All new guis are sucking valuable resources

[pdxindy]

...

[exmatproton]

Btw... with all the things people say here. It would be helpful if we could distinguish "gui opening time" vs. "CPU consumption" once the UI is opened. That is, you need to be more specific. Just saying "it's too heavy" doesn't mean much to us.

One also has to factor "plug-in loading time in", which in our case should be shorter (!) than those who have their resources embedded into the plug-in binary. Furthermore, our UIs are optimized for updating only as much as necessary. Dragging a UI may be more taxing in our case while the steady UI with a bit of mousing around may be totally fine.

Listen, i am not complaining. I just notice differences. And the UI of FL Studio (12.+) is smooth as silk. CPU's these days are stronger and faster then ever. But still, if something can be rendered using the GPU, i am all for that.

The interfaces of U-He plugins look really awesome and indeed, when stationary, they run just a fine as every other plugin i own. But still, the performance is just going down when dragging or opening an U-He plugin. Even Reaktor (5.+, using 6 a.t.m.) isn't that slow, in many cases. I don't think U-He plugins are too heavy. But they seem heavier then most other plugins i own.

[scintillator]

Hi, I did some tests.

Biggest problems are in FLStudio, when moving Hive's UI around I get CPU spikes of 8-12%* and heavy visual glitches, really not nice-looking ones. In other hosts - no big spikes, much less visual glitches, not nice but bearable.

This on a Thinkpad W520, i7 2760QM, 8 GB RAM, Intel HD Graphics 3000. Windows 7 32-bit. All software 32-bit.

___
* Measured with Process Explorer. The processor is quad core with 4 real and 4 virtual cores. So that's about one full core for moving Hive around.


I'm not getting such issues with most other synths I know/have installed. Image-Line synths especially have ultra-smooth response, even with their complex envelopes, out of Fruity, etc.

[exmatproton]

Hi, I did some tests.

Biggest problems are in FLStudio, when moving Hive's UI around I get CPU spikes of 8-12%* and heavy visual glitches, really not nice-looking ones. In other hosts - no big spikes, much less visual glitches, not nice but bearable.

This on a Thinkpad W520, i7 2760QM, 8 GB RAM, Intel HD Graphics 3000. Windows 7 32-bit. All software 32-bit.

___
* Measured with Process Explorer. The processor is quad core with 4 real and 4 virtual cores. So that's about one full core for moving Hive around.


I'm not getting such issues with most other synths I know/have installed. Image-Line synths especially have ultra-smooth response, even with their complex envelopes, out of Fruity, etc.

Same here. I guess it is because of the wrapper. I also use Reaper, Sonar and Renoise and those DAW's don't use wrappers (when 32bit is using 32 bit plugins and 64 bit is using 64 bit plugins). Performance is better in those DAW's. However, for me, the FL Studio interface itself is running the smoothest by far, compared to those other DAW's. I guess it boils down to what one wants, in terms of performance. I like a smooth DAW with good working (stationary) plugins. So there is no real issue for me in my practical usage.

But in this set-up, U-He plugins are heavy.

[scintillator]

Yes, FLStudio is ultra smooth here. But you just have to move UIs around, there's no avoiding it. What I'm getting with u-he synths, those that I've tested, leaves me thinking that this is not how it should be, something really has to change.

Earlier this year, I briefly tested Hive (when it just got out) on a much lower specced laptop, a Dell Latitude E5500 - admittedly not up to modern standards. The computer was just struggling and NOT being able to handle it. Was I doing anything much? No, just moving the ModWheel up and down brought it to its knees. On the same laptop, Sylenth1 was giving me zero problems, with many UIs open, etc. And I thought: this is the Sylenth1 killer? No way Hose!!!

[camsr]

Listen, i am not complaining. I just notice differences. And the UI of FL Studio (12.+) is smooth as silk. CPU's these days are stronger and faster then ever. But still, if something can be rendered using the GPU, i am all for that.

If the DAW is using hardware acceleration, that's ok. If plugins use hardware acceleration, they encounter problems as the DAW has the most control over when something's rendered.

[omiroad]

No noticeable issues with Diva here, using FL Studio 12.1 with 8 GB RAM and internal graphics.

[ksandvik]

I have a feeling the performance hits with bitmaps/UI has to do with either a small VRAM on the GPU (cheap laptops) or a bottleneck with bitmap rendering via CPU-based GPU (cheap CPUs), or then a DAW that puts too much work on the main GUI thread where the UI should reside and the DAW or plugins (not u-he) renders on the main thread. Those are my three guesses just now. That or some silly performance bug in the DAW itself.

[rockbottom]

I'm still using Zebra 2.7.2.3898 plugged in a 2008 release of Logic 8 on an old 3.1 GHz i5 running OS X 10.6.8, and with its 22 threads, Logic swallows up to 4.6 % of 1 of the 4 cores;

when dragging Zebra's UI around the 27'' display, the ressource consumption will increase up to 6.4 % of 1 core: this represents a mere 0.45 % increase of consumption of the total ressources;

it does not cause any graphics/audio rendering glitch, and it is not noticeable in any way...

[scintillator]

Old u-he plugins are OK, they don't cause problems. Problems are with the newer synths - Diva, Bazille and Hive, AFAIKT. Also plugins from other companies - e.g. Largo, Serum, Abl Pro are some I've noticed drain too much.

My thinking is that if I can play high quality movies without visual glitches but a plugin causes glitches on the same system, it's the plugin's fault. Not graphics card's, not processor's, etc. That's why it was said in the beginning of this thread that newer UIs have gone overboard with the bling.

[stardustmedia]

I understand the OP's concern, somehow.

But before I hit any GUI-related performance or RAM issue, the CPU hits long time before, because those mentioned plugins (for instance running in god of all divas-mode) need a lot of performance.

Nevertheless if there is already an option for smaller GUI sizes and/or other skins, maybe resource light skin/GUI could be a very nice customer friendly option.

[exmatproton]

Old u-he plugins are OK, they don't cause problems. Problems are with the newer synths - Diva, Bazille and Hive, AFAIKT. Also plugins from other companies - e.g. Largo, Serum, Abl Pro are some I've noticed drain too much.

My thinking is that if I can play high quality movies without visual glitches but a plugin causes glitches on the same system, it's the plugin's fault. Not graphics card's, not processor's, etc. That's why it was said in the beginning of this thread that newer UIs have gone overboard with the bling.

Don't forget the DAW. These plugins work without trouble in, for instance, Reaper over here. In FL Studio however, the interface is a tad slow, at times. So this could be plugin related, but also DAW related.

[Elektronisch]

Old u-he plugins are OK, they don't cause problems. Problems are with the newer synths - Diva, Bazille and Hive, AFAIKT. Also plugins from other companies - e.g. Largo, Serum, Abl Pro are some I've noticed drain too much.

My thinking is that if I can play high quality movies without visual glitches but a plugin causes glitches on the same system, it's the plugin's fault. Not graphics card's, not processor's, etc. That's why it was said in the beginning of this thread that newer UIs have gone overboard with the bling.

Don't forget the DAW. These plugins work without trouble in, for instance, Reaper over here. In FL Studio however, the interface is a tad slow, at times. So this could be plugin related, but also DAW related.

Indeed this happens in FL. Maybe its FL Studio problem?

[EvilDragon]

It so obviously looks like a FLS problem.

[omiroad]

It so obviously looks like a FLS problem.

No noticeable issues with Diva here, using FL Studio 12.1 with 8 GB RAM and internal graphics.

It's not obvious to me.