters, stereo I/O" solution.
Whatever - as for the "hardware" dudes allways coming up with some rather heated, unbalanced and whatever comments: Yes, I do believe a lot is based on jealousy. As someone allready pointed out: Imagine you spent like 200.000 Euros (and that's not even a high mark) around 10 years ago, just to see that you can do the same today (at least from a producing/mixing point of view) for a fraction of the cost, without being paid enough yet to justify what you bought back then...
are you x_bruce in disguise?
My other host is Bruce Forsyth
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- KVRAF
- 2083 posts since 8 Apr, 2004
IMHO, I think this is the hardest (and potentially the most expensive) thing to get. If your lucky you might have a great room in your house that works straight awy. But if you haven't (and I haven't) then your buggered. Though for the most part a few stratigically placed duvets when recording have helped, but nothing beats a dedicated acoustically sound room.Sascha Franck wrote: - A recording booth. Sometimes a properly isolated room (that usually serves for other purposes) could work as well, at least if we're not recording drums.
Ben
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- KVRAF
- 13444 posts since 14 Nov, 2000 from Hannover / Germany
A) What would make you think so? (Obviously the answer is no)spaceman wrote: are you x_bruce in disguise?
B) Is quoting my entire, rather lengthy post, just to add a single line of reply, therfor wasting space some sort of "nomen est omen" strategy?
There are 3 kinds of people:
Those who can do maths and those who can't.
Those who can do maths and those who can't.
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- KVRAF
- 8700 posts since 9 Jan, 2004 from leroyaumeuni
because the post is very long, an x_bruce trademarkSascha Franck wrote:A) What would make you think so? (Obviously the answer is no)spaceman wrote: are you x_bruce in disguise?
hmmm no, I just hit the 'quote' button and there it was, in all his glory, your long post, ready to support my questionB) Is quoting my entire, rather lengthy post, just to add a single line of reply, therfor wasting space some sort of "nomen est omen" strategy?
My other host is Bruce Forsyth
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- KVRAF
- 7489 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
Lond, yes, but rather good, I thought. Very educational - well done young man!spaceman wrote:[hmmm no, I just hit the 'quote' button and there it was, in all his glory, your long post, ready to support my question
The teacher
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- KVRAF
- 7489 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
I'm sure you're right. EMI have always been obsessed with back catalogues (for obvious reasons...) and across all genres - classical, jazz + rock, etc - this is their main income.tetraplan wrote:[What I meant to say is: it is generally a bad thing for an independant artist to get signed by a major, especially a major major.
EMI bought Mute records last year, probably to get hold of Depeche Mode's back catalog. I wonder what will happen to Laibach, Ritchie Hawtin, Boyd Rice, Speedy J et al.
Groet, Erik
Everything else is a risk - oooo!
scary!-
- KVRAF
- 7489 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
Darn - the way these marketing types mislead us...spaceman wrote:he composed it in making waves yes, but they didn't mix/produce it in making wavesxg2 wrote:Or even Daniel Bedinfield - Making Waves.
I guess you can use a palm as well if it's just for composing
(have you ever tried Making Waves - anyone? - doesn't get much mention in these parts... I checked a demo once and thought "if Daniel Bedinfeld used this, I'm looking elsewhere te he
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- KVRAF
- 8700 posts since 9 Jan, 2004 from leroyaumeuni
headquest wrote: Darn - the way these marketing types mislead us...
(have you ever tried Making Waves - anyone? - doesn't get much mention in these parts... I checked a demo once and thought "if Daniel Bedinfeld used this, I'm looking elsewhere te he
I tried the demo once, wasn't my cup of tea (I prefer coffee) but I didn't give it enough time.. or maybe I did.. actually yeah.. bedingfield used it so it must be the dog's bollocks
My other host is Bruce Forsyth
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- KVRAF
- 25015 posts since 12 Jul, 2003 from West Caprazumia
Sonar55 wrote:ejo is actually very right u bedroom producers have no freaking clue about the music business and how it works thats why i feel so bad for all these fruity loops mix's and traktion producers and reason beatmakers...
all your dreams will be crushed if your ever put in a position for a label to aquire your songs im not talking about a record label that your friend started out of his garage or some local nonsense we will release your record anyday now label im talking about a real label....
if your making music as a hobby thats cool but if your serious about this craft stop with the loop making software its gonna bite u in your ass in the longrun
do you really think a mastering engineer who graduated from the audio arts is gonna spend weeks trying to fix your poor quality songs just cause the lead is nice or the bass is good???
imo dont ever use a sequencer that doesnt include some kind of import/export to protools if u use nuendo or logic your ok cause they support omf which is alot easier for the mastering engineer...
you guys think that internet downloads make a song great, you think cause some guy who made a song with reason then invested his own money to put in on vinyl gives u some kind of inspiration that u can do it also...if thats what u wanna do do it...
but if your serious about this craft start understanding what the difference between quality and quantity is....
and im not just talking out of my butt i was in the same situation i had decent songs in almost all of the cheap sequencers but when i finally got my foot in the real studio door all my tracks were scrapped due to nothing but poor quality...
get serious or else youll be 40 years old telling your friends u got a record coming out anyday now...
