Pitch bend question

[fluffy_little_something]

I stumbled upon something in Mixcraft that gets on my nerves when working with bass lines with lots of pitch bending: pitch bend data is not tied to the notes, so moving and copying note bars seems independent of the pitch bend data, which stays put wherever it was originally recorded. So I checked my old Mulab license and it is the same there. Wouldn't it make more sense to glue pitch bend data to notes just like velocity data?

[pljones]

You'll need to talk to the MIDI Manufacturers Association about that . Velocity is one of the three components of a MIDI Note event - it's inseparable. The Note event describes a pitch, too, but only one of 128 discrete values. Pitch bend tells whatever is responding to Note events on a channel how much to adjust each incoming event. As with all channel messages, it's down to the person sequencing the events to put the right controls in the right place.

As to editing time line data, I'd agree that selecting all events in a range and then moving them should move them all the same amount regardless of the event type. Are you sure you're selecting all event types? (I've no experience with MixCraft, just double-checking, really.)

[Reincke]

Wouldn't it make more sense to glue pitch bend data to notes just like velocity data?

Same wish here. Pitch bending makes basses so "analogue" .

But I remember copying notes within pitch bend data by selecting both data (order was signifficant!). Just one workaround. Another is to shift the data left/right on the timeline with the knobs down in the footer (have forgotten the name for this).
JR

[fluffy_little_something]

I can't seem to move such a pitch bend automation bump at all. I can select it, but I can't drag it around or anything.

The bend range goes from -100 to +100, but what unit is that? Percentage of the synth's set pitch bend range?
Since the set pitch bend range is obviously transmitted from the synth to the DAW, it might make sense for drawn pitch bend lines snap to semitones based on that information. And once a hand-drawn pitch bend line is there, it would be nice to be able to drag the starting and end points around. Basically like with graphical envelope generators of modern synths.

[Reincke]

The bend range goes from -100 to +100, but what unit is that? Percentage of the synth's set pitch bend range?

I think so. That's what I often do.

Since the set pitch bend range is obviously transmitted from the synth to the DAW...

..., it might make sense for drawn pitch bend lines snap to semitones based on that information. And once a hand-drawn pitch bend line is there, it would be nice to be able to drag the starting and end points around. Basically like with graphical envelope generators of modern synths.

You're talking about a (configurable) vertivcal grid for the event graph editor? Me too, me too!!! Should already be on the wish list. Alternatively you can use a separate automation track for pitch bends. But this is less comfortable because of the separate window.

I can't seem to move such a pitch bend automation bump at all. I can select it, but I can't drag it around or anything.

Have you tried the arrow buttons in the event propery panel, at the left to the key display? They affects the selected events, depending on the horizontal grid. It works on pitch bend events too.
JR

[fluffy_little_something]

Ah, the arrows work

Regarding your ???, what I meant is that when the synth tells the DAW that its bend range is set to, say, 4 notes, the DAW could automatically make drawn lines snap to 25, 50, 75, or 100%.

[MuTools]

Indeed pitch bend values are expressed as percent. That's relative to the target synth's picth bend range, of which MuLab is not aware. It could event be multiple synths with different pitch bend ranges.
Note that you can also do pitch bend automation using envelope parts. That way you can set the vertical grid to eg 5 values, which will result in 0% 25% 50% 75% and 100%. Then you can also use the curve slopes to shape the pitch bend.

[Reincke]

Regarding your ???, what I meant is that when the synth tells the DAW that its bend range is set to, say, 4 notes, ...

But imho MuLab doesn' get information from a synth (let's assume a VSTi) regarding the bend range, does it? (You wrote "obviously".) Is this also part of your FR?
JR

[MuTools]

But imho MuLab doesn' get information from a synth (let's assume a VSTi) regarding the bend range, does it?

No it indeed does not. That's also why pitch bend values are expressed as percent values.

[pljones]

MIDI has extended events that can tell a synth over what range to apply pitch bend. In "Standard MIDI", it's 1200 cents up or down, IIRC - with 100 cents being a semitone (again IIRC). See something like this for how setting pitch bend range works in MIDI terms. You may find VSTis that respond to the request... or not. (Note that many hardware controllers only send 128 discrete pitchbend values despite there being 128*128 of them in the spec - they just either send zero for the low order byte or repeat the high order byte, so you only get 64 steps up or down. Also note MuLab's 0-100% allows for higher resolution than the 14bit range MIDI Spec asks for.)

There's no way at all to know how a VSTi interprets a MIDI Note event beyond audio analysis of the resultant audio signal after it's left the VSTi - the host cannot even know if the VSTi produces any signal at all (so long as its outputting samples): it could just flash lights on a lighting rig, for all the host knows.

[fluffy_little_something]

In Mixcraft the values go from 0 to 8192 in both directions.

Anyway, the whole pitch bend implementation in Midi seems pretty basic and disappointing.

[pljones]

MIDI is pretty basic and disappointing, if you're thinking 2015. If you're thinking 1983, it's a bit more interesting.

You might want to think about Open Sound Control if you're after something more up to date (well, 1997... nearly 21st century... sort of).